I understand that many truth-seekers need to have thick skin these days, with the whole world (almost) against you.

However, that being said, sometimes it's TOO MUCH when fellow Trad Catholics start throwing the same mindless ad-hominems, vomiting the same talking points at you, as your ignorant non-Catholic co-workers and family members. I can understand why this leads to some occasional emotion and/or frustration!

It's one thing to have an opinion. But you don't have to consider your opponent bad-willed or stupid. Those aren't the only options. Especially a subject which is difficult to ascertain the truth about.

For those who dismiss Flat Earth as "way out there" or "crazy", what makes you so sure? Because "everyone" thinks that? How many times have you been to outer space? Have you gone up in a rocket and seen the "globe earth"? Have you ever observed "the curve" in ANY way? Somehow I doubt it. You're just vomiting what you were taught in public school. Even Protestant and Catholic schools have fallen for the lie, as the Globe Earth is the Big Lie that's dominated everyone for so long.

Why don't you give your brother in Christ the benefit of the doubt? There is PLENTY of reason to do so. Just for starters: which is more compatible with the devil's lies?

Imagine a puzzle:
On one side you have two index cards, Flat Earth and Globe Earth.

On the other side you have TWO OPPOSING CAMPS:
outer space/aliens/atheistic evolution/billions of years/earth is nothing special/transhumanism/possibility of true generalized AI/the Singularity/Climate Crisis

the Bible/the Firmament/Man was created in God's image, the only intelligent life in the physical realm/the Flood/Adam and Eve/personal Creation by God/Man can't destroy Earth; God will destroy Earth by fire at the end of the world

You tell me, with a straight face, which group Globe Earth belongs in -- and which one Flat Earth belongs in.

Until the Crisis in the Church, we didn't have a group of stubborn truth seekers willing to believe in the International J3w|sh conspiracy to dominate the world and bring about the NWO and Antichrist. Trads are jaded enough with governments and Church authorities to be willing to question things that were formerly never questioned. That is the crux of the matter.

Trads see the big picture. They know what it's like to be outnumbered but 100% in possession of the objective truth.

My point?

What I can't stand are logical fallacies.

THIS^^^.  When I get frustrated here, it's almost always due to logical fallacies.  And you listed the main ones for FE, ad hominems and petitio principii (begging the question) in particular.  There's also the argumentum ab auctoritate, argument from so-called "authority", which is related to bandwagon.  So the anti-FEs blend these 3/4 fallacies masterfully.

At the end of the day, I just want to know the truth, and if I saw evidence proving the earth was a globe, well, then I'd change my mind, and my life would go on largely unaffected.  But don't throw the fallacies at me.  To me, the fact that so many cling to the globe using fallacies also speaks to the fact that we've been brainwashed and mind-controlled and programmed into believing the earth is a globe, and it's hard for some people to let go.  We saw the globe on our kindergarten teacher's desk and our first science project was creating a solar system model with styrofoam balls.  Heck, many infant mobiles are ball-solar-system representations.  Then we see pictures of globes everywhere, and the movies are filled with space themes with the globe assumption.  Some FE put together a video interviewing Globe Earth believers on the street to present their best evidence for the globe ... if they couldn't use "NASA" as their evidence.  Of the 20 or so, a single person even made an attempt, and his proof was the one of boats appearing to disappear over the horizon.  That was it.

Traditional Catholics have believed the earth was a globe for nearly 2,000 years. Particularly since the age of discovery, when it actually became a relevant and practical question what the shape of the earth is, the traditional Catholics of those times constantly portrayed the earth as a globe, and have done so ever since. And using this portrayal they were able to navigate successfully to the smallest islands in the most remote parts of the earth.

Flat earth belief among traditional Catholics is a historical anomaly peculiar to only the last ten or twenty years. I had never heard of trads thinking the earth was flat as recently as a decade ago, and the movement has particularly grown in the last few years. Of the flat earthers on this forum, I suspect almost none of them believed the earth was flat ten years ago.

From a historical perspective, the idea is an intellectual fad. None of the Catholic kings, scholars, explorers, or conquistadors in the age of discovery or after ever thought the earth was anything but a globe. So I don't think it's accurate to lump globism in with evolution, old universe, aliens, or any other pagan error.

Satan is the father of lies. It seems he's been "loosed" for a while now. And he's a much older, much "smarter," much higher-ordered creature than us. Fooling us is easy...

I don't know if the earth is flat or not and I'm not uncomfortable holding the "I don't know" position.

I'm much closer to certainty on geocentrism.

The modern Tychos Model (Brahe's model with the updated caveat that the Sun & Mars [red dwarf] are a binary pair) aligns flawlessly with the observable, while the heliocentric models (with strange eliptical planetary orbits--except Mars with its highly irregular orbit) are full of logical leaps and verbose justifications/explinations.

How does this work with earth not moving and being the centre?

How does this work with earth not moving and being the centre?

The Earth does move in the geocentric Tychos model, just very slowly.

From this website: https://www.tychos.info/

"In the TYCHOS, Earth is located at / near the barycenter of our Sun-Mars binary duo; it rotates around its axis once daily and revolves at about 1 mph around its circular Polaris-Vega-Polaris (PVP) orbit once every 25344 solar years. Polaris and Vega are the two most notable Northern stars under which Earth transits in the course of its 25344-year journey, commonly-known as the “precession of the equinoxes"

The earth has mountains and hills, therefore it is not flat.

touché

People say it doesn't matter but consider how even the Baltimore Catechism now states that there could be alien beings on other planets. 

Plus we have Donald Trump's Space Farce gearing up to fight the fake alien invasion.  "May the Farce be with you"! 

Trump knows we never went to the moon just as all the other presidents know, including Nixon who faked a phone call from his White House rotary phone landline to the astronauts. 

The moon landing hoax has not aged well.  :P

The flat earth model is the only one with a firmament.  The firmament puts an end to all of the space alien nonsense.

Anyway, this 2min video shows how the horizon rises to eye level as you gain altitude.  On a ball earth the opposite would happen. 




It demonstrates in real life what this simulation shows:


A Simple Horizon Test Take 2

44seconds




I've asked ball earth believers to explain this and have never received a good answer.



When looking out the cockpit window on the tarmac or at 30,000 feet the horizon line is always at eye level.  That is only possible on a flat earth.

Those photos from weather balloons 20 miles up should have no horizon line at all.  It would have dropped away beneath you if you were over a ball.

People say it doesn't matter but consider how even the Baltimore Catechism now states that there could be alien beings on other planets. 

Right.  When I said that it wouldn't affect how I live my life, I was just speaking about myself (and about others who have the Catholic faith).

But it matters tremendously for the general public.

Let's just assume for a minute that the Earth is in fact flat, and has a firmament covering it.  It would be nearly impossible to persuade any thinking person that it all happened by chance and without an Intelligent Designer.  When you have swirling balls coalescing into spheres as the basis of your cosmology, combined with "gravity", you can try to explain it as just swirling motion that creates order out of the chaos.  Big Bang and all the other atheistic science nonsense absolutely requires a globe earth.  And that's precisely why they've engaged in hiding FE ... in addition to the alien agenda that they've been planning.

There are a couple of notable Flat Earthers who had been atheists but came to believe in God solely due to their having become convinced of the Flat Earth.  How many millions have lost their faith, or at least natural belief in God, which would put them closer to the faith, due to the modern "science" that a Father Paul Robinson extols as some kind of idol.  So, yes, it does matter.