Author Topic: School Dilemma?-need advise (Read 6408 times)

CathMom37 · « **Reply #45 on:** May 19, 2010, 01:37:28 PM »

That is what I am saying. I shouldnt even have to worry about it right? I'd PM you, but I guess I havent been a member long enough, lol.

Trying to give more info-

Pope John XXIII made lots of changes pre- Vatican II, and takes full credit for ushering in Vatican II. From a sede viewpoint, if I am rejecting VII, why am I taking on the changes of the Pope that completely promulgated it?

So what are we talking about here...potted plants on the altar instead of fresh flowers, Holy Communion on Good Fridays, the new changes in the calendar with different feasts (some that are at least somewhat important being wiped out), no latin hyms sung during high Mass (they are ALL 60's hyms). That is just a few of many, but my point being, at what point do I say 'whoa'?

Alexandria · « **Reply #46 on:** May 19, 2010, 01:42:50 PM »

I am not familiar with any sedevacantist chapel that would do that, CathMom. But I don't know all of them. I can't imagine a sedevacantist chapel taking on the changes of John XXIII. Are you sure you're not confusing him with Pius XII?

Trinity · « **Reply #47 on:** May 19, 2010, 02:03:49 PM »

I'm thinking this place can't be CMRI, but what do I know. Only our little corner. So glad I'm here and not there.

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #48 on:** May 19, 2010, 05:29:23 PM »

I'll tell my story. Hopefully it may help you decide what to do.

I have five children myself, ranging from 11 years to 10 months.

I originally homeschooled my first, when she was in kindergarten. I had two small ones, and one was an infant at the time. I had gotten her into a charter school situation funded by the publik skoolz here, and they gave way too much work, and I think that's what turned me away from that. Way too much.

Then, I sent my eldest and my second oldest to a school that had half day kindergarten for my second, and that was a nice school and everything, but my car ended up breaking down and I couldn't take them, and there was no bus to pick them up. Also, I found out that the first grade teacher was pro-abortion (iirc) and I sent them to the school down the street.

Because, at that time, I didn't know my rights, I was coerced into vaccinating my children. I'd already vaccinated my first two but my son, I hadn't yet, and I was basically threatened if I didn't, so I did. (I think that may be why he has some problems now, but God allowed it for whatever reason, and I accept it.)

So he went to the same skool with them, publik, for one year.

I was absolutely disgusted with the way they were acting, and there was no way I was doing that again, so I homeschooled them all the year after that.

Surely it is a weakness in my temperament that I haven't sufficiently mastered, and I really didn't do that good of a job at homeschooling them, so I decided that I had to start looking elsewhere once again. I had them doing the time4learning program which is largely a computer based school program.

I'd been hearing about this one school that lost a bunch of students because they were forced to attend the Novus Ordo mess, and I wondered if there were a way I could send them without them being forced to participate. It was really expensive, but I worked out a deal with the principal over there, and this year I was able to send all three. My daughter who will be 6 this Sunday, didn't go to school this year, because the required age to be in school is 6, and I thought it would be nice if she stayed home with me another year. She's been a big help, too, with my infant son.

They are forced, (yes, it's a required "school function") to attend the Novus Ordo mess, but I hacked out a deal, that, yes, they would go with their class, but I would go also, and sit right behind them, as to make certain they were not forced to participate. I told them in no uncertain terms, that we neither go to the novus ordo, nor would we ever participate, because that is not how we worship, and not how we believe. So as long as they could just quietly sit there and read a book, or pray a rosary, and were not forced to participate, they could go to that school.

It's worked out nicely, although, we're called in a few times, to discuss the mass, and whatnot. The principal asked me if I were getting anything out of the mess during a phone call, and I told him, "No, sir, I'm being completely honest with you. I get nothing out of it. There is no joy in attending it, and I actually wish to be anywhere else but inside that church when that service is going on. But I tolerate it because I must."

I've had to explain to my children that they're not allowed to discuss the N.O. or the Mass at school because we didn't want any arguments in school or "taunting" or whatever. If I had my way, my children would be talking about the Mass and trying to convince their schoolmates to go to only that Mass, but my options were:

1) Homeschool with an infant
2) Publik Skool
3) This school

I don't know what my options are next year, as I don't know if the financial assistance that was there this year, will be there next year.

You are not alone. Every single family I know is in this predicament unless they live in Saint Mary's, and have a lot of money to shell out.

God Bless you, and I'll pray for you, and please recommend me to Our Lady, when you pray for me, if you do.

Alexandria · « **Reply #49 on:** May 19, 2010, 06:09:31 PM »

PFT

The grass isn'talways greener on the other side.

I can't speak for today, but St. Mary's had more than its share of problems in the past. Better to do what you are doing, than find out that a traditional school isn't all its cracked up to be.

