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Author Topic: Theological reasons against the flat-earth theory  (Read 13384 times)

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Re: Theological reasons against the flat-earth theory
« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2017, 11:12:45 AM »
To describe the ball of the Child of Prague as a sphere of creation, a symbol of a flat-earth, just about illustrates the lengths the flatearthers will go to have their way. Add to that the dome of the earth Our Lady was standing on was really a flat-earth is another bit of theological nonsense.

As you should know well, only if ALL the Fathers agree on an interpretation of Scripture can it NOT be challenged. The Galileo case, which your referenced site uses as a theological argument for flat-earthism, I reject absolutely. Not once was a flat earth brought up by either the philosophers or theologians in the Galileo affair. All presumed that the earth is a globe at the time, and Pythagorism was only in the context of a moving sun and the earth immobile at the centre of the universe.

So what if many of the Fathers held to a flat earth, this confirms nothing but that they were wrong.
Many Church Fathers and scripture take a lot of time describing creation explaining the heavens are vaulted and hell is a pit, that there are no antipodes, people living opposite of each other; and that Jerusalem is at the center of the world.  Beyond that, no one is certain exactly the shape of the world. That up is up, is beyond question in the flat earth model.  That up is up on a ball is a contradiction.  Up is above, not "out there" or "down there" as it would have to be on a ball.  Above on a ball is sometimes up, sometimes down, depending on where you are. Such an excellent foundation for relativity and relativism employed so easily these days one has to wonder how such deception has taken foothold in society, unless of course, the very world they believe in supports it.  Catholic teachings are incompatible with a globe.  The firmament is incompatible with a globe.  There is no such thing as space. Rockets never went outside the firmament.  How can oxygen starved engines operate in so-called space?  How does a vacuum exist without being contained?  
How did Christ rise on a globe?   Which way did Christ rise that doesn't contradict itself? Which way is up on a globe? Science that even a child can understand proves beyond any reasonable doubt that water cannot stick to a ball, let alone curve across its surface when at rest.  Ships do not disappear behind a curve when they sail out to sea, the number one proof round earthers once used but was handily destroyed with greater access to cameras and telescopes.   Planes do not adjust for a curve as they fly, but fly level using instruments that are incapable of adjusting for arc because they work exclusively by keeping the plane level.  Lighthouses, astrolabes, bubble levels and literally dozens of instruments can only work on a flat surface.
The only reason flat earth was not brought up by the geocentrists in the Galileo case is because flat earth comes prepackaged with geocentrism and has always been included.  The discussion in the Galileo Affair was about which model was true.  There are only two systems, heliocentric and geocentric, and the Church condemned heliocentrism.  Cosmas used scripture in literally dozens of ways proving earth is not a sphere.  How odd that the contention today happens to be with globalist pagans using the heliocentric model to enslave the masses with their lies, flinging human beings through space on a ball.  Smh.  The pagan mouthpiece of heliocentrism, NASA, has been caught with their hand in the cgi cookie jar by faking moon landings, painting globes, rendering cgi planets and suspending people in the air via green screens in the fake ssi while stealing billions, but lets believe them anyway!  The entire modern science world is as dirty and convoluted as apostate bishops of the Catholic Church, full of lies and half truths that lead people to believe in a pagan model of their world recreated in Satan's image that makes it possible for the antiChrist to take his seat.

Both scripture and prophecy have warned us that there are false sciences, so there is no question that this subject matters. I wonder which one is false? Heliocentrism or geocentrism?  Round earth or flat earth?
St. Nilus: ...the impious one!...will so complete science with vanity that it will go off the right path and lead people to lose faith in the existence of God in three hypostases.

