Author Topic: Ignis Ardens Will be Closed Permanently (Read 17648 times)

Wessex · « **Reply #45 on:** October 22, 2012, 06:21:02 AM »

I suppose the shock for me when on IA was, along with the erasure of the Krah revelations, seeing the whole of the anti-establishment position of the old Society (from an English perspective) being dumped by the UK district in line with changes Menzingen were making over the years. And then new people were turning up attacking Bp. W and promoting the new relationship with Rome and the 'sin of anti-semitism'. It was clear then that, although the site gave space to the bishop and his situation, its heart was not really in it and the Menzingen position (and therefore the UK district position) was still the horse to back. The site is still hanging onto some independence but not enough to keep nervous moderators on board. The next crisis there will be over Bp. W's expected expulsion.

Telesphorus · « **Reply #46 on:** October 22, 2012, 07:36:19 AM »

Some people pushed certain issues too hard, giving Menzingen pretexts for their attacks on traditionalists in their effort to pull the SSPX into line with political correctness. What's so sad is that they found such hospitable soil for their politically correct weeds, anxious to choke true Catholicism. You would think people raised by traditionalists would have a good grasp of the corrupt orientation of this society, but unfortunately, the strength of the current of the culture is awfully hard to swim against. Without a firm intellectual foundation for anti-liberalism, without real understanding and knowledge, the majority will find liberalization palatable, though they will keep rather quiet about it.

Indulging characters like Ashmolean, who couldn't even seem to say a single thing pertaining to the Catholic Faith, but was strictly there to attack and insult Catholics, was frankly unbelievable.

We should not trust people just because they seem "nice."

John Grace · « **Reply #47 on:** October 22, 2012, 08:08:23 AM »

Quote

Indulging characters like Ashmolean, who couldn't even seem to say a single thing pertaining to the Catholic Faith, but was strictly there to attack and insult Catholics, was frankly unbelievable.

I thought he had some Catholic ideas and whilst satire is ok, he did get very personal. I had thought him a pleasant enough individual but his mockery was too much.

I'm not that bothered about people who attack Bishop Williamson. The Bishop and his many supporter's are in it for the long haul. All the critics seem to do is laugh and mock him. Can the critics outline where he has ever deviated from Catholic teaching or abandoned the principles of Archbishop Lefebvre?

Telesphorus · « **Reply #48 on:** October 22, 2012, 08:10:37 AM »

Ashmolean, like lawyer K, was all about Jew-loving.

John Grace · « **Reply #49 on:** October 22, 2012, 08:11:46 AM »

Quote

The next crisis there will be over Bp. W's expected expulsion.

I mentioned the latest news to a few who attend the SSPX. I was shocked that they now attend the Institute Christ the King Mass from time to time. I don't see building a resistance.

Wessex · « **Reply #50 on:** October 22, 2012, 08:44:22 AM »

Ashmolean was a walking reference manual. Did he ever have any original ideas? I think he heard that IA was a meeting-place of the 'new right' and he appeared in order to goad members in the wake of the Krah affair. He styles himself as a composer/publisher of music and hangs out with Jєωιѕн friends.

Telesphorus · « **Reply #51 on:** October 22, 2012, 08:46:24 AM »

Quote from: Wessex

Ashmolean was a walking reference manual. Did he ever have any original ideas? I think he heard that IA was a meeting-place of the 'new right' and he appeared in order to goad members in the wake of the Krah affair. He styles himself as a composer/publisher of music and hangs out with Jєωιѕн friends.

These "high church" "trads" don't have any use for the Faith itself.

Neil Obstat · « **Reply #52 on:** October 22, 2012, 10:32:39 AM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

Quote from: Wessex
Ashmolean was a walking reference manual. Did he ever have any original ideas? I think he heard that IA was a meeting-place of the 'new right' and he appeared in order to goad members in the wake of the Krah affair. He styles himself as a composer/publisher of music and hangs out with Jєωιѕн friends.

These "high church" "trads" don't have any use for the Faith itself.

I'm having a hard time reading between the lines here when everyone is writing
in code language. HAHAHAHAHA

I figure 'Ashmolean' is a member on IA, which I rarely look at for numerous reasons.
So the fabled 'Krah affair' is not in my experience. Can anyone post a link or two
so I can go see what happened when I wasn't looking?............... Please??