MaterDominici · « **Reply #50 on:** May 19, 2010, 07:18:02 PM »

Quote from: Alexandria

PFT

The grass isn'talways greener on the other side.

I can't speak for today, but St. Mary's had more than its share of problems in the past. Better to do what you are doing, than find out that a traditional school isn't all its cracked up to be.

I agree. I'm sure I've not heard of even a fraction of issues St. Mary's has had in the past, but I do know a graduate or two and I'm not impressed with the output.

CathMom, new schools just scare me -- way too many possibilities. Good for you for even considering this. Have you thought about maybe sending only some of your kids?... the older ones perhaps?

Trinity · « **Reply #51 on:** May 19, 2010, 07:34:44 PM »

Alexandria, is there no school where you're at?

Trinity · « **Reply #52 on:** May 19, 2010, 07:46:21 PM »

Excuse me, again. PFT, when I homeschooled my daughter, I used books and lesson plans from Our Lady of Victory. As the teacher you can vet anything you want to, but I think it is SSPX so mostly it was kosher. And it definitely takes care of the 3 R's. It's fairly economical, too. Very economical if you do the grading yourself. It's in Idaho somewhere, I forget.

Alexandria · « **Reply #53 on:** May 19, 2010, 07:48:56 PM »

Quote from: Trinity

Alexandria, is there no school where you're at?

Yes, Trinity, we have SSPX and CMRI schools where we are. But she mentioned St. Mary's, and I have heard, in the past, not so good things about it, which is why I commented on it. :cool:

Trinity · « **Reply #54 on:** May 19, 2010, 08:00:21 PM »

I'm thinking there are a lot of St. Mary's' around, but in any event I know nothing of it. What do you hear of the SSPX and CMRI schools in your neck of the woods. My grandchildren are in Mater Dei here, and I can't speak too highly of it. The kids love it.

Dulcamara · « **Reply #55 on:** May 19, 2010, 08:07:16 PM »

I once knew a young woman who was sent to a modern "Catholic" school. She never got straight answers to her questions about the Faith, or she got bad/erring ones, and while she learned her prayers in Latin (you mean Latin doesn't make the Catholic?), that's about all she learned. Needless to say, she did NOT emerge from that school a die-hard Catholic.

When I met her she hated anything to do with womanhood or femininity.

Nice girl, too. Hooray for modern "Catholic" schools. (I've heard all kinds of horror stories about what goes on in them, including some former students who say they the one they went to was actually worse than the public schools they had attended.)

Homeschooling or sending your kids to a totally traditional Catholic school of good reputation would be my advice. Public schools are about as wholesome (and healthy) as prisons, and apparently (judging by the stories of students that had attended them), many "Catholic" schools aren't much better.

Even if the one and only thing wrong was that they're infected with N.O. (I like to call it the 'novus oder'), then the errors, and the attitudes that LEAD to the errors, will be simply part of the fabric or whole atmosphere of their education. And according to psychology, subtle exposure to the attitudes that LEAD to the errors or the acceptance of them, are plenty effective in corrupting someone. They can try to reject them... but living in the whole atmosphere of liberalism and all-inclusive indifference to the truth is a deadly poison in itself.

His Excellency Bishop Fellay of the SSPX once commented on this in a conference he was giving. He was talking about communion in the hand. He pointed out how the action of receiving communion standing, and in the hand, in itself ebbed away at the belief in the True Presence. On this topic he said (to paraphrase, since it's been a while since I've heard it), "when we kneel, we kneel to someONE... And someone who is definitely NOT equal to ourselves. So if you believe that Our Lord is really present... you will not receive Him on the hand, standing up..."

It was a different topic entirely, but the truth he was getting at is very important to this issue. Catholics SURELY, at one time, for the most part really did believe in the Real Presence. What happened? Because of these few simple actions, the faith of the MAJORITY has been slowly rotted away. If you treat Our Lord like a common cookie (Lord forgive my saying it), then sooner or later your mind will begin to put Your Lord on that level, or else begin to doubt (as your actions suggest that doubt) that He is really there. That that is really Him. Your mind knows, if it were Him, you would act a certain way. If you act another way, your subconscious can only conclude one of the two... either He is not really there (and you don't think so, because you're certainly not acting the way you know you should if He is), OR... that He is somehow equal to or even beneath you.

Likewise, if you put your children in a novus ordo school, they may TELL themselves that they do not believe the modernism. But day by day, they will be surrounded by people who DO believe it. Perhaps their friends will believe it (who are "nice people!"). Their teachers will certainly believe it. And the textbooks will teach it. And every subtle nuance will reflect that this teaching (modernism) is RIGHT. And that YOU are "unreasonable" to reject it. It's errors will permeate EVERYTHING in that environment, and radiate from students, teachers and textbooks alike.