With the crisis in the Church and the great apostasy proving that we are in the evil times spoken of by St. Nilus, and with the world accepting heliocentrism, literally pounding it down our throats, it is fair to say we know who's lying.  Mankind wholesale purchased false science warned about in scripture because they abandoned God's Word and His Church: 1 Timothy 6:20 20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called.
Your theory rests on a literal hatred for flat earth and the notion that pagan science has to be truthful on one issue: that earth is a globe.  Ha. Good luck with that.  Everything you believe about globe earth is based in the hopes that the Fathers of the Church were wrong, prophecy is wrong, simple understanding is wrong, math is wrong, empirical science is wrong, history is wrong, and that modern pagan scientists who long held heliocentrism are somehow right because they and their pagan predecessors couldn't possibly tell a lie.  Unhappy hope.  

Re: Theological reasons against the flat-earth theory
« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2017, 05:16:08 PM »
I think we have all heard of 'Faith and reason' or 'Faith and science (scientia).' Our Catholic faith claims that because it is truth, it will comply with all known and unknown scientia.

'Scientia' by the way is knowledge. It comprises knowledge acquired through the senses, knowledge acquired through the empirical or inductive method, knowledge acquired through philosophy, the search through reason alone, and finally through theology.
Unless all four are compatible, or not contradicted in any of the four conditions, then the truth is not present.

Flat-earthism does not comply with all four conditions of scientia. It denies the empirical science of geodesy, earth measurement on a large scale. This science, which can measure the curvature of the earth, has been practiced since the 17th century and fully accepted as such by both Church and state. Such is the size of the earth that this curvature can only be measured over long distances, thousands of miles. Flat earthers use this fact to argue there is no curvature detectable, using short distance photos for their purpose.

Flat-earthism denies the evidence of the senses, what we see. Leaving apart the fact that every other body created by God is a globe of some sort, lending reason (philosophy) that our earth is also a globe, with gravity measured and changing according to the different positions on global earth, which would not be the case if the earth is flat, flat-earthism denies the curvatures seen in photographs of the earth taken from space. This denial depends on thousands of people involved in space flight all supposedly conspiring to keep the biggest secret known to man a secret, not one of them breaking ranks to expose the supposed conspiracy. Next they will tell us there are no satellites up there at all.

Anyway, my point on this thread is that to claim Catholic theology can be in agreement with such denials and asserted frauds is to put Catholic theology in the same class as cօռspιʀαcιҽs or doubts, used to undermine the truth acquired through scientia.
Global earth, on the other hand, is totally in keeping with all four conditions of scientia, no compromises or denials necessary in any of the four conditions, and that includes the globe of the Child of Prague and the Miraculous medal, both images that have been backed up with miracles of different kinds.



Mr. Cassini,
You throw around a lot of big words, but it is mostly hot air.
Geodesy, if it based on the assumption that the earth is a ball, cannot be approved by the Church, for the simple reason that science tells us that it is not a ball. Our senses cannot contradiction themselves.
I can see that you are finding it difficult to let go of Geo-centrism, probably because you have invested a lot in it. Prayer and humility will help with that.
We can't have long range photos because of perspective, not curvature. It is sufficient to show that the earth is not 46k km in circuмference, which our "short range" photos prove beyond a doubt. That should be enough for you to let go of this ball earth theory.


http://flatearthtrads.forumga.net/f9-flat-earth-proofs



and perspective:




Re: Theological reasons against the flat-earth theory
« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2017, 06:02:12 PM »
That perspective argument always makes me laugh. It requires light to curve at sharp angles and an arbitrary distance away from the viewer, and to turn at a different place if the viewer walks forward or backwards. It also turns at a different distance depending on who is seeing it. Pretty impressive stuff to be honest.

Re: Theological reasons against the flat-earth theory
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2017, 12:14:32 PM »


Mr. Cassini,
You throw around a lot of big words, but it is mostly hot air.
Geodesy, if it based on the assumption that the earth is a ball, cannot be approved by the Church, for the simple reason that science tells us that it is not a ball. Our senses cannot contradiction themselves.
I can see that you are finding it difficult to let go of Geo-centrism, probably because you have invested a lot in it. Prayer and humility will help with that.
We can't have long range photos because of perspective, not curvature. It is sufficient to show that the earth is not 46k km in circuмference, which our "short range" photos prove beyond a doubt. That should be enough for you to let go of this ball earth theory.





deutschcath, would you mind if we keep this thread confined to the 'theological' aspect of flatearthism? There are enough threads to post pictures and videos of opticla difficulties and illusions without throwing them into this thread.

