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Author Topic: Chrysostom on finding a wife...  (Read 9464 times)

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Änσnymσus

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Chrysostom on finding a wife...
« on: December 18, 2025, 05:25:51 PM »
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  • https://greekdownloads3.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/quales-ducendae-sint-uxores.pdf




    On the Kind of Women Who Ought to be Taken as Wives


    1. That I was absent from you in the previous assembly, I grieved; but that you enjoyed a richer table, I rejoiced. I grieved because of my affection for you, but I was glad because of the excellence of the speaker. For such is the nature of love: it desires to be present, yet it prefers the benefit of those loved.My absence was not due to negligence, but to a necessity of health; yet my mind was with you.

    Just as a physician, even when not present, inquires about the wounds of his patients, I also return to see how you have fared. Today, I wish to address the matter of marriage—not to condemn marriage, for "marriage is honorable and the bed undefiled," but to correct those who use it poorly. Many men today do not seek a partner for life, but a business transaction. They look for gold, for land, and for nobility of ancestors, while the character of the woman is the last thing they consider.


    2. Why do you seek a rich wife? Tell me. Is it so that you may live in luxury? But a rich wife often brings with her a spirit of pride and a tongue that is sharper than a sword. She does not come to you as a helper, but as a mistress. She looks upon you not as her husband, but as her servant, because she brought the wealth. Do you wish to buy your own slavery?


    When a man takes a wife who is much wealthier than himself, he loses his own authority in the house. He cannot rebuke her, he cannot guide her, for she immediately throws her dowry in his face. "I brought you this house," she says, "I brought you these servants, I brought you this silver." In seeking to be rich, you have lost the freedom of your own home.Is it not better to have a modest wife and peace, than a rich wife and a daily war?
    3. And what of nobility? You say, "She is of a great family." But what is nobility to us? In the Church, nobility is not found in the blood of ancestors, but in the virtue of the soul. If she is the daughter of a consul but is foul-tempered, she is ignoble. If she is the daughter of a common laborer but is God-fearing, she is more noble than any queen.


    Do not look to the tombs of her fathers, but to the disposition of her heart. For when you are in the house together, it is not her ancestors who will comfort you in your sorrow, but her own kindness. It is not her family's rank that will manage your home, but her own wisdom.


    4. Then there is the matter of physical beauty.[ This is the greatest deception of all. Beauty of the face is a fleeting thing; it is at the mercy of time, of disease, and of the elements. A single fever can wither it; the passing of years will surely erase it. If you love your wife only because she is beautiful to the eye, what will you do when that beauty is gone? Will your love vanish with her youth?


    Seek instead the beauty of the soul. A woman who is virtuous, even if she is not fair of face, becomes beautiful to her husband because of her goodness. But a woman who is physically beautiful but lacks virtue is like a golden ring in a pig's snout. Her outward appearance only makes her internal ugliness more visible. The beauty of the soul never grows old; it flourishes in old age and remains even after death.


    5. God created woman to be a "helper." But what kind of help did He mean? He divided our life into two parts: public and private. To the man, He gave the business of the marketplace, the courts of justice, the defense of the city, and the labor of the field. To the woman, He gave the management of the household, the nurturing of children, and the creation of a refuge for her husband.


    Neither should despise the work of the other.For a man can spend all day in the marketplace, but if he returns to a house that is in disorder and a wife who is contentious, his labor is in vain. And a woman can manage a home perfectly, but if the husband does not provide, the home cannot stand. God made us to need one another, so that through our mutual need, we might be bound together in love.


    6. Therefore, when you are choosing a wife, do not ask the matchmakers about her money. Ask instead: "Is she modest? Does she know how to remain at home? Is she a woman of prayer? Does she treat her servants with kindness? Is she disciplined in her speech?" If she has these things, she is richer than any woman with a mountain of gold.


    If you find a wife who fears God, you have found a port of peace. She will be a counselor to you in your difficulties, a source of strength in your poverty, and a teacher of virtue to your children. She will not demand pearls and expensive silks, for her ornament is a quiet and humble spirit.


    7. And I say this also to you, the husbands: If you want a virtuous wife, you must be a virtuous man. You cannot demand from her what you do not practice yourself. How can you expect her to be modest if you are at the theater looking at other women? How can you expect her to be quiet if you are loud and abusive?


    Marriage is a yoke. If the two oxen do not pull in the same direction, the plow will not move. Honor your wife, for she is your own body. As the Apostle says, "He who loves his wife loves himself." Treat her with the greatest reverence, for she is the partner of your life and the mother of your heirs.


