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Offline cassini

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Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
« on: June 19, 2024, 12:14:06 PM »
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    • Reports: Vatican planning to enforce a ‘final’ ban of Traditional Latin Mass, likely on July 16

    Sources told Rorate Caeli that Vatican officials want to ban the Latin Mass in a manner ‘as wide, final, and irreversible as possible,’ and a source informed LifeSiteNews that this ban is likely to be issued on the three-year anniversary of Traditionis Custodes.

    (LifeSiteNews) — Several “credible” sources informed a traditional Catholic media outlet that the Vatican is planning to issue a docuмent “banning” the Traditional Latin Mass, and a source informed LifeSiteNews that this will likely occur on July 16.

    “An attempt is being made to implement, as soon as possible, a Vatican docuмent with a stringent, radical, and final solution banning the Traditional Latin Mass,” reported Rorate Caeli on Monday, which attributed the news to “the most credible sources, in different continents,” including from “circles close to” Cardinal Arthur Roche, the prefect for the Dicastery for Divine Worship.

    These sources are reportedly “the very same… who first revealed that a docuмent like Traditionis Custodes would come” and also “revealed to Rorate that the Vatican had sent out a survey to bishops” on their implementation of the TLM following Pope Benedict XVI’s 2007 motu proprio Summorum Pontificuм, which allowed widespread use of the Latin Mass.

    Those planning this “final” suppression of the TLM are said by Rorate to be “frustrated” with the “apparently slow results” of Pope Francis’ Latin Mass-restricting docuмent Traditionis Custodes, particularly in the U.S. and France, and “want to ban it and shut it down everywhere and immediately.”

    READ: Cardinal Sarah: Rejection of traditional liturgy, morals are forms of ‘practical atheism’ in the Church

    These Vatican prelates, which by implication include Pope Francis and at least require his consent, reportedly wish to make this Latin Mass ban “as wide, final and irreversible as possible.” Rorate Caeli is urging people in all states of life to “prevent the ban from becoming a concrete measure.”

    LifeSiteNews has received information indicating that a likely date for these expected  restrictions is July 16, the anniversary of the implementation of Traditionis Custodes.

    Cardinal Raymond Burke recently highlighted the fact that Traditionis Custodes has in one sense backfired, because it has intensified and multiplied attraction to the Mass of the Ages. The cardinal stated:

    If the intention with the latest legislation Traditionis Custodes and other docuмents which followed it was to discourage or to decrease the attraction of the holy liturgy according to the Usus Antiquior, it had, I would say, the exactly opposite effect.

    “This,” he added, “should not be surprising. One has to think that a form of the Roman rite which has nourished so profoundly and produced so many saints, the declared saints, even let’s say hidden saints, it is not possible that this rite be canceled, that it be eliminated from the life of the Church.”

    Pope Benedict XVI himself clarified through his motu proprio Summorum Pontificuм that the Latin Mass was never abolished and that no priest needs his bishop’s permission to offer it, stating, “What earlier generations held as sacred, remains sacred and great for us too, and it cannot be all of a sudden entirely forbidden or even considered harmful.”
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    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #1 on: June 19, 2024, 12:17:10 PM »
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    • But you want to perform Buddhist ceremonies in (formerly-)Catholic churches?, then more power to you.

    Jorge Bergoglio is likely possessed by the devil.
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    Offline cassini

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #2 on: June 19, 2024, 12:49:59 PM »
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    • In August 1649, the Puritan Oliver Cromwell, a British military and political leader invaded Ireland to quell an anti-Protestant revolt, conquering all the Irish who opposed him. In response to Cromwell’s campaign to destroy the Christian Kingdom of Ireland, the Catholic Ecclesiastical Congregation of the Kingdom of Ireland met at Clonmacnoise on the 4th of December 1649, and issued a Motu Proprio, with reference to the English government’s intention to ‘extirpate’ (eradicate or destroy completely) the Catholic religion, warning Catholics not to be deceived by those supposedly acting in the name of God.  Given the universal nature of a proprio motu, i.e., a message for ‘all nations’, we feel there is a continuity and connection between the three elements mentioned here.   
       
    ‘Take away the Mass, destroy the Church’ said Martin Luther. ‘The Devil has always, by means of heretics, to deprive the world of the Mass. Making them precursors of the Antichrist, who before anything else, will try to abolish, and will actually abolish the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass as a punishment for the sins of men, according to the prediction of Daniel, “and strength was given him against the continual Sacrifice.”’--- St Alphonsus.