Now let us read another little bit of 'hot air.'

It comes from; ‘The Mystical City of God’ or ‘The Divine History and Life of the Virgin Mother of God, the private revelations from heaven to Sister Mary of Jesus, better known as Mary of Agreda (1602-1665). The following insights, dictated to her, she said, by the Virgin Mary herself in 1637, a mere four years after Galileo’s trial wherein the formal heresy of a fixed sun was condemned by popes of the Holy Roman Catholic Church. 

I post here one relevant paragraph.

‘Of the first day Moses says that “In the beginning God created heaven and earth.” And before creating intellectual and rational creatures, desiring also the order of executing these works to be most perfect, He created heaven for angels and men; and the earth as a place of pilgrimage for mortals. These places are so adapted to their end and so perfect that as David says of them, the heavens publish the glory of the Lord, the firmament and the earth announce the glory of the work of his hands (Ps.18, 2). The heavens in their beauty manifest His magnificence and glory, because in them is deposited the predestined reward of the just. And the earthly firmament announced that there would be creatures and man to inhabit the earth and that man should journey upon it to their Creator. Of the earth Moses says that it was void, which he does not say of the heavens, for God had created the angels at the instant indicated by the word of Moses: “God said: Let there be light, and light was made.” He speaks here not only of material light, but also of the intellectual or angelic lights…. God created the earth co-jointly with the heavens in order to call into existence hell in its centre; for, at the instant of its creation, there were left in the interior of that globe, spacious and wide cavities, suitable for hell, purgatory and limbo. And in hell was created at the same time material fire and other requisites, which now serve for the punishment of the damned.


Re: Theological reasons against the flat-earth theory
« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2017, 12:50:47 PM »
Many Church Fathers and scripture take a lot of time describing creation explaining the heavens are vaulted and hell is a pit, that there are no antipodes, people living opposite of each other; and that Jerusalem is at the center of the world.  Beyond that, no one is certain exactly the shape of the world. That up is up, is beyond question in the flat earth model.  That up is up on a ball is a contradiction.  Up is above, not "out there" or "down there" as it would have to be on a ball.  Above on a ball is sometimes up, sometimes down, depending on where you are. Such an excellent foundation for relativity and relativism employed so easily these days one has to wonder how such deception has taken foothold in society, unless of course, the very world they believe in supports it.  Catholic teachings are incompatible with a globe.  The firmament is incompatible with a globe.  There is no such thing as space. Rockets never went outside the firmament.  How can oxygen starved engines operate in so-called space?  How does a vacuum exist without being contained?  
How did Christ rise on a globe?   Which way did Christ rise that doesn't contradict itself? Which way is up on a globe? Science that even a child can understand proves beyond any reasonable doubt that water cannot stick to a ball, let alone curve across its surface when at rest.  


What's Up you ask Happenby. Well Solange Hertz told us here:

http://www.ldolphin.org/geocentricity/Hertz.pdf 

What's up is as relevant to the global earth as a flat earth. Take the global moon and planets for example. Why don't rocks or dust fall off the underside of it? The answer of course is GRAVITY.

Understanding Gravity: From the Latin gravitás, meaning heavy.

For great is the power of God alone, and he is honoured by the humble. Seek not the things that are too high for thee, and search not into things above thy ability: but the things that God hath commanded thee, think on them always, and in many of his works be not curious. For it is not necessary for thee to see with thy eyes those things that are hid. In unnecessary matters be not over curious, and in many of his works thou shalt not be inquisitive. For many things are shewn to thee above the understanding of men. And the suspicion of them hath deceived man, and hath detained their minds in vanity.” (Ecclus 3:21-26).

It is gravity that allows all on global earth to have the earth under us and the sky above. Christ rose up into the sky into heaven as witnessed by some of the Apostles. That is why all things stay fixed to earth all around the globe. So, all up is heaven, and all down is Hell, the furthest place from heaven.