    8. Let us then cast away these worldly standards. Let us not seek wealth that perishes, nor beauty that fades, nor nobility that is but a name. Let us seek the wealth of the soul and the beauty of virtue. If we build our marriages on this foundation, our homes will be like small churches, and the peace of God will dwell within them.

    Thus, we shall pass through this life with all freedom and security, and we shall be counted worthy of the kingdom of heaven, by the grace and love for man of our Lord Jesus Christ, to whom, with the Father and the Holy Spirit, be glory and power, now and always, and unto the ages of ages. Amen.



    -Translated by google.

    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #1 on: December 18, 2025, 05:56:53 PM »
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  • https://greekdownloads3.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/quales-ducendae-sint-uxores.pdf




    On the Kind of Women Who Ought to be Taken as Wives


    1. That I was absent from you in the previous assembly, I grieved; but that you enjoyed a richer table, I rejoiced. I grieved because of my affection for you, but I was glad because of the excellence of the speaker. For such is the nature of love: it desires to be present, yet it prefers the benefit of those loved.My absence was not due to negligence, but to a necessity of health; yet my mind was with you.

    Just as a physician, even when not present, inquires about the wounds of his patients, I also return to see how you have fared. Today, I wish to address the matter of marriage—not to condemn marriage, for "marriage is honorable and the bed undefiled," but to correct those who use it poorly. Many men today do not seek a partner for life, but a business transaction. They look for gold, for land, and for nobility of ancestors, while the character of the woman is the last thing they consider.


    2. Why do you seek a rich wife? Tell me. Is it so that you may live in luxury? But a rich wife often brings with her a spirit of pride and a tongue that is sharper than a sword. She does not come to you as a helper, but as a mistress. She looks upon you not as her husband, but as her servant, because she brought the wealth. Do you wish to buy your own slavery?


    When a man takes a wife who is much wealthier than himself, he loses his own authority in the house. He cannot rebuke her, he cannot guide her, for she immediately throws her dowry in his face. "I brought you this house," she says, "I brought you these servants, I brought you this silver." In seeking to be rich, you have lost the freedom of your own home.Is it not better to have a modest wife and peace, than a rich wife and a daily war?
    3. And what of nobility? You say, "She is of a great family." But what is nobility to us? In the Church, nobility is not found in the blood of ancestors, but in the virtue of the soul. If she is the daughter of a consul but is foul-tempered, she is ignoble. If she is the daughter of a common laborer but is God-fearing, she is more noble than any queen.


    Do not look to the tombs of her fathers, but to the disposition of her heart. For when you are in the house together, it is not her ancestors who will comfort you in your sorrow, but her own kindness. It is not her family's rank that will manage your home, but her own wisdom.


    4. Then there is the matter of physical beauty.[ This is the greatest deception of all. Beauty of the face is a fleeting thing; it is at the mercy of time, of disease, and of the elements. A single fever can wither it; the passing of years will surely erase it. If you love your wife only because she is beautiful to the eye, what will you do when that beauty is gone? Will your love vanish with her youth?


    Seek instead the beauty of the soul. A woman who is virtuous, even if she is not fair of face, becomes beautiful to her husband because of her goodness. But a woman who is physically beautiful but lacks virtue is like a golden ring in a pig's snout. Her outward appearance only makes her internal ugliness more visible. The beauty of the soul never grows old; it flourishes in old age and remains even after death.


    5. God created woman to be a "helper." But what kind of help did He mean? He divided our life into two parts: public and private. To the man, He gave the business of the marketplace, the courts of justice, the defense of the city, and the labor of the field. To the woman, He gave the management of the household, the nurturing of children, and the creation of a refuge for her husband.


    Neither should despise the work of the other.For a man can spend all day in the marketplace, but if he returns to a house that is in disorder and a wife who is contentious, his labor is in vain. And a woman can manage a home perfectly, but if the husband does not provide, the home cannot stand. God made us to need one another, so that through our mutual need, we might be bound together in love.


    6. Therefore, when you are choosing a wife, do not ask the matchmakers about her money. Ask instead: "Is she modest? Does she know how to remain at home? Is she a woman of prayer? Does she treat her servants with kindness? Is she disciplined in her speech?" If she has these things, she is richer than any woman with a mountain of gold.


    If you find a wife who fears God, you have found a port of peace. She will be a counselor to you in your difficulties, a source of strength in your poverty, and a teacher of virtue to your children. She will not demand pearls and expensive silks, for her ornament is a quiet and humble spirit.


    7. And I say this also to you, the husbands: If you want a virtuous wife, you must be a virtuous man. You cannot demand from her what you do not practice yourself. How can you expect her to be modest if you are at the theater looking at other women? How can you expect her to be quiet if you are loud and abusive?


