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Author Topic: Pray for me, as I struggle through the crisis  (Read 3758 times)

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Offline Jim

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Pray for me, as I struggle through the crisis
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2012, 12:33:37 AM »
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  • OK. When and how is the best way to contact him?

    Offline Gregory I

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    « Reply #16 on: February 01, 2012, 12:47:18 AM »
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  • Fr. Zapp is near there.


    Offline Exilenomore

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    « Reply #17 on: February 01, 2012, 05:39:30 PM »
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  • Jim,

    Hang in there. You need to take a deep breath and stop panicking. I know it may be hard but it's necessary. I don't know the answer to much of your questions, but I do know that God has permitted the mess the world is in to take place, and we are in it and have to save our souls in it. You need to have hope.

    At some point God will say "enough", and He will exalt His Holy Church before the faces of her enemies, and all will be forced to admit that God has been, and is with her. It will also become clear to all that her sacred virginity has always remained intact, and that she has never defected.

    The poison of heresy will be extinguished, and all blasphemous tongues will be silenced, but the truth of God remains forever firm.

    I don't feel competent to answer all these questions you put forth, and especially not on a public forum, I just wanted to tell you to trust in God. He will not abandon those who sincerely seek His help. And please pray the Rosary, but you probably already do that.

    If you need to talk, feel free to pm.

    Offline Raoul76

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    « Reply #18 on: February 02, 2012, 12:38:39 AM »
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  • Sorry, missed your message last night.  I'll PM you.

    I would just call at any time except on Sunday when he's saying Mass ;)  He has been assigned to London, Ontario now, you can see the times on their webpage.  I think with his soothing mildness he is right for you at this time.  Father Dominic has a huge congregation, saying three Masses on Sunday, and seems to be constantly on the go.    
    Readers: Please IGNORE all my postings here. I was a recent convert and fell into errors, even heresy for which hopefully my ignorance excuses. These include rejecting the "rhythm method," rejecting the idea of "implicit faith," and being brieflfy quasi-Jansenist. I also posted occasions of sins and links to occasions of sin, not understanding the concept much at the time, so do not follow my links.

    Offline Jim

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    « Reply #19 on: February 02, 2012, 01:44:00 AM »
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  • Thanks Exile and Raoul.

    I am out of "panic mode," so to speak. I am honestly trying to live the Faith with a sensus Catholicus.


    Offline Trinity

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    « Reply #20 on: February 03, 2012, 07:12:36 PM »
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  • Jim, sorry for not reading this sooner.  I just wanted you to know that God doesn't expect us to work miracles.  You must do the best you can with what you've got.   "As for the invalid sacraments we both went through,  I always thought that was the devil's dirtiest trick and that is what made me angry for a long time.  Even years after finding the Church I worried about making up lost time in the confessional.  In despair I went to confession and threw the book at myself.  There just is no way to cover all the ground after so many many years.

    +RIP
    Please pray for the repose of her soul.

    Offline Santo Subito

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    « Reply #21 on: February 04, 2012, 12:02:27 PM »
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  • John Lane and Fr. Cekada have as much authority to judge rites of the Church as your postman.

    You need to apply the same skepticism and cynicism you have for the NO to their arguments. It is undeniable that they have a vested interest in saying NO rites aren't valid as they want to funnel people towards Sede chapels exclusively. Preferably their Sede chapel. It is Protestantism all over again.

    The dilemma you find yourself in should be a red flag that somewhere along the way there is a flaw in your reasoning. Even the Society admits NO rites are valid. Michael Davies wrote a great peice as to why the ordination and consecration rites are still valid.

    I think you sell Our Lord short. He left us an indefectible, visible, hierarchical Church that will last to the end of time. This Church must have valid rites when they are approved for use by the universal Church.

    Read "The Great Facade". You'll see that this Crisis is a facade of optional novelties binding on no one. There have been severe crises in the Church before and Catholics did not become Sedes, except the Protestants who rejected the Papacy and the Pope.

    Your priest is a valid and holy priest. Keep going there. Consult him on these issues. Don't isolate yourself in your room reinventing the wheel giving yourself ulcers. Is that from God? Are you infallible? Did God found a Church so it could disappear and leave you to find the path to Heaven yourself on the Internet? Did he annoint John Lane and Fr. C as vicars of Christ?

