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Author Topic: The Earth is Flat  (Read 27763 times)

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Offline Miser Peccator

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Re: The Earth is Flat
« Reply #225 on: October 21, 2023, 08:10:48 PM »
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  • I never ever trust an anti Catholic’s writings. He’s most likely reporting a falsehood in order to make the Church look bad in the eyes of modern man. Although I agree with him on GE, I would never trust him as a source.

    I understand that.  Is there some way to verify it?
    I exposed AB Vigano's public meetings with Crowleyan Satanist Dugin so I ask protection on myself family friends priest, under the Blood of Jesus Christ and mantle of the Blessed Virgin Mary! If harm comes to any of us may that embolden the faithful to speak out all the more so Catholics are not deceived.



    [fon

    Offline Tradman

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    Re: The Earth is Flat
    « Reply #226 on: October 21, 2023, 08:43:40 PM »
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  • I never ever trust an anti Catholic’s writings. He’s most likely reporting a falsehood in order to make the Church look bad in the eyes of modern man. Although I agree with him on GE, I would never trust him as a source.

    Well, it's well-known that the Church censored Copernicus' book until it was amended (line item censored in this case). Lactantius was a Father of the Church, so there's little doubt Catholic authorities who condemned Bruno, heliocentrism and Galileo would support Lactantius and the flat earth. There's no reason to not believe the author in this instance because the facts bear out. Also, when you're writing a book on famous history you really do have to source it correctly or find your book at the bottom of a Walmart bin. What I do find a little weird is that you suggest it might make the Church look bad. The only reason the Church would look bad is if She was wrong for condemning heliocentrism and censoring Copernicus' book for no reason. That's not possible because She doesn't make mistakes. She did condemn heliocentrism and not only censored Copernicus' book, She placed it on the Index of forbidden books. The real take away is how well the heliocentric conspirators covered all this up for so long. We're lucky to get to know what really happened. Flat earth is hardly a shameful thing, except to uninformed heliocentric globe believers who suffer from human respect. Catholic flat earthers are used to being denigrated and slandered. Getting the truth out there is the right thing to do no matter the cost. And while some of us are wearied by the endless potshots, besides the proof in science, math and reason, we also have proof from Catholic tradition that earth is not a globe.


    Offline Tradman

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    Re: The Earth is Flat
    « Reply #227 on: October 21, 2023, 09:05:07 PM »
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  • Here's some information on the censoring of Copernicus' book.  From what it says here, that author was telling the truth.  

    Perhaps the most influential opponent of the Copernican theory was , a Catholic priest. Ingoli wrote a January 1616 essay to Galileo presenting more than twenty arguments against the Copernican theory.[119] Though "it is not certain, it is probable that he [Ingoli] was commissioned by the Inquisition to write an expert opinion on the controversy",[120] (after the Congregation of the Index's decree against Copernicanism on 5 March 1616, Ingoli was officially appointed its consultant).[120] Galileo himself was of the opinion that the essay played an important role in the rejection of the theory by church authorities, writing in a later letter to Ingoli that he was concerned that people thought the theory was rejected because Ingoli was right.[119] Ingoli presented five physical arguments against the theory, thirteen mathematical arguments (plus a separate discussion of the sizes of stars), and four theological arguments. The physical and mathematical arguments were of uneven quality, but many of them came directly from the writings of Tycho Brahe, and Ingoli repeatedly cited Brahe, the leading astronomer of the era. These included arguments about the effect of a moving earth on the trajectory of projectiles, and about parallax and Brahe's argument that the Copernican theory required that stars be absurdly large.[121] Two of Ingoli's theological issues with the Copernican theory were "common Catholic beliefs not directly traceable to Scripture: the doctrine that hell is located at the center of Earth and is most distant from heaven; and the explicit assertion that Earth is motionless in a hymn sung on Tuesdays as part of the Liturgy of the Hours of the Divine Office prayers regularly recited by priests."[122] Ingoli cited Robert Bellarmine in regards to both of these arguments, and may have been trying to convey to Galileo a sense of Bellarmine's opinion.[123] Ingoli also cited Genesis 1:14 where God places "lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night." Ingoli did not think the central location of the sun in the Copernican theory was compatible with it being described as one of the lights placed in the firmament.[122] Like previous commentators Ingoli also pointed to the passages about the Battle of Gibeon. He dismissed arguments that they should be taken metaphorically, saying "Replies which assert that Scripture speaks according to our mode of understanding are not satisfactory: both because in explaining the Sacred Writings the rule is always to preserve the literal sense, when it is possible, as it is in this case; and also because all the [Church] Fathers unanimously take this passage to mean that the sun which was truly moving stopped at Joshua's request. An interpretation which is contrary to the unanimous consent of the Fathers is condemned by the Council of Trent, Session IV, in the decree on the edition and use of the Sacred Books. Furthermore, although the Council speaks about matters of faith and morals, nevertheless it cannot be denied that the Holy Fathers would be displeased with an interpretation of Sacred Scriptures which is contrary to their common agreement."[122] However, Ingoli closed the essay by suggesting Galileo respond primarily to the better of his physical and mathematical arguments rather than to his theological arguments, writing "Let it be your choice to respond to this either entirely of in part—clearly at least to the mathematical and physical arguments, and not to all even of these, but to the more weighty ones."[124] When Galileo wrote a letter in reply to Ingoli years later, he in fact only addressed the mathematical and physical arguments.[124]
    In March 1616, in connection with the Galileo affair, the Roman Catholic Church's Congregation of the Index issued a decree suspending De revolutionibus until it could be "corrected," on the grounds of ensuring that Copernicanism, which it described as a "false Pythagorean doctrine, altogether contrary to the Holy Scripture," would not "creep any further to the prejudice of Catholic truth."[125] The corrections consisted largely of removing or altering wording that the spoke of heliocentrism as a fact, rather than a hypothesis.[126] The corrections were made based largely on work by Ingoli.[120]