Now the Church has forbidden us (if memory serves me correctly) to send our children to schools of another religion. (Correct me if I'm wrong.) WHY? Because of this very reason. In other words, even if this baptist school has the most excellent art program, or language program or well-mannered students... it is permeated with errors. Errors that will be taught, implied and upheld universally there. And no matter what the Catholic tells him or herself, sooner or later those errors will begin to work on them and their faith, and their ideas, like a subtle poison.

If you send your children to a N.O. school, they will be likewise surrounded by this subtle poison. No matter how strong they are in their faith, they are only human. The wise Church knows this, and has thus discouraged us from putting ourselves around errors. The conscious mind may reject them, but the subconscious is still drinking them in constantly. It WILL have an effect. And at worst, it will ultimately subvert the love of the truth, and the true Faith in your children.

Can you risk it?

:idea:

MyrnaM · « **Reply #56 on:** May 19, 2010, 08:31:35 PM »

Most of my 22 grandchildren are at Mount St. Michael, and they seem to like the school. Three are graduating from High School in a couple of weeks from the Mount.

I also have 2 grandchildren whose parents live in NV. and their parents let them choose to come to the Mount and live with us, (grandparents), or stay in NV and attend public school. The kids always want to come back to the Mount.

I have seen, however, many children rebel from the Mount once they graduate, but when they mature some quietly come back, but not all. Their parents are distraught, I try to tell the parents, God answers your prayers every day for your children, since they are still alive and still have that chance. Mostly it is the parents that were so strict with their children that when they grow up, they rebel.

MaterDominici · « **Reply #57 on:** May 19, 2010, 08:39:59 PM »

Quote from: CathMom37

So what are we talking about here...potted plants on the altar instead of fresh flowers, Holy Communion on Good Fridays, the new changes in the calendar with different feasts (some that are at least somewhat important being wiped out), no latin hyms sung during high Mass (they are ALL 60's hyms). That is just a few of many, but my point being, at what point do I say 'whoa'?

I see what you mean. Individually, you could excuse many of these things (maybe not the calendar -- do you mean that they follow the current calendar? ...or something in between?) but together it leaves you wondering just what will come next and at what point do you stop compromising.

I'll tell you about a strange sort of school we have in this part of the country... It's part of an Anglican-use Catholic Church. As far as education, they're top-notch. So, many conservative N.O. Catholic families send their kids there (maybe some Trads too, but I don't know of any right now.) The liturgy is way more traditional than the average N.O. becuase it carries over from Anglicanism so externally it looks very Trad Cath. Also, because the leadership are primarly converts from Anglicanism, they have the sort of zeal you don't find in most N.O. churches. They also have a solid emphasis on many traditional customs like devotions to Saints which is certainly disappearing from the N.O. And, as a bonus, their church is beautiful. They really have all sorts of reasons a good Catholic might WANT to look past the details. But, in THESE details you'll find a whole mess of confusion. The priest actually envisions a whole generation growing up accustomed to this Anglican-use liturgy -- that's just what the Catholic world needs is another Mass :rolleyes:

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #58 on:** May 20, 2010, 07:45:31 AM »

Quote from: CathMom37

Pope John XXIII made lots of changes pre- Vatican II, and takes full credit for ushering in Vatican II. From a sede viewpoint, if I am rejecting VII, why am I taking on the changes of the Pope that completely promulgated it?

So what are we talking about here...potted plants on the altar instead of fresh flowers, Holy Communion on Good Fridays, the new changes in the calendar with different feasts (some that are at least somewhat important being wiped out), no latin hymns sung during high Mass (they are ALL 60's hymns). That is just a few of many, but my point being, at what point do I say 'whoa'?

No kidding, and I 100% agree with you on this. I don't want to get into the whole 1962 missal debate

. Thankfully, we don't have that here.

CathMom37 · « **Reply #59 on:** May 20, 2010, 05:15:19 PM »

MaterDomini-you tagged it. Too many little things that added up quickly. The calendar- I will have to refind the notes on it, but the pages I mention below I think have reference to them.

Maybe in these times I just have to go with my conscience, and let God be the judge in the end.

I DID mean Pope Pious XII-after reading some this morning-it was during his reign that began the 'Pontifical Commission for the Reform of the Liturgy' that was run by Bugnini, Bea & Antonelli (really bad dudes!) and had the full support and blessings of Pius XII.
Thus it had begun. If anyone wants some good info pages on it, give me a shout.

And, one gal mentioned sending her kids to the N.O. school and told her story-sorry, but I cant see your name from this screen, but wanted to tell you most definately, I will pray for you, and you pray for me. That is a deal :o) You know I am going to say take option 1, hs with the infant :o)