    Only the devil wants you living like this. He's playing you like a violin appealing to your anger, pride, and fears to isolate you from the sacraments, have you hate the visible Church and lead yourself and your family into despair and a loss of Faith.

    You'll have my prayers.

    Offline rowsofvoices9

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    « Reply #22 on: February 04, 2012, 01:01:22 PM »
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  • Quote from: Santo Subito
    John Lane and Fr. Cekada have as much authority to judge rites of the Church as your postman.

    You need to apply the same skepticism and cynicism you have for the NO to their arguments. It is undeniable that they have a vested interest in saying NO rites aren't valid as they want to funnel people towards Sede chapels exclusively. Preferably their Sede chapel. It is Protestantism all over again.

    The dilemma you find yourself in should be a red flag that somewhere along the way there is a flaw in your reasoning. Even the Society admits NO rites are valid. Michael Davies wrote a great peice as to why the ordination and consecration rites are still valid.

    I think you sell Our Lord short. He left us an indefectible, visible, hierarchical Church that will last to the end of time. This Church must have valid rites when they are approved for use by the universal Church.

    Read "The Great Facade". You'll see that this Crisis is a facade of optional novelties binding on no one. There have been severe crises in the Church before and Catholics did not become Sedes, except the Protestants who rejected the Papacy and the Pope.

    Your priest is a valid and holy priest. Keep going there. Consult him on these issues. Don't isolate yourself in your room reinventing the wheel giving yourself ulcers. Is that from God? Are you infallible? Did God found a Church so it could disappear and leave you to find the path to Heaven yourself on the Internet? Did he annoint John Lane and Fr. C as vicars of Christ?

    Only the devil wants you living like this. He's playing you like a violin appealing to your anger, pride, and fears to isolate you from the sacraments, have you hate the visible Church and lead yourself and your family into despair and a loss of Faith.

    You'll have my prayers.


    The voice of reason and true charity has spoken.

    Jim have you considered that your scrupulosity might be psychological in origin, a form of OCD?  In addition to heeding  Santo Subito's advice, I would suggest that I might be to your advantage to seek out a good Catholic psychologist or psychiatrist.  Trust me, I know from personal experience (maybe not as extreme as yours) the damage scruples can to a persons spiritual progress and how they can rob you of all interior peace.  My particular brand of scrupulosity manifests itself in the inability to distinguish the difference between mortal and venial sin.  How I've tortured myself, was my sin mortal or venial, did I sin or was I merely tempted?  On and on, over and over again.  The scruples truly are the devils playground.

    How richly God has blessed you in having access to a holy and orthodox priest.  Listen to him and be obedient to his spiritual direction.  All the good spiritual writers insist on complete obedience and docility to your priest to overcome the scruples.  I personally have made great progress been greatly healed of this malady (not completely, still suffer relapses at times) just by frequent confession.

    I have also found the following resources extremely helpful in understanding and overcoming scrupulosity.

    For me personally the first rule direct from the Catholic Encyclopedia: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13640a.htm

    They are not bound to repeat anything of former confessions unless they are sure without protracted examination, that it is a mortal sin and has never been properly confessed.

    http://www.catholicpamphlets.net/pamphlets/Are%20You%20Scrupulous.pdf  
    http://www.fathersofmercy.com/our_apostolates/missionaries/menezes/ten_commandments_scrupulosity.pdf
    http://mission.liguori.org/newsletters/pdf_archive/SA_0809.pdf Part One
    http://mission.liguori.org/newsletters/pdf_archive/SA_0909.pdf Part Two
    http://mission.liguori.org/newsletters/pdf_archive/SA_1009.pdf Part Three
    http://mission.liguori.org/newsletters/scrupulosity.htm Ten Commandments for the Scrupulous

    A series of excellent treatises by an FSSP priest on scruples, and how to overcome them. They're only available in pdf form

    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity_I.pdf
    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity_II_02.01_.pdf
    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity,_III.pdf
    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity_IV.pdf
    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity_V_2009-05-10.pdf
    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity_VI_2009-05-17.pdf
    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity_VII_2009-06-07.pdf
    http://www.olmcfssp.org/cms/images/uploads/On_Scrupulosity_VIII_2009-06-14.pdf