    https://everipedia.org/wiki/Francesco_Ingoli/



    Offline Tradman

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    Re: The Earth is Flat
    « Reply #228 on: October 21, 2023, 09:26:11 PM »
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  • Perhaps the most influential opponent of the Copernican theory was Catholic priest, Ingoli, who wrote a January 1616 essay to Galileo presenting more than twenty arguments against the Copernican theory. Though it is not certain, it is probable that Ingoli was commissioned by the Inquisition to write an expert opinion on the controversy.
    Ingoli sent Galileo a letter in January 1616 listing several objections to Copernicanism, 

    Here were the four theological objections
    • An argument based on the language of the first chapter of Genesis, describing the sky as a tent and the Sun and Moon both being lights in it
    • An argument from Bellarmine on the location of hell being at the center or lowest point of Earth and the universe
    • An argument based on the tenth chapter of Joshua, where the Sun is cited as temporarily standing still
    • An argument from Bellarmine based on a certain prayer that references a stationary Earth


    Offline Miser Peccator

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    Re: The Earth is Flat
    « Reply #229 on: October 21, 2023, 10:30:03 PM »
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  • Yes, that is right and it is very obvious when we look at how the subject was taught at the (Church sponsored) universities.  I have found an English translation of De Sphaera Mundi, the most widespread and influential textbook from its writing in 1230 for hundreds of years onward.  This work represents the long-held scientific consensus in Christendom that Galileo was arguing against.  http://esotericarchives.com/solomon/sphere.htm

    Here is the section on the shape of the earth: 

    THE EARTH A SPHERE. -- That the earth, too, is round is shown thus. The signs and stars do not rise and set the same for all men everywhere but rise and set sooner for those in the east than for those in the west; and of this there is no other cause than the bulge of the earth. Moreover, celestial phenomena evidence that they rise sooner for Orientals than for westerners. For one and the same eclipse of the moon which appears to us in the first hour of the night appears to Orientals about the third hour of the night, which proves that they had night and sunset before we did, of which setting the bulge of the earth is the cause.

    FURTHER PROOFS OF THIS. -- That the earth also has a bulge from north to south and vice versa is shown thus: To those living toward the north, certain stars are always visible, namely, those near the North Pole, while others which are near the South Pole are always concealed from them. If, then, anyone should proceed from the north southward, he might go so far that the stars which formerly were always visible to him now would tend toward their setting. And the farther south he went, the more they would be moved toward their setting. Again, that same man now could see stars which formerly had always been hidden from him. And the reverse would happen to anyone going from the south northward. The cause of this is simply the bulge of the earth. Again, if the earth were flat from east to west, the stars would rise as soon for westerners as for Orientals. which is false. Also, if the earth were flat from north to south and vice versa, the stars which were always visible to anyone would continue to be so wherever he went, which is false. But it seems flat to human sight because it is so extensive.
    SURFACE OF THE SEA SPHERICAL. -- That the water has a bulge and is approximately round is shown thus: Let a signal be set up on the seacoast and a ship leave port and sail away so far that the eye of a person standing at the foot of the mast can no longer discern the signal. Yet if the ship is stopped, the eye of the same person, if he has climbed to the top of the mast, will see the signal clearly. Yet the eye of a person at the bottom of the mast ought to see the signal better than he who is at the top, as is shown by drawing straight lines from both to the signal. And there is no other explanation of this thing than the bulge of the water. For all other impediments are excluded, such as clouds and rising vapors.
    Also, since water is a homogeneous body, the whole will act the same as its parts. But parts of water, as happens in the case of little drops and dew on herbs, naturally seek a round shape. Therefore, the whole, of which they are parts, will do so.

