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Author Topic: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?  (Read 60539 times)

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Offline Mark 79

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Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
« Reply #540 on: March 05, 2025, 02:39:33 PM »
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  • Please do not start another marijuana thread.  In 2021 there were at least 4 such threads. Rarely does a multiplicity of threads on the same subject bear more or better fruit.

    Offline Gray2023

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #541 on: March 05, 2025, 02:49:48 PM »
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  • Please do not start another marijuana thread.  In 2021 there were at least 4 such threads. Rarely does a multiplicity of threads on the same subject bear more or better fruit.
    My brain is random.  It would be a thread of alcohol use during prohibition and how it affected the Catholic Church?  I tried to look and see if there was already a thread, but I couldn't find one.

    My guess is that maybe prohibition was another stealth attack on the Catholic Church, but I have not researched it.
    1 Corinthians: Chapter 13 "4 Charity is patient, is kind: charity envieth not, dealeth not perversely; is not puffed up; 5 Is not ambitious, seeketh not her own, is not provoked to anger, thinketh no evil;"


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #542 on: March 05, 2025, 02:58:37 PM »
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  • Please do not start another marijuana thread.  In 2021 there were at least 4 such threads. Rarely does a multiplicity of threads on the same subject bear more or better fruit.

    Agreed.  It's why I barely participated this time.  What's frustrating is that the Catholic theology regarding the matter can easily be summarized in two sentences, and it has been summarized early in this thread and so it needn't have continued.

    Theologians agree that taking a substance to the point of completely losing control of your higher faculties (to where you can no longer engage in moral reasoning) is grave sin ... without a grave justification for it (e.g. surgery, relief of extreme pain, etc.), and that lesser degrees of impairment of those faculties can be justified (i.e. not sinful) for proportionately less grave reasons.  If these "incomplete" impairments (their term) are not justified for such proportionate reasons, they'd be venial sins. 

    Done. 

    If you want to add a third sentence it's that certain extrinsic considerations can render its use gravely evil, such as if I am risking my job (at a place where randoms are taken), or risking prison, or taking one of those substances that can cause instant addiction to the point where people ruin their lives over it, or even just breaking a just law without (again) proportionately serious reason. 

    What a waste of time.  I submit it's due to a lot of Traditoinal Catholics in the US being somewhat poisoned by Puritanical attitudes, something which we saw also on some other threads.  I doubt we'd be having this debate in, say, most of Europe or Latin America.

    Offline AnthonyPadua

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #543 on: March 05, 2025, 10:22:07 PM »
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  • Agreed.  It's why I barely participated this time.  What's frustrating is that the Catholic theology regarding the matter can easily be summarized in two sentences, and it has been summarized early in this thread and so it needn't have continued.

    Theologians agree that taking a substance to the point of completely losing control of your higher faculties (to where you can no longer engage in moral reasoning) is grave sin ... without a grave justification for it (e.g. surgery, relief of extreme pain, etc.), and that lesser degrees of impairment of those faculties can be justified (i.e. not sinful) for proportionately less grave reasons.  If these "incomplete" impairments (their term) are not justified for such proportionate reasons, they'd be venial sins. 

    Done. 

    If you want to add a third sentence it's that certain extrinsic considerations can render its use gravely evil, such as if I am risking my job (at a place where randoms are taken), or risking prison, or taking one of those substances that can cause instant addiction to the point where people ruin their lives over it, or even just breaking a just law without (again) proportionately serious reason. 

    What a waste of time.  I submit it's due to a lot of Traditoinal Catholics in the US being somewhat poisoned by Puritanical attitudes, something which we saw also on some other threads.  I doubt we'd be having this debate in, say, most of Europe or Latin America.
    How would someone know if they have a sufficient justification for lesser impairment? E.g alcohol use for joy, alcohol to help socialise etc?

    Offline Godefroy

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #544 on: March 06, 2025, 02:24:57 AM »
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  • What a waste of time.  I submit it's due to a lot of Traditoinal Catholics in the US being somewhat poisoned by Puritanical attitudes, something which we saw also on some other threads.  I doubt we'd be having this debate in, say, most of Europe or Latin America.
    This is what appears so odd to us in american movies. If someone drinks, he's systematically portrayed as an alcoholic. Having a drinking age set at 21 is very extreme. And having drinking exclusively in places where children aren't allowed means that there is no gradual build up to reasonable adult drinking. 

    Adults will also tend to behave better in a café if there are children around.    


    Offline AnthonyPadua

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    Question on Marijuana use
    « Reply #545 on: Yesterday at 05:56:48 AM »
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  • If someone has medicinal marijuana and gives a little to someone else to use is that a sin? Would the receiving person who uses the medicinal marijuana be committing a sin if they don't have a script for it?