    Marriage is a yoke. If the two oxen do not pull in the same direction, the plow will not move. Honor your wife, for she is your own body. As the Apostle says, "He who loves his wife loves himself." Treat her with the greatest reverence, for she is the partner of your life and the mother of your heirs.


    8. Let us then cast away these worldly standards. Let us not seek wealth that perishes, nor beauty that fades, nor nobility that is but a name. Let us seek the wealth of the soul and the beauty of virtue. If we build our marriages on this foundation, our homes will be like small churches, and the peace of God will dwell within them.

    Thus, we shall pass through this life with all freedom and security, and we shall be counted worthy of the kingdom of heaven, by the grace and love for man of our Lord Jesus Christ, to whom, with the Father and the Holy Spirit, be glory and power, now and always, and unto the ages of ages. Amen.



    -Translated by google.
    Unfortunately most women aren't like that. I've met plenty of loud trad girls...


    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #2 on: December 18, 2025, 06:16:59 PM »
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  • So don't take them as wives.

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #3 on: December 18, 2025, 11:46:28 PM »
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  • Unfortunately most women aren't like that. I've met plenty of loud trad girls...
    Since this type of woman is all you seem to find, quit looking at the trad chapels. Don’t keep repeating your mistake and expecting a different result! Look elsewhere. In the meantime,  get on with your life. There are lots of things you can best do as a single man. Look into some unusual occupations and try out those that interest you. Many jobs require lots of travel, or work of a hazardous nature. If such a man has to leave his wife and children for long stretches of time, it’s not good. If you do a dangerous job, how many wives are willing to be dragged, kids and all, around the world? It’s time you explored some other options and just got on with it. If God sends a wife, fine. If He doesn’t, that should be fine, too!  

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #4 on: December 19, 2025, 09:40:42 AM »
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  • I can't understand this obsession with finding a wife.  Just work hard and make a ton of money and the ladies will find you.


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #5 on: December 19, 2025, 09:49:31 AM »
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  • I can't understand this obsession with finding a wife.  Just work hard and make a ton of money and the ladies will find you.

    Well, if you feel that you're called to marriage, I can see why you would be focused on this question ... though we have far too little information to judge that it's an "obsession", especially since this is in the Anonymous forum.

    I should think that the OP would be interested in finding a good Catholic wife, and not just any "ladies" who will swarm to money.  In fact, if I were wealthy, I would not reveal the full extent of it precisely in order to prevent this.  Even from a natural perspective, it leaves you wondering whether the woman actually loves you, is interested in your ... or was just interested in your money.  Not a few wealthy men end up with "prostitute" wives, where they just do what they must to keep the money coming in, but then see other men that they actually like on the side.

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #6 on: December 19, 2025, 10:44:58 AM »
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  • Well, if you feel that you're called to marriage, I can see why you would be focused on this question ... though we have far too little information to judge that it's an "obsession", especially since this is in the Anonymous forum.

    I should think that the OP would be interested in finding a good Catholic wife, and not just any "ladies" who will swarm to money.  In fact, if I were wealthy, I would not reveal the full extent of it precisely in order to prevent this.  Even from a natural perspective, it leaves you wondering whether the woman actually loves you, is interested in your ... or was just interested in your money.  Not a few wealthy men end up with "prostitute" wives, where they just do what they must to keep the money coming in, but then see other men that they actually like on the side.

    The #1 thing that causes a lady to not consider a man a serious marriage prospect is his inability to provide properly for a family.  This is not greed.  It's prudence. And no serious trad priest would ever advise a young woman to knowingly marry a man who has no career aspirations or lazy work ethic.  Serial GoFundMe's and panhandling on this forum is not a career.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #7 on: December 19, 2025, 11:17:29 AM »
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  • Quote
    Serial GoFundMe's and panhandling on this forum is not a career.


    Did I miss something? I haven't seen any gofundme links or anything that could be possibly interpreted as panhandling.
    Except for Ladislaus, everyone else in this thread has been Anonymous.
    And Ladislaus has zero public history of asking for anything, OR of being unemployed.

    Are you, by chance, on drugs?
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
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    My accounts (Paypal, Venmo) have been (((shut down))) PM me for how to donate and keep the forum going.


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #8 on: December 19, 2025, 12:18:00 PM »
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  • Did I miss something? I haven't seen any gofundme links or anything that could be possibly interpreted as panhandling.
    Except for Ladislaus, everyone else in this thread has been Anonymous.
    And Ladislaus has zero public history of asking for anything, OR of being unemployed.

