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Poll

Where do you stand on Marriage Prenups and State Marriage Licenses?

I FAVOR a Catholic prenup and REFUSE a state marriage license.
2 (8.3%)
I REFUSE a Catholic Prenup and ACCEPT a state marriage license.
1 (4.2%)
I accept Catholic marriage vows and state laws as written (and pray I'm not divorced).
13 (54.2%)
I don't have a firm opinion on either one.
3 (12.5%)
I hope to get to Heaven by remaining single.
5 (20.8%)

Total Members Voted: 20

Voting closed: July 05, 2018, 07:43:47 PM

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Author Topic: Do you favor State Marriage Licenses & Prenuptual Agreements ?  (Read 24234 times)

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Offline MaterDominici

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Re: Do you favor State Marriage Licenses & Prenuptual Agreements ?
« Reply #110 on: June 25, 2018, 03:46:20 PM »
Quote from: Pax Vobis on June 25, 2018, 09:59:20 AM
 you're hurting your argument and your integrity by being extreme.
Of course he is. He could have left the extremist positions out of the conversation, but you can tell he's not capable at this point as he can't even curb the name-calling. The problem is that the legal system favors mothers in cases of divorce and, while I don't think the concept is inherently a bad thing (the fairer sex and all), the system is excessive and abused. No one disagrees with the need to have a "fix" so that this abuse cannot happen. If the conversation would stay there and skip all of the broad generalizations about women, we could have reached some conclusions in a few pages rather than a dozen different threads on the same topic.
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There's a CathInfo member who has first-hand experience with his wife taking their 10+ children, moving in with another man, leaving the Faith, and sending him the bill for raising his kids outside the Faith. It does happen, but "Pastor Dowell" speaks as if it's a certainty and his extremism is nonsense.
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Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: Do you favor State Marriage Licenses & Prenuptual Agreements ?
« Reply #111 on: June 25, 2018, 03:53:53 PM »
Quote
but "Pastor Dowell" speaks as if it's a certainty
Well, in the non-catholic world, divorce is not a certainty but it's well nigh close to it.  So, is Mr Dowell being extreme?  Based on his statistics, no.  Is Croix incorrectly applying non-catholic divorce rates to the Trad world?  Probably.  But what is the divorce rate for baby boomers - like 50%?  Who's to say that the Millenial generation won't be higher?  According to my experience the % of trad millenials who become atheists is pretty high.  Also the # of trad millenials who leave tradition and accept the indult/novus ordo is VERY high.  So, will they accept "catholic divorce" (which involves the courts) since new rome promotes this?  Why not?  It stands to reason that the divorce/"annulment" rate among Trads may INCREASE in the newest generation.  So maybe Croix's fears are not unfounded, since his potential marriage partners are millenials...

Anyway, the discussion about statistics, and the divorce rate is irrelevant.  Even if we could prove that the Trad divorce rate is only 5%, i'd still argue that the court system is rigged and since anyone can fall from grace and be tempted to divorce, then the need for a prenup still exists.
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Offline MaterDominici

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Re: Do you favor State Marriage Licenses & Prenuptual Agreements ?
« Reply #112 on: June 25, 2018, 04:02:52 PM »
Quote from: Pax Vobis on June 25, 2018, 03:53:53 PM
Well, in the non-catholic world, divorce is not a certainty but it's well nigh close to it.  So, is Mr Dowell being extreme?  Based on his statistics, no.  Is Croix incorrectly applying non-catholic divorce rates to the Trad world?  Probably.  But what is the divorce rate for baby boomers - like 50%?  Who's to say that the Millenial generation won't be higher?
Anyway, the discussion about statistics, and the divorce rate is irrelevant.  
Personally, I expected many more of my worldly acquaintances to have been divorced by now, but it hasn't happened. The rate in my circle is only about 15%, even among the baby boomers. So, no, I don't think divorce is a certainty even among the population at large. Add any form of Christianity, and your chances improve even more. So, posting these extreme videos is not going to aid the discussion, it's only going to rile up those who disagree with HIM even if they agree with YOU.
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Even if we could prove that the Trad divorce rate is only 5%, i'd still argue that the court system is rigged and since anyone can fall from grace and be tempted to divorce, then the need for a prenup still exists.
I agree.
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Offline SusanneT

Re: Do you favor State Marriage Licenses & Prenuptual Agreements ?
« Reply #113 on: June 25, 2018, 06:00:34 PM »
Divorce like abortion should be regarded as unthinkable and should be forbidden by law. 
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Offline Croix de Fer

Re: Do you favor State Marriage Licenses & Prenuptual Agreements ?
« Reply #114 on: June 25, 2018, 07:19:24 PM »
Quote from: MaterDominici on June 25, 2018, 03:46:20 PM
There's a CathInfo member who has first-hand experience with his wife taking their 10+ children, moving in with another man, leaving the Faith, and sending him the bill for raising his kids outside the Faith. It does happen, but "Pastor Dowell" speaks as if it's a certainty and his extremism is nonsense.
No, he doesn't. He speaks the statistical truth that there is a higher probability of "divorce" than a couple honoring and living out their marriage in these latter days. Trad Catholics, who think they're immune to the problem and dismiss taking precautions in the form of a prenup, suffer delusion, and they're guilty of hubris and self-righteousness. In times of deception, people who act prudently and speak the truth are called "extremists".
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