Composer/publisher: composer of music: what kind of music? publisher: of what,
sheet music for acid rock bands, pop singers, hip-hop teenage girl aerobics classes?

Or, is it "high church 'trads' music?" (There's a good reason to be careful with the
apostrophe in the plural possessive case: trads' music, or "trads' music" or ''trads''
music' ???????)

Don't get me wrong. I appreciate the low-down on the up-and-up. :cool:

John Grace · « **Reply #53 on:** October 22, 2012, 03:42:46 PM »

Take note of this from Mc Farland. Bishop Williamson is no enemy.

http://cathinfo-warning-pornography!/Ignis_Ardens/index.php?showtopic=11182&view=getnewpost

Quote

Judith,

+W has been working to undermine the Society and its leadership for some time now.

He has no evidence for the proposition that after the 1988 consecrations, ABL saw the light and thereafter rejected all dealings with Rome until it converted. Even if he did, it is now +Fellay who must make the decisions.

The evidence for his Judas Fellay contentions is likewise conspicuous by its absence.

As +W would say, you're behaving like a woman: sacrificing reason to sentiment and a hopeless hope that everything can be patched up.

I have no idea what +W thinks he's doing, but objectively speaking he is now an enemy of the SSPX, and a pertinacious one at that; and so must be treated accordingly unless he repent.

Nickolas · « **Reply #54 on:** October 22, 2012, 04:03:34 PM »

I don't know much about Ashmolean, but IA has lost most of its credibility in my view and it may as well shut down. It is a waste of time to argue with people who talk in circles and don't stand for truth, but stand for blind obedience, mis-information, and senseless banter as if they can't think or add 2+2.

I used to visit there to learn about the Traditional Church as a fairly new convert. Over the past year, modernists have moved in and basically were allowed to work their managed media tactics to destroy any useful forum discussion. I believe very much that some of the modernists that remain there ARE on someone's payroll as part of a disinformation campaign to change me, you, and our fellow Traditional Catholics. That IA has decided to stay open, this tells me the modernist's deeds are not completed. Perhaps a few visited Cathinfo and realized they would not be able to work their misdeeds here and the decision was made to keep it open for them.

For all we know, the management of the site HAS been taken over by someone else, but they kept the admin name of Patricius. It was said that the man who used that name was not in good health. Who knows, who really cares when credibility is destroyed?

At least in the near term, the future of the Traditional Catholic Church is at stake right now. Chapels preach obedience while nothing is said of a deposed Bishop and dozens of priests who have been kicked out of the Society for being full of truth rather than full of blind obedience. I will take truth. We have seen what blind obedience has done to the Church over the past 50 years.

I re-read article last night "Resisting Wayward Prelates" and it makes a lot of sense today.

http://www.catholicapologetics.info/modernproblems/vatican2/wayward.htm

Matthew · « **Reply #55 on:** October 22, 2012, 04:49:58 PM »

Quote from: John Grace

Take note of this from Mc Farland. Bishop Williamson is no enemy.

http://cathinfo-warning-pornography!/Ignis_Ardens/index.php?showtopic=11182&view=getnewpost
Quote
Judith,

+W has been working to undermine the Society and its leadership for some time now.

He has no evidence for the proposition that after the 1988 consecrations, ABL saw the light and thereafter rejected all dealings with Rome until it converted. Even if he did, it is now +Fellay who must make the decisions.

The evidence for his Judas Fellay contentions is likewise conspicuous by its absence.

As +W would say, you're behaving like a woman: sacrificing reason to sentiment and a hopeless hope that everything can be patched up.

I have no idea what +W thinks he's doing, but objectively speaking he is now an enemy of the SSPX, and a pertinacious one at that; and so must be treated accordingly unless he repent.

That post is no worse than the one he posted before it:

Quote from: John McFarland

1) HE makes no reference to doctrine as a precondition because, supporting as he does the decisions of the Chapter, he does not consider doctrine a precondition. He's not on your side. Repeat: he's not on your side.

2) As HE says, if there is a doctrinal solution, then we needn't worry ourselves very much about preconditions. The preconditions are only interesting if there is a non-doctrinal deal.

3) John Lane is not the obvious choice for information on SSPX strategy and tactics.

