Author Topic: Phoenix sspx chapel update (Read 110811 times)

mw2016 · « **Reply #495 on:** October 12, 2016, 01:14:24 PM »

Quote from: Lunatik

So I am asking you, is there someway that you could come forward and offer to the parish a way to raise monies to pay off this debt? There are a lot of things that are being looked over right now as a way to raise money to pay off the debts, and your ideas I am sure, would be welcome for consideration.

I am also sorry that these two ladies were handled so rudely by an usher. I wish I know whom he was as I would personally like to go up to him and discuss the mater myself and find out why he acted this way. I can only advise that these ladies go speak with the folks that are working the tables selling the tickets to see if they can have their questions answered properly.

No ideas are taken with any real consideration at OLOS in my experience. Most people are summarily dismissed or even ridiculed if they offer any suggestions.

Quote from: PhxGroup

We have delayed in posting in the last few days as 2 of our members/friends were told by an Usher on Sunday 2 weeks past to stop asking questions about the raffle or leave and do not return these ladies were understandably shaken. The Usher was quite angry and accused them of spreading rumors and dissension amongst the faithful.

The experience of the ladies with the ushers is a great example of everything that is wrong at OLOS these days. Things like that shouldn't ever happen.

Marlelar · « **Reply #496 on:** October 13, 2016, 12:37:24 PM »

Quote from: mw2016

No, the cost is not outrageous, nor is that the problem. The school has a LOT of problems.

You are truly blessed indeed if almost $6,000 a year (for HS) is not an outrageous fee for you to pay. If that is not an issue for our apparently affluent parishioners, then what is?

Incredulous · « **Reply #497 on:** October 13, 2016, 08:13:43 PM »

Quote from: mw2016

Quote from: Lunatik
So I am asking you, is there someway that you could come forward and offer to the parish a way to raise monies to pay off this debt? There are a lot of things that are being looked over right now as a way to raise money to pay off the debts, and your ideas I am sure, would be welcome for consideration.

I am also sorry that these two ladies were handled so rudely by an usher. I wish I know whom he was as I would personally like to go up to him and discuss the mater myself and find out why he acted this way. I can only advise that these ladies go speak with the folks that are working the tables selling the tickets to see if they can have their questions answered properly.

No ideas are taken with any real consideration at OLOS in my experience. Most people are summarily dismissed or even ridiculed if they offer any suggestions.

Quote from: PhxGroup

We have delayed in posting in the last few days as 2 of our members/friends were told by an Usher on Sunday 2 weeks past to stop asking questions about the raffle or leave and do not return these ladies were understandably shaken. The Usher was quite angry and accused them of spreading rumors and dissension amongst the faithful.

The experience of the ladies with the ushers is a great example of everything that is wrong at OLOS these days. Things like that shouldn't ever happen.

OLOS is suffering from the classic Novus ordo parish stalemate, between the faithful and "management".

The typical diocese solution is to bring-in the NO bishop and flush-out the trouble-makers to keep progressing with the liberal agenda.

In this case, you have the foreigner Fr. Wegner, who just can't cut it as a hard-nosed Novus ordo bishop. He delegates that job to the parish sycophant thugs.

Why worry about the xSPX's chapel debt?
The "management" is responsible for incurring it anyway.

Let the finance whiz kid, Max Krah and the xSPX banksters figure it out.
They can always foreclose on OLOS.

With Bp. Fellay's surrender to Francis, the diocese is going to get the property anyway.

The key thing now is to get away from the Francis groupies, re-group and keep going, holding fast to Catholic tradition, as much as possible.

PhxGroup · « **Reply #498 on:** October 16, 2016, 09:51:41 PM »

Quote from: SanAmbrosi

Quote from: Geremia
Quote from: PhxGroup
As everyone is aware the statue of Our Lady of Sorrows has again been removed and placed in the Sacristy.
…and replaced by a statue of Our Lady of Fatima for the month of October.

Interesting how that key point was left out. I don't go there, so I can't confirm or deny this. If this really is the case though, I'd really begin to think that this is beginning to become an attempt to TRY to find things to criticize. If the statue really was replaced by a statue of Our Lady of Fatima for the month of the Rosary, it would be entirely fitting. If that is the case . . . well . . . I don't need to know much more from this thread.

Greetings,
We are afaid that is not the key point . Fact is it is throughly irreverent . The parish will not see the return of the OLoS statue any time soon , unnless of course we need to be reminded again of the debt. We were well aware the statue would be moved for the month of October but Fr.C ordered it totality removed

PhxGroup · « **Reply #499 on:** October 16, 2016, 10:25:12 PM »

Quote from: Lunatik

I am also sorry that these two ladies were handled so rudely by an usher. I wish I know whom he was as I would personally like to go up to him and discuss the mater myself and find out why he acted this way. I can only advise that these ladies go speak with the folks that are working the tables selling the tickets to see if they can have their questions answered properly.