    Are you, by chance, on drugs?

    I wonder if the individual just misspoke.  Yes, I set up a GiveAHand, but it was for Father Onuorah, the Resistance priest in Nigeria, and he got every dime of it ... though it did not amount to all that much, to be honest, and not only did I give Father more than what the GiveAHand took in, but I'm pretty sure that most of the donations came in by way of requests for Gregorian Masses.

    Nor, of course, and I "in the market", as it were, to find a wife ... so I don't think that comment was directed at me, but just some stream of consciousness.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #9 on: December 19, 2025, 12:49:10 PM »
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  • Did I miss something? I haven't seen any gofundme links or anything that could be possibly interpreted as panhandling.
    Except for Ladislaus, everyone else in this thread has been Anonymous.
    And Ladislaus has zero public history of asking for anything, OR of being unemployed.

    Are you, by chance, on drugs?

    What I do think, though, is that she took great exception to my prior comment, protesting far too much ... where I suspect the poster might resemble the remarks I made.  So many huge red flags in that post ... where I'm on the fence about whether I should point them out, on the one hand not wanting unnecessarily to cause offense, but on the other hand using it as a lesson to men who are actually looking for wives.  I haven't quite decided yet whether to respond.  I might find a way to do it obliquely, without quoting the post, but that would not be easy.

    So, let's just point out what I've found to be THE single most common logical fallacy out there preventing clear thinking ... the false dichotomy.  Where I said that a man should not flaunt his wealth in order to draw in a torrent of women, evidently I meant that a woman should not care at all about whether a man could provide financial security for the family, and just marry any man who has been flipping burgers for 10 years now.  That's a defensive overreaction if ever there was one ... causing alarms and red flags to go off (in addition to several points, word choices, language, and tone in that post).

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #10 on: January 07, 2026, 01:05:35 AM »
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  • Oh great Saint this is the average 'Catholic' women

    >34
    >"i'm a 8 out of 10"
    also catholicmatch is trash


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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #11 on: January 07, 2026, 01:13:13 AM »
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  • Oh great Saint this is the average 'Catholic' women

    >34
    >"i'm a 8 out of 10"
    also catholicmatch is trash

    another one

    >girl is 19
    >is "conventionally unattractive" (ugly)
    >men don't want me
    >older men are interested
    >ew not you
    :facepalm:



    I am not making these posts to attack these women just pointing out the obvious problem that is everywhere even in Catholic circles. Even this ugly girl has men who are interesting in marrying her but because she is brainwashed she doesn't want them. 

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #12 on: January 07, 2026, 01:16:39 AM »
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  • another one

    >girl is 19
    >is "conventionally unattractive" (ugly)
    >men don't want me
    >older men are interested
    >ew not you
    :facepalm:



    I am not making these posts to attack these women just pointing out the obvious problem that is everywhere even in Catholic circles. Even this ugly girl has men who are interesting in marrying her but because she is brainwashed she doesn't want them.
    "I don't mind going older but I'm afraid I won't have much in common with someone older than 25"

    Ok I slightly retract my statement, she didn't say the older men were interested but is still brainwashed with the nonsense of "nothing in common". This is a meme, men and women have children in common, they have the faith in common, it's really amazing how people believe this garbage propaganda.

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #13 on: January 07, 2026, 01:29:37 AM »
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  • This is actually so brutal, I feel bad for her.



    Ladies if you do not understand the issue with this women I will explain it to you, though I think the ALL the men on this forum can easily point it out.

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    Re: Chrysostom on finding a wife...
    « Reply #14 on: January 07, 2026, 03:32:36 AM »
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  • This is actually so brutal, I feel bad for her.



    Ladies if you do not understand the issue with this women I will explain it to you, though I think the ALL the men on this forum can easily point it out.

    It SOUNDS reasonable (it always does!) but when you think about it more than 30 seconds, it all unravels.

    1. "smart, handsome" -- she is looking for Chad who also happens to be a saint. How can she hope for a 10, when she is (objectively) a 3 or a 6? What awesome stuff does she bring to the table? She never mentioned anything about her skills, what she has to offer, etc. in her whole rant.
    "I went on two dates with two different guys who are nice but not my type." - huge red flag. Again, it seems that she is fishing outside her league.

    2. She blames her family for skipping over her -- that sure sounds mean and unfair. I'm sure there's another side to this story! Parents don't just treat one child like trash. I'm not buying it.

    3. She wants to find a guy "at the finish line" rather than picking out a man with *potential* and then growing with him through a long married life. Yes, a man isn't going to drastically change. But waiting at the finish line is the BS way of going about it.