    It was Cromwell who imposed the Penal Laws against the majority of Roman Catholics in Ireland, as well as confiscating a substantial amount of their lands and dwellings. These were a series of laws imposed in an attempt to force Irish Roman Catholics to accept the Protestantism of England. Cromwell, that docuмented Satanist who conquered in the name of his god, was one of the first to usurp the divine right of kings by purging his own Charles I of England, a Protestant married to a Catholic, and replacing him with the beginnings of freemasonic ‘democracy,’ where secular men and not kings subservient to God would rule the world according to their own laws. Cromwell, who committed untold atrocities against the Catholic Irish, first and foremost hated the Catholic Mass. A champion of ‘liberty of conscience’ or ‘religious liberty,’ but this liberty did not include the traditional Latin Mass. Cromwell, a Satanist, knew that the Mass of all time, the Mass of Trent, the Council that condemned Protestantism, was the lifeblood of Catholicism. He knew that to destroy the Mass was to destroy the priesthood, and destroy the Catholic Faith. Accordingly, Catholic priests were killed and expelled, with penalties as severe as death to those caught saying the Mass and punishment for those Catholics caught attending it. Here is a picture depicting Cromwell’s soldiers finding such a Mass.


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    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #3 on: June 19, 2024, 01:05:54 PM »
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    • Quote
    Reports: Vatican planning to enforce a ‘final’ ban of Traditional Latin Mass, likely on July 16
    Wonder if Francis will keel over the day before.  At some point, God will intervene.
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    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #4 on: June 19, 2024, 01:17:09 PM »
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    • Quote from: Pax Vobis on June 19, 2024, 01:05:54 PM
    Wonder if Francis will keel over the day before.  At some point, God will intervene.

    He's done just as bad already and nothing's happened to him yet.  Bergoglio is God's chastisment upon the world at this point.  I imagine that if Bergoglio definitively and completely shuts down the Tridentine Mass in the Conciliar Church, it'll give the fence-sitters who currently attend Motu Masses one last chance to decide whether they're for or against Christ and the Catholic Church.
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    Offline songbird

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #5 on: June 19, 2024, 01:46:01 PM »
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    • Will this affect SSPX since they get jurisdiction for priest from Rome?
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    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #6 on: June 19, 2024, 02:15:41 PM »
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    • Quote from: cassini on June 19, 2024, 12:14:06 PM


    Reports: Vatican planning to enforce a ‘final’ ban of Traditional Latin Mass, likely on July 16

    Sources told Rorate Caeli that Vatican officials want to ban the Latin Mass in a manner ‘as wide, final, and irreversible as possible,’ and a source informed LifeSiteNews that this ban is likely to be issued on the three-year anniversary of Traditionis Custodes.

    (LifeSiteNews) — Several “credible” sources informed a traditional Catholic media outlet that the Vatican is planning to issue a docuмent “banning” the Traditional Latin Mass, and a source informed LifeSiteNews that this will likely occur on July 16.

    Quo Primum:

    Quote
    Let all everywhere adopt and observe what has been handed down by the Holy Roman Church, the Mother
    and Teacher of the other churches, and let Masses not be sung or read according to any other formula than
    that of this Missal published by Us. This ordinance applies henceforth, now, and forever, throughout all the
    provinces of the Christian world, to all patriarchs, cathedral churches, collegiate and parish churches, be they
    secular or religious, both of men and of women – even of military orders – and of churches or chapels
    without a specific congregation in which conventual Masses are sung aloud in choir or read privately in
    accord with the rites and customs of the Roman Church. This Missal is to be used by all churches, even by
    those which in their authorization are made exempt, whether by Apostolic indult, custom, or privilege, or even if by oath or official confirmation of the Holy See, or have their rights and faculties guaranteed to them by any other manner whatsoever.


    I know the NO crooks are planning to do a "‘re-reception,’ ‘re-interpretation,’ ‘official interpretation,’ ‘updated commentary,’ or even ‘rewording’ of the teachings of Vatican I,” but I have not heard of them doing anything like that with Quo Primum. 
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    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline Michelle

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #7 on: June 19, 2024, 06:02:27 PM »
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    • There will probably emerge an alliance of neo-conservative Latin Mass observers.  Burke, Snyder, Sarah, Fraternity of Saint Peter.  But doctrine will be lacking.  IMO
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    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #8 on: June 19, 2024, 06:05:37 PM »
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    • Quote from: Michelle on June 19, 2024, 06:02:27 PM
    There will probably emerge an alliance of neo-conservative Latin Mass observers.  Burke, Snyder, Sarah, Fraternity of Saint Peter.  But doctrine will be lacking.  IMO

    I think those "conservatives" you mention are all talk and no action, as per usual.  FSSP will probably be given an exemption, since you still need to try drawing in SSPX types, or at least to compete with SSPX.
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    Offline St Giles

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #9 on: June 19, 2024, 07:30:51 PM »
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    • No need to compete with the SSPX, just drive all the indult trads into the SSPX to dilute and corrupt them with modernism, liberalism, and doubtful sacraments, which may lead to doubtful new bishops, a happy Bp Fellay, and so on.
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    "Seek first the kingdom of Heaven..."
    "Every idle word that men shall speak, they shall render an account for it in the day of judgment"

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #10 on: June 19, 2024, 07:31:49 PM »
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    • Yes, the fence sitters will have to choose between the cause of Jesus Christ and the cause of satan.