And if you were to approach this usher and in any way admonish him you would most certainly be looking for a new church to attend. You're either naive or unaware of the power that certain ushers and parishioners have in our thoroughly divided Parish .While at church we will pursue the raffle subject no further as we do not wish to make an enemy of the ushers or that usher in particular.

hollingsworth · « **Reply #500 on:** October 17, 2016, 10:14:40 AM »

What the heck is an "usher?" What great power does he possess? I don't believe I have ever heard the term "usher," as applied to some influential lay official in any other sspx chapel.

mw2016 · « **Reply #501 on:** October 17, 2016, 10:38:51 AM »

Quote from: hollingsworth

What the heck is an "usher?" What great power does he possess? I don't believe I have ever heard the term "usher," as applied to some influential lay official in any other sspx chapel.

In a normal parish, the ushers will help find you a seat when you arrive, which can be useful when it is crowded.

However, OLOS's "ushers" do not actually provide this service. At least, I've never seen them seat anyone. No, the ushers here collect the money. That is it.

mw2016 · « **Reply #502 on:** October 17, 2016, 10:41:43 AM »

Speaking of money, here is the latest money summary:

http://carvecreative.com/OLOS/10092016.pdf

mw2016 · « **Reply #503 on:** October 17, 2016, 10:53:26 AM »

This is on the website regarding the school's jog-a-thon.

This reaffirms the tone-deaf nature of the priests in not realizing how they are perceived by the faithful. Especially, considering how the faithful were treated over the past year by Fr. Wegner. I realize Fr. Stafki was not present for that, but he must have some awareness of it by now, and the faithful's anger about it, as reflected in their wallets being closed.

But, he seems to either not know, or he just conducts business poorly, as he once again brings up the debt in his letter. This won't be well received amongst the faithful:

http://www.carvecreative.com/OLOS/JOG/letter.pdf

Quote

Almighty God has granted so many graces to our thriving parish, as well as to our
school. This is not to say that we lack challenges. Quite the contrary. The large
debt incurred by the building of our beautiful, new church continues to put
substantial strain on our resources; but not for this shall we be daunted. With
great faith in the loving Providence of God, we know that we can count on the
students, families, staff and benefactors of Our Lady of Sorrows to give their all in
making this much-needed fundraiser a success.

mw2016 · « **Reply #504 on:** October 17, 2016, 11:05:53 AM »

Quote from: Incredulous

In this case, you have the foreigner Fr. Wegner, who just can't cut it as a hard-nosed Novus ordo bishop. He delegates that job to the parish sycophant thugs.

Why worry about the xSPX's chapel debt?
The "management" is responsible for incurring it anyway.

Let the finance whiz kid, Max Krah and the xSPX banksters figure it out.
They can always foreclose on OLOS.

With Bp. Fellay's surrender to Francis, the diocese is going to get the property anyway.

I couldn't agree more.

If it is true that the SSPX got some $80 million dollar donation from the Jaidhofer group, which is what apparently allowed them to blow $20 million on a new seminary, then I wouldn't worry for one second about the "debt." Furthermore, the SSPX should pay for it - not the parishioners.

Especially if, as has been claimed here, that the design was substantially changed which made it more expensive (to accomodate priest retreats or whatever).

And, as you said, the faithful have no say in anything anyway, there is no transparency as to who makes the decisions, or how they are made, and the property will end up in the hands of the Novus Ordo after the deal - so why worry about paying it now? It isn't even really theirs.

Marlelar · « **Reply #505 on:** October 17, 2016, 12:39:31 PM »

Quote

mw2016

Almighty God has granted so many graces to our thriving parish, as well as to our
school. This is not to say that we lack challenges. Quite the contrary. The large
debt incurred by the building of our beautiful, new church continues to put
substantial strain on our resources; but not for this shall we be daunted. With
great faith in the loving Providence of God, we know that we can count on the
students, families, staff and benefactors of Our Lady of Sorrows to give their all in
making this much-needed fundraiser a success.

The jog-a-thon is suppose to support the SCHOOL. The school tuition letter says it covers 20% of their budget.

I don't know how much the kids are expected to raise but I do know the teachers have been told their assigned amount is $500 per person. I wonder if they too will be "billed" for any amount they are under as school families are billed for their fundraising shortfall.

from the bulletin:

all proceeds this year will be going
towards operating costs and the purchase of new lights and sound
equipment for the Performing Arts Center.

No one has ever explained to me why we even need an Performing "Arts" Center, that was colossal waste of money.

mw2016 · « **Reply #506 on:** October 17, 2016, 02:59:26 PM »

Quote from: Marlelar

I do know the teachers have been told their assigned amount is $500 per person. I wonder if they too will be "billed" for any amount they are under as school families are billed for their fundraising shortfall.

Yes, the parents get a bill for all donations not "donated."

I've always felt there was something intrinsically unjust about this, very unCatholic. Because then it is no longer a donation, if you are getting a bill. And the parents are the LAST people they should be looking for donations from, as most parents are already struggling to pay for the tuition.

It is kind of like "mandatory volunteering" or being "volun-told."

Quote from: Marlelar

No one has ever explained to me why we even need an Performing "Arts" Center, that was colossal waste of money.

Yep. Wonder who made that decision?

$100K toward a remodel on that space that probably didn't need that much remodeling,

...and not a penny toward a special ed teacher, when they have at LEAST a half-dozen families with Down's children who would probably enjoy being able to send their kids to a special ed class.

Lunatik · « **Reply #507 on:** October 23, 2016, 08:45:11 PM »

Phx Group:

I appreciate your candid remark to me and that I might be a little naïve. I am not afraid to go up to any usher or group of ushers or any perceived influential person in the parish. I think that in any situation, whether it is at church, at work, or in our neighborhood, there will be people that we do not care for. However it does not bother me to walk up to any person and talk to them about how they handled a situation such as to the ladies that had questions of the raffle. I doubt that I will be thrown out of my parish for asking questions to other parishioners and to a priest as long as it is done with respect and calmly to all. I have been a member of this parish most likely longer than anyone in your group, or close to it. I want, like I feel that you do, to work through these problems the best we can. So if it is too raise money to pay off the outrageous debt, then let us do it. Like I said instead of just complaining, ( believe me I do my share) let us move forward. Let us address unacceptable behavior by ushers, let us address negative remarks that get us nowhere in getting this parish on the right track, and let us try no matter how hard it is at times, to come together the best we can even though we may not like the ways of certain people, and build the parish. If you would like to send me a private e-mail, I will personally go up to that usher to talk to them about their conduct. I think that something else needs to addressed here; I was questioned about how much time was spent at the church by the family that had donated a lot of money towards the building fund. I will go on record again, and this has been confirmed to me by others, that this extended family puts in a lot of time volunteering at the church. So to be fair to them, I felt that I needed to make sure that it was not only my own personal observations.

PhxGroup · « **Reply #508 on:** October 27, 2016, 07:50:28 PM »

Quote from: Lunatik

Phx Group:

I appreciate your candid remark to me and that I might be a little naïve. I am not afraid to go up to any usher or group of ushers or any perceived influential person in the parish. I think that in any situation, whether it is at church, at work, or in our neighborhood, there will be people that we do not care for. However it does not bother me to walk up to any person and talk to them about how they handled a situation such as to the ladies that had questions of the raffle. I doubt that I will be thrown out of my parish for asking questions to other parishioners and to a priest as long as it is done with respect and calmly to all. I have been a member of this parish most likely longer than anyone in your group, or close to it. I want, like I feel that you do, to work through these problems the best we can. So if it is too raise money to pay off the outrageous debt, then let us do it. Like I said instead of just complaining, ( believe me I do my share) let us move forward. Let us address unacceptable behavior by ushers, let us address negative remarks that get us nowhere in getting this parish on the right track, and let us try no matter how hard it is at times, to come together the best we can even though we may not like the ways of certain people, and build the parish. If you would like to send me a private e-mail, I will personally go up to that usher to talk to them about their conduct. I think that something else needs to addressed here; I was questioned about how much time was spent at the church by the family that had donated a lot of money towards the building fund. I will go on record again, and this has been confirmed to me by others, that this extended family puts in a lot of time volunteering at the church. So to be fair to them, I felt that I needed to make sure that it was not only my own personal observations.

Greetings,

It has become clear to us that the reason you are so willing to confront the Ushers and
question parishioners is that you are in fact an Usher yourself ,your family is involved with the administration and not to mention close friends with the very Usher constantly alluded to on this forum .He moves around the church grounds as though he owns them ,he enters the priory and office at will , he has copies of the keys to enter the basement and any other place he wishes including the sacristy ,He bans people from the property and he is aggressive to anyone he questions. So we guess it is only natural you have the feeling of power to allow yourself do what you want but others of us are not so lucky

TKGS · « **Reply #509 on:** October 28, 2016, 06:49:31 AM »

Quote from: Marlelar

from the bulletin:

all proceeds this year will be going
towards operating costs and the purchase of new lights and sound
equipment for the Performing Arts Center.

I'm sorry, but I automatically suspect anyone of Modernism who would call a school auditorium a "Performing Arts Center". This kind of jargon just screams politically correct liberalism.