4) I think that +de G simply reflects the true situation of +W. He has been talking about the Society in the third person for months now. He is still a nominal member because for his purposes, the production values of being dismissed are better than the production values of quitting.

I believe that in fact, +W was barred from the Chapter by +F before the Chapter convened. In any event, what are your credentials to pass judgment upon the latter's decision under the constitutional docuмent(s) of the Society?

5) Obviously he had to think of all of these things in order to come to the conclusions he has reached. He has obviously come to different conclusions from yours. The choices are not limited to (i) agreeing with you or (ii) being a dimwit.

6) Ah, yes: HE is a sheep being led to the slaughter, unlike courageous intellectuals like yourself. HE seems to have got a lot dumber since the hardliners were still hoping that he was on their side.

7) It is certainly the case that Rome balked, and not Menzigen. It is certainly the case that Menzigen has laid out the conditions for a no doctrinal strings regularization. But it is also the case that Rome has made perfectly clear that there will not be a no doctrinal strings regularization, and the SSPX has rejected the doctrinal capitulation that Rome has insisted upon as a condition to SSPX regularization. So your conclusion that "Menzingen is fighting mightily to get a deal with Rome" makes no sense, unless you have evidence that after the Society leadership has put itself solidly behind the Chapter decisions, +Fellay and some or all of the rest of the leadership really intends to capitulate, which is something they could have done on June 13 if they had been so inclined.

Let me summarize your apparent position. +F didn't capitulate on June 13. Instead, he went to the Chapter and lined up the Society leadership behind rejection of the Vatican requirements. But NOW, having doing so, he is going to sell out; pretty soon, any time now, just you wait...

Come to think of it, I've never seen you and The Little Pebble in the same room.

Matthew · « **Reply #56 on:** October 22, 2012, 04:52:30 PM »

Anyone wondering why I banned him? His fanaticism for the Accordista faction is quite nauseating.

He's a complete fanboy; he's totally surrendered his faculty of reason to the Cult Leader.

Quote from: John McFarland

supporting as he does the decisions of the Chapter, he does not consider doctrine a precondition. He's not on your side. Repeat: he's not on your side.

And you see no problem with that, John? You're OK with the fact that the SSPX General Chapter doesn't see doctrine a precondition? That's insane. So there are no problems with the SSPX putting itself under Roman control, even though they're completely committed to Modernism and the destruction of the Church? Gotcha.

As the wise saying goes, "Never argue with a crazy person."

Diego · « **Reply #57 on:** October 22, 2012, 07:12:44 PM »

Is McFarland hired help in the USA?

Domitilla · « **Reply #58 on:** October 22, 2012, 07:42:47 PM »

Diego said: "Is McFarland hired help in the USA?"

Very good question!

Incredulous · « **Reply #59 on:** October 22, 2012, 07:47:13 PM »

Quote from: Nickolas

I don't know much about Ashmolean, but IA has lost most of its credibility in my view and it may as well shut down. It is a waste of time to argue with people who talk in circles and don't stand for truth, but stand for blind obedience, mis-information, and senseless banter as if they can't think or add 2+2.

I used to visit there to learn about the Traditional Church as a fairly new convert. Over the past year, modernists have moved in and basically were allowed to work their managed media tactics to destroy any useful forum discussion. I believe very much that some of the modernists that remain there ARE on someone's payroll as part of a disinformation campaign to change me, you, and our fellow Traditional Catholics. That IA has decided to stay open, this tells me the modernist's deeds are not completed. Perhaps a few visited Cathinfo and realized they would not be able to work their misdeeds here and the decision was made to keep it open for them.

For all we know, the management of the site HAS been taken over by someone else, but they kept the admin name of Patricius. It was said that the man who used that name was not in good health. Who knows, who really cares when credibility is destroyed?

At least in the near term, the future of the Traditional Catholic Church is at stake right now. Chapels preach obedience while nothing is said of a deposed Bishop and dozens of priests who have been kicked out of the Society for being full of truth rather than full of blind obedience. I will take truth. We have seen what blind obedience has done to the Church over the past 50 years.

I re-read article last night "Resisting Wayward Prelates" and it makes a lot of sense today. http://www.catholicapologetics.info/modernproblems/vatican2/wayward.htm

Nice, insightful post Nikolas!