    This was what virtually all educated Catholics believed in the centuries before Galileo. He left the sphericity of the earth uncontested while arguing with other points that were commonly believed. 
     


    This is such a sad statement about "educated Catholics".   :(


    This further explains why the view from the top of the mast is further than the view from the bottom of the mast:

    CONVERGENCE AND VANISHING POINT EXPLAINED
    4min 31sec
    https://www.bitchute.com/video/U2cHQBBwGFpj/



    Science is testable, repeatable and observable.

    So if a drop of water is the same shape as a body of water,

    because "the whole will act the same as its parts"

    then are there examples of small bodies of water in the shape of a sphere?

    I've never seen one myself. :/



























    No bulging water:

    Frozen Lake Proves Water Doesn't Curve







    This is a water level tool.  The ancients used this tech to level large buildings.  It's just as accurate as a laser.  Why?  Because water is always level.  Always.  Everywhere.  All the time.  Never bulges.




    The water level at each end of the tube will be at the same elevation, whether the two ends are adjacent or far apart, so a line between them will be horizontal at its midpoint and a shed base, building foundation or similar structure laid out using several such lines will be "horizontal" within building tolerances on any scale over which use of a water level is practicable.[1] Water levels have been used for many years. The water level is lower-tech than the laser level, but it can be more accurate over long distances, and works without a sightline, such as around corners. 

    In geodesy and surveying, the use of a water level device extended over long distances (sometimes, kilometers) is termed hydrostatic levelling, after the principles of hydrostatic equilibrium and levelling.[2]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_level_%28device%29








    Why do the stars in the southern hemisphere rotate in the opposite direction of the northern hemisphere?


    This gives a possible explanation:

    36min
    https://www.bitchute.com/video/IpgsAe26OM3l/
    I exposed AB Vigano's public meetings with Crowleyan Satanist Dugin so I ask protection on myself family friends priest, under the Blood of Jesus Christ and mantle of the Blessed Virgin Mary! If harm comes to any of us may that embolden the faithful to speak out all the more so Catholics are not deceived.



    [fon


    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The Earth is Flat
    « Reply #230 on: October 22, 2023, 10:29:08 AM »
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  • Frozen Lake Proves Water Doesn't Curve



    This is one of the best out there because the possibility of "refraction" is almost zero under such conditions, since cold air is capable of holding very little moisture / humidity (which would be needed for refraction).  On top of that, since the lights are just a foot above the ice, and you have 4 different lights about a mile apart, you would need the exact same amount of refraction between any two given lights for all of them to line up and remain visible on the same plane ... which is impossible.

    Offline MiracleOfTheSun

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    Re: The Earth is Flat
    « Reply #231 on: October 22, 2023, 10:49:46 AM »
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  • There are a number of like experiments on the internet all showing measurements based on earth curve calculators.  What I've seen so far is that the earth curve calculators have a 100% Failure Rate.  I'm finding it more difficult to refute the flat earth model because these experiments have been repeated numerous times and have produced the same result - nothing is obscured by any curve.

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The Earth is Flat
    « Reply #232 on: October 22, 2023, 11:02:12 AM »
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  • There are a number of like experiments on the internet all showing measurements based on earth curve calculators.  What I've seen so far is that the earth curve calculators have a 100% Failure Rate.  I'm finding it more difficult to refute the flat earth model because these experiments have been repeated numerous times and have produced the same result - nothing is obscured by any curve.

    Yeah, if there were just one or two such experiments out there, one could write it off as a fluke or even fraud ... but the results are almost 100% consistent in favor of flat earth.  Dr. John D would livestream his experiments, and announce them ahead of time so that independent observers could attend.  Some of the world-record long distance photographs, moreover, were created by non Flat Earthers, just professional photographers trying to get into the record books without considering the scientific implications of what they were doing.  One was a picture of a lighthouse, the peak of which was about 150 feet above sea level, from 230 or so miles away, and the photographer recorded his location and elevation, where the thing should have been hidden by miles of "curvature", and another showed the Alps from 700 miles way, when they should have been hidden by about 85 miles of curvature.

    Now, if someone came up with a theory where light bends around the earth consistently and at all times due to some electromagnetic forces of the earth, maybe.  But "refraction" is utter hogwash.