    Although I don't visit this forum on a regular basis, rest assured I'll remember you in my prayers.  
    My conscience compels me to make this disclaimer lest God judges me partly culpable for the errors and heresy promoted on this forum... For the record I support neither Sedevacantism or the SSPX.  I do not define myself as either a traditionalist or Novus


    Offline Raoul76

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    « Reply #23 on: February 04, 2012, 01:49:16 PM »
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  • Santo Subito said:  
    Quote
    John Lane and Fr. Cekada have as much authority to judge rites of the Church as your postman.

    You need to apply the same skepticism and cynicism you have for the NO to their arguments. It is undeniable that they have a vested interest in saying NO rites aren't valid as they want to funnel people towards Sede chapels exclusively. Preferably their Sede chapel. It is Protestantism all over again.


    What is John Lane's vested interest in bringing people to sede chapels, sir?  
    Readers: Please IGNORE all my postings here. I was a recent convert and fell into errors, even heresy for which hopefully my ignorance excuses. These include rejecting the "rhythm method," rejecting the idea of "implicit faith," and being brieflfy quasi-Jansenist. I also posted occasions of sins and links to occasions of sin, not understanding the concept much at the time, so do not follow my links.

    Offline Raoul76

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    « Reply #24 on: February 04, 2012, 01:55:07 PM »
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  • I can't get the formating on this post to work, so forget it.
    Readers: Please IGNORE all my postings here. I was a recent convert and fell into errors, even heresy for which hopefully my ignorance excuses. These include rejecting the "rhythm method," rejecting the idea of "implicit faith," and being brieflfy quasi-Jansenist. I also posted occasions of sins and links to occasions of sin, not understanding the concept much at the time, so do not follow my links.

    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    « Reply #25 on: February 04, 2012, 04:21:26 PM »
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  • Santo Subito, with all due respect, your post is a primary example of why people should get the heck out of the Vatican II church. You used nothing but illogical fallacies in an attempt to support your overall absurd claim.

    Quote
    John Lane and Fr. Cekada have as much authority to judge rites of the Church as your postman.


    So when you defend the NO, aren't you making the same judgements? Isn't that a double standard?

    Quote
    You need to apply the same skepticism and cynicism you have for the NO to their arguments. It is undeniable that they have a vested interest in saying NO rites aren't valid as they want to funnel people towards Sede chapels exclusively. Preferably their Sede chapel. It is Protestantism all over again.


    You're lying here. John Lane is a layman who lives in Australia, first of all, so do you really think he's going to try to lure people to the chapel he attends? And if you want the definition of Protestantism, go to the Bogus Ordo.

    Quote
    The dilemma you find yourself in should be a red flag that somewhere along the way there is a flaw in your reasoning.


    Ditto.

    Quote
    Even the Society admits NO rites are valid.


    ...provided, of course, that the priest offering it has the proper intentions, though even then there is no gaurantee it's valid. Either way, the Society says that it's a mortal sin to attend the NO if you know it's wrong. And it is wrong.

    Quote
    I think you sell Our Lord short. He left us an indefectible, visible, hierarchical Church that will last to the end of time. This Church must have valid rites when they are approved for use by the universal Church.


    The Traditional Latin Mass is a valid rite. In fact, it is THE rite of the Church. The Bogus Ordo is exactly what its name implies: bogus.

    Quote
    Read "The Great Facade". You'll see that this Crisis is a facade of optional novelties binding on no one. There have been severe crises in the Church before and Catholics did not become Sedes, except the Protestants who rejected the Papacy and the Pope.


    That is flat out illogical. The crisis is that there is a sacreligious mass, that the true Mass is limited, and that the Dogmas of the Church have been tossed aside along with Tradition thanks to the modernists and heretics who were responsible for Vatican II. That's precisely what the Third Secret was about. But I know, you Bogus Ordites think it was about JPII getting shot. He survived that gun shot, so why would that be of enough significance to be a Secret of Fatima? You are falling for lies from satan.

    And the reason people didn't become sedes during prior crisises is because the Papacies of the Popes during that time were not questionable, because they weren't responsible for the crisis!

    Quote
    Only the devil wants you living like this. He's playing you like a violin appealing to your anger, pride, and fears to isolate you from the sacraments, have you hate the visible Church and lead yourself and your family into despair and a loss of Faith.


    I think it's the other way around. The devil is playing people like you, fooling you into believing everything is a-ok in the Church today; That Vatican II was a true council and that the NO is a valid Mass with no errors.

    You'll have my prayers as well, Santo. You probably need them even more than Jim does.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.


    Offline s2srea

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    « Reply #26 on: February 04, 2012, 08:57:39 PM »
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  • I'm sure all this back and forth is really helping Jim... :facepalm:

    Just sayin....

    Offline Jim

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    « Reply #27 on: February 05, 2012, 02:56:28 AM »
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  • I agree with Santo Subito that I should not believe anything a sedevacantist tells me without researching the issue, studying, and praying myself. I really do not want to debate the issue, and I am very afraid. I hope it is God's will to make everything clear, but I should not wait for a miracle. I do not like arguing the sedevacante issue with anyone, my own personal reasons for this.

    Rowsofvoices, thank you for your kind regards about my scruples. Thank you for the resources with which you provided me. I have a friend who is specifically a traditional Catholic forensic psychiatrist, but I don't know about seeing him, since he is a friend after all. I think prayer, the proper attitude, and a good professor will help me, by the grace of God.

    Offline curiouscatholic23

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    « Reply #28 on: February 05, 2012, 03:20:28 PM »
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  • Quote from: Jim
    I agree with Santo Subito that I should not believe anything a sedevacantist tells me without researching the issue, studying, and praying myself. I really do not want to debate the issue, and I am very afraid. I hope it is God's will to make everything clear, but I should not wait for a miracle. I do not like arguing the sedevacante issue with anyone, my own personal reasons for this.

    Rowsofvoices, thank you for your kind regards about my scruples. Thank you for the resources with which you provided me. I have a friend who is specifically a traditional Catholic forensic psychiatrist, but I don't know about seeing him, since he is a friend after all. I think prayer, the proper attitude, and a good professor will help me, by the grace of God.


    Jim I've been reading your posts and I can relate to the depression and the despair. Almost all of my family is either heretical novus ordo or fallen away agnostic. Its terrible.

    And the truth is, almost all priests out there are heretics. Its important you know this. Even the majority of those in the SSPX, CMRI, SSPV, whatever.

    They are heretics because they deny that believing in Jesus Christ is even necessary for salvation. They call it "invincible ignorance." Some may not, but "invincible ignorance" is the society's official position. Its terrible, but its the way it is.

    please pm me if you are interested.

    Offline curiouscatholic23

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    « Reply #29 on: February 05, 2012, 03:27:58 PM »
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  • Quote from: Cupertino
    Quote from: curiouscatholic23
    Quote from: Jim
    I agree with Santo Subito that I should not believe anything a sedevacantist tells me without researching the issue, studying, and praying myself. I really do not want to debate the issue, and I am very afraid. I hope it is God's will to make everything clear, but I should not wait for a miracle. I do not like arguing the sedevacante issue with anyone, my own personal reasons for this.

    Rowsofvoices, thank you for your kind regards about my scruples. Thank you for the resources with which you provided me. I have a friend who is specifically a traditional Catholic forensic psychiatrist, but I don't know about seeing him, since he is a friend after all. I think prayer, the proper attitude, and a good professor will help me, by the grace of God.


    Jim I've been reading your posts and I can relate to the depression and the despair. Almost all of my family is either heretical novus ordo or fallen away agnostic. Its terrible.

    And the truth is, almost all priests out there are heretics. Its important you know this. Even the majority of those in the SSPX, CMRI, SSPV, whatever.

    They are heretics because they deny that believing in Jesus Christ is even necessary for salvation. They call it "invincible ignorance." Some may not, but "invincible ignorance" is the society's official position. Its terrible, but its the way it is.

    please pm me if you are interested.


    Jim, don't listen to Curious. Curiosity killed the cat. He is WAY out there!





    Explicit Belief in Jesus Christ and the holy trinity is "way out there"?