    Offline Fiorenza

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    Re: Question on Marijuana use
    « Reply #546 on: Yesterday at 06:36:46 AM »
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  • If someone has medicinal marijuana and gives a little to someone else to use is that a sin? Would the receiving person who uses the medicinal marijuana be committing a sin if they don't have a script for it?
    For what purpose do they need the THC for?

    Offline AnthonyPadua

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    Re: Question on Marijuana use
    « Reply #547 on: Yesterday at 07:15:42 AM »
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  • For what purpose do they need the THC for?
    For what purpose does one need alcohol or cigars for? It's not your business.


    Offline Crayolcold

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #548 on: Yesterday at 08:53:06 AM »
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  • Marijuana (rightly) has a stigma attached to it that makes it seem trashy. The smell is enough to render it much more disagreeable than alcohol or tobacco. Look at the members of society who abuse marijuana and what type of people they are. By smoking marijuana, you would be casting your lots with them. 

    There is more to the argument than simply the ability or inability for marijuana to cause the complete loss of reason.

    1) Stigma attached makes it completely scandalous and in most traditional circles will result in complete irreparable loss of reputation.
    2) Scientific studies have proven beyond any doubt that marijuana use destroys brain matter, causes insomnia, contributes to the development of schizophrenia in adulthood, and makes you gαy, etc, etc.
    3) I have friends who had smoked marijuana daily before becoming traditional catholic. They are unanimous in agreeing that marijuana use is 100% a mortal sin.
    4) Not an academic argument, but look at Rome (built by alcoholics) vs Portland (built by stoners)
    5) The only reason a sheltered traditional catholic child would ever try marijuana is because they were given the impetus to as a result of some gαy rebellious desire, which presumes that they know that it is stigmatized and bad.
    6) Its gαy and retarded
    7) Just drink alcohol like your European ancestors have for 6000 years
    8) "Ohhh brrruuhhhh I feel so chilll right now brruuhhh" it makes you talk and act like a retard. Whereas alcohol amplifies charisma in the charismatic, industriousness in the inquisitive, and geniality in the sociable. 

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    Offline AnthonyPadua

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #549 on: Yesterday at 09:38:47 AM »
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  • Marijuana (rightly) has a stigma attached to it that makes it seem trashy. The smell is enough to render it much more disagreeable than alcohol or tobacco.
    Weak argument as someone can use a vapouriser completely bypassing the smell and health defects of smoke.

    Look at the members of society who abuse marijuana and what type of people they are. By smoking marijuana, you would be casting your lots with them.
     Strawman. Plenty of successful people drink alcohol, and plenty of 'unsuccessful' people drink alcohol. By driving a car you are like bad drivers? Or are you like good drivers. "Look at people who abuse alcohol"

    There is more to the argument than simply the ability or inability for marijuana to cause the complete loss of reason.
    Overuse of alcohol can also cause the loss of reason. Why are you using that marijuana usage = getting high?

    1) Stigma attached makes it completely scandalous and in most traditional circles will result in complete irreparable loss of reputation.
    No one said anything about public use or around trads

    2) Scientific studies have proven beyond any doubt that marijuana use destroys brain matter, causes insomnia, contributes to the development of schizophrenia in adulthood, and makes you gαy, etc, etc.
    Some of these are just outright lies (making you gαy :facepalm:) . Also people can develop the same issues from alcohol. Schizophrenia for example has to do with those who have dispositions for it...

    3) I have friends who had smoked marijuana daily before becoming traditional catholic. They are unanimous in agreeing that marijuana use is 100% a mortal sin.
    Sounds like someone who lacked discipline and now projects that onto others. "I drank alcohol everyday that means drinking alcohol is 100% a mortal sin"

    4) Not an academic argument, but look at Rome (built by alcoholics) vs Portland (built by stoners)
    :facepalm: modern alcohol is very different from past alcohol, pesticides, cleaning Chemicals used on the barrels and other factors. Where the romans drunk or just had some alcohol?

    5) The only reason a sheltered traditional catholic child would ever try marijuana is because they were given the impetus to as a result of some gαy rebellious desire, which presumes that they know that it is stigmatized and bad.
    "The only reason a sheltered traditional catholic child would ever try ALCOHOL/CIGARS is because they were given the impetus to as a result of some gαy rebellious desire, which presumes that they know that it is stigmatized and bad."

    6) Its gαy and retarded
    You already had ridiculous points earlier but this is clearly nonsense (aka brainwashing cope, there is no logic and reason here)

    7) Just drink alcohol like your European ancestors have for 6000 years
    A certain Catholic saint used marijuana for health reasons perhaps you've heard of Saint Hildegard? Also you do realise that many plants were used by people in the past before Jєωιѕн companies banned them because of (((reasons)))?