    It's not a minor political point. It's a life or death eternal struggle with none other than Jesus Christ at the head of one side, and the prince of darkness at the head of the other side. Actually if the stakes "life or death" were 1 cent, this struggle would be a trillion dollars. How is that possible? Because we're talking the eternal destiny of hundreds of millions of souls, going to HEAVEN or HELL for eternity. Not mere mortal bodies which were destined to die eventually anyway.

    So yeah -- setting up "illicit" Traditional chapels and doing the "Traditional Catholic" thing is not only on the table, it's the only prudent choice.

    I hope the majority of "Indulters" make the right choice. Because they are going to have to choose. And any wise man could have seen it coming. I mean come on! Look at the state of the (Conciliar, mainstream) Catholic Church! Does it look like it's having a change of direction to you? Have you been *awake* at all during the pontificate of Pope Francis? In what delusional fantasy world is Rome undergoing a renaissance of Tradition, or a conversion away from Modernism?

    Certainly not in the reality sane men are living in.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #11 on: June 19, 2024, 07:38:03 PM »
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    • When YOU know it's an objective battle between good and evil,

    and EVIL is shutting down its diabolical "halfway house", forcing people to choose between something like the Traditional movement (apparent disobedience?) and evil -- I think that's a GOOD thing.

    Let the seriousness and gravity of the battle we're fighting be exposed and illuminated for the whole world to see.

    Because most people simply ADORE the Indult option. All the smells & bells of the Traditional movement, with none of the downside. And that is such a fake position that shouldn't exist. The Conciliar Church, at its core, is the eternal opponent of Catholic Tradition which is just another term for God and the Catholic Faith. Remember, the Catholic Faith is inherently Traditional. So how can satan allow something good? He can't -- at least not long term. The infernal enemy will only allow a limited good for a time, for his own far-reaching ends.
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    Offline AgentOfDust

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #12 on: June 19, 2024, 09:58:03 PM »
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    • I'm in catechism and not yet baptized so I'm admittedly a neophyte when it comes to everything, but something has never made sense.

    If the Novus Ordo is preaching what is essentially religious pluralism, then what would it matter to them that people want the TLM? If you're going to tell me that jews, buddhists, protestants and even atheists can get to heaven, then why would I care what you have to say about people that are holding the same mass that's been in place for nearly 2000 years? If you're wrong and I'm right, I go to heaven. If I'm wrong and you're right, I still go to heaven.

    It has to be about obedience. The salvation of souls is lex suprema, not obedience.

    I'm not going to stop my journey through Catholicism, but man did I ever pick a time to join. :laugh1:
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    Offline Seraphina

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #13 on: June 20, 2024, 01:11:49 AM »
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    • Forcing a choice on fence sitters is an issue that affects a relatively small number of Catholics and is limited to within the Church.  There are splits within religious groups all the time.  They affect a limited number of people.  If Francis wants his ruling to have global influence, it needs to have much more at stake than yet another religious split.  A full on ban of the Latin Mass would require the support of the globalists and the elite, meaning, the RSP as Bp. W. calls them.  It would need power of law on the multinational and global scale to have a truly global impact, as in, attendance at Latin Mass at risk of your freedom, your money, your ability to function in society, and ultimately, your life.  He doesn’t (yet) possess such power to enact life and death laws.  A ban on diocesan based TLM will have no effect on me.  Many traditionalists already hear Mass and receive Sacraments outside the official n.o. structure. Excommunicating trads who are not part of the official diocesan system is like getting fired from a job you don’t hold, or being expelled from a school you don’t attend.  Meaningless.  
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    Online Simeon

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    Re: Final Ban on Latin Tridentine Mass
    « Reply #14 on: June 20, 2024, 04:46:38 AM »
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    • Quote from: AgentOfDust on June 19, 2024, 09:58:03 PM
    I'm in catechism and not yet baptized so I'm admittedly a neophyte when it comes to everything, but something has never made sense.

    If the Novus Ordo is preaching what is essentially religious pluralism, then what would it matter to them that people want the TLM? If you're going to tell me that Jєωs, buddhists, protestants and even atheists can get to heaven, then why would I care what you have to say about people that are holding the same mass that's been in place for nearly 2000 years? If you're wrong and I'm right, I go to heaven. If I'm wrong and you're right, I still go to heaven.

    It has to be about obedience. The salvation of souls is lex suprema, not obedience.

    I'm not going to stop my journey through Catholicism, but man did I ever pick a time to join. :laugh1:

    You are a modern miracle! 😎
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