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Poll

What does Cum Ex expect us to do about Francis?

Judge or insist that he is not pope?
0 (0%)
Decide if he is pope or not?
0 (0%)
Contradict him? (do not deviate from the faith with him)
1 (12.5%)
Acknowledge without any declaration being necessary that he deviated from the faith or was heretic before his election and therefore is no pope at all because his election was null and void.
5 (62.5%)
Other (please explain)
2 (25%)

Total Members Voted: 7

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Author Topic: Poll: cuм Ex - What did Pope Paul VI say we should do?  (Read 32740 times)

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Offline Johannes

Poll: cuм Ex - What did Pope Paul VI say we should do?
« on: January 09, 2025, 11:18:15 AM »
What did Pope Paul IV through cuм Ex expect us to do?




cuм Ex Apostolatus Officio

5. [By this Our Constitution,] moreover, [which is to remain valid in perpetuity, We] also [enact, determine, decree and define:] as follows concerning those who shall have presumed in any way knowingly to receive, defend, favour, believe or teach the teaching of those so apprehended, confessed or convicted:

(i) they shall automatically incur sentence of excommunication;
(ii) they shall be rendered infamous;

(iii) they shall be excluded on pain of invalidity from any public or private office, deliberation, Synod, general or provincial Council and any conclave of Cardinals or other congregation of the faithful, and from any election or function of witness, so that they cannot take part in any of these by vote, in person, by writings, representative or by any agent;

6. In addition, [by this Our Constitution, which is to remain valid in perpetuity We enact, determine, decree and define:] that if ever at any time it shall appear that any Bishop, even if he be acting as an Archbishop, Patriarch or Primate; or any Cardinal of the aforesaid Roman Church, or, as has already been mentioned, any legate, or even the Roman Pontiff, prior to his promotion or his elevation as Cardinal or Roman Pontiff, has deviated from the Catholic Faith or fallen into some heresy:

(i) the promotion or elevation, even if it shall have been uncontested and by the unanimous assent of all the Cardinals, shall be null, void and worthless;

(ii) it shall not be possible for it to acquire validity (nor for it to be said that it has thus acquired validity) through the acceptance of the office, of consecration, of subsequent authority, nor through possession of administration, nor through the putative enthronement of a Roman Pontiff, or Veneration, or obedience accorded to such by all, nor through the lapse of any period of time in the foregoing situation;

(iii) it shall not be held as partially legitimate in any way;

(iv) to any so promoted to be Bishops, or Archbishops, or Patriarchs, or Primates or elevated as Cardinals, or as Roman Pontiff, no authority shall have been granted, nor shall it be considered to have been so granted either in the spiritual or the temporal domain;

(v) each and all of their words, deeds, actions and enactments, howsoever made, and anything whatsoever to which these may give rise, shall be without force and shall grant no stability whatsoever nor any right to anyone;

(vi) those thus promoted or elevated shall be deprived automatically, and without need for any further declaration, of all dignity, position, honour, title, authority, office and power.


Full text: https://dailycatholic.org/cuмexapo.htm
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Offline Stubborn

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Re: Poll: cuм Ex - What did Pope Paul VI say we should do?
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2025, 12:24:06 PM »
Why don't you start another thread with a poll asking why is it that you avoid giving a clear answer to a clear question?

What did he say we are to do about a pope who deviates from the faith?

You missed this in the OP.....

1.In assessing Our duty and the