    8) "Ohhh brrruuhhhh I feel so chilll right now brruuhhh" it makes you talk and act like a retard. Whereas alcohol amplifies charisma in the charismatic, industriousness in the inquisitive, and geniality in the sociable.
    :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: you are comparing someone high to someone who had a little of alcohol. If you have too much alcohol you also become retarded. Also alcohol doesn't effect everyone in the same way.
    seriously is this a satire post? Are trads really making illogical nonsense propaganda point and fallacies??? Huh?

    Offline AnthonyPadua

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #550 on: Yesterday at 09:39:38 AM »
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  • Marijuana (rightly) has a stigma attached to it that makes it seem trashy. The smell is enough to render it much more disagreeable than alcohol or tobacco. Look at the members of society who abuse marijuana and what type of people they are. By smoking marijuana, you would be casting your lots with them.
    .
    Also smoke smells bad regardless of what one smokes. Even if it's just tobacco it still smells terrible.


    Offline WorldsAway

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #551 on: Yesterday at 09:43:29 AM »
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  • 1) Stigma attached makes it completely scandalous and in most traditional circles will result in complete irreparable loss of reputation.

    That's not what scandal is and I don't think we are obligated to cater to other people's erroneously formed biases. That's their problem to fix, to hell with human respect 

    2) Scientific studies have proven beyond any doubt that marijuana use destroys brain matter, causes insomnia, contributes to the development of schizophrenia in adulthood, and makes you gαy, etc, etc.

    Alcohol can destroy brain matter and cause insomnia. Schizophrenia development is associated with heavy use of high THC cannabis. Just as with alcohol, moderate use of lower THC cannabis will not be significantly harmful and it is used (successfully) for a variety of therapeutic reasons

    3) I have friends who had smoked marijuana daily before becoming traditional catholic. They are unanimous in agreeing that marijuana use is 100% a mortal sin.

    Doesn't matter what your friends think. 

    4) Not an academic argument, but look at Rome (built by alcoholics) vs Portland (built by stoners)

    Stereotyping

    5) The only reason a sheltered traditional catholic child would ever try marijuana is because they were given the impetus to as a result of some gαy rebellious desire, which presumes that they know that it is stigmatized and bad.

    See above

    6) Its gαy and retarded

    See above

    7) Just drink alcohol like your European ancestors have for 6000 years

    See above 

    8) "Ohhh brrruuhhhh I feel so chilll right now brruuhhh" it makes you talk and act like a retard. Whereas alcohol amplifies charisma in the charismatic, industriousness in the inquisitive, and geniality in the sociable.
     
    See above

    (I do not consume alcohol or use cannabis)
    John 15:19  If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

    Offline AnthonyPadua

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    Re: Question on Marijuana use
    « Reply #552 on: Yesterday at 09:45:06 AM »
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  • If someone has medicinal marijuana and gives a little to someone else to use is that a sin? Would the receiving person who uses the medicinal marijuana be committing a sin if they don't have a script for it?
    I was hoping to see a proper rational comment on this particular situation. As certain substances are illegal in some countries due to (((reasons))) yet that doesn't make the law just.

    If we compare someone having a little of alcohol it's not a sin, likewise marijuana usage isn't a sin if it's a little (i.e not losing your ability to reason).

    So it becomes a factor of the law. Since in terms of the use of reason sin can be avoided by taking low dosages of a substance. Yet does "breaking the law" count as a sin if the law is unjust or is a small matter?

    Offline WorldsAway

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    Re: Marijuana use sinful for Catholics?
    « Reply #553 on: Yesterday at 09:53:41 AM »
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  • When God creates a plant that can be used as a natural medicine to treat pain, nausea, anxiety, seizures, insomnia, etc. but 12,000 years later trads (i.e., people with zero authority, lay or clergy) will authoritatively define its usage as a mortal sin in any and all cases. Crazy :incense:
    John 15:19  If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

    Offline Mithrandylan

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    Re: Question on Marijuana use
    « Reply #554 on: Yesterday at 10:06:45 AM »
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  • If someone has medicinal marijuana and gives a little to someone else to use is that a sin? Would the receiving person who uses the medicinal marijuana be committing a sin if they don't have a script for it?
    It seems the state has a right to regulate the use of marijuana so if one lives in a jurisdiction where a medical script would be necessary for lawful use of any kind, that would be sinful. 

    If the person without the script manifested their will to use it unlawfully otherwise (say, intemperately) that would also be a sin. 

    Otherwise I don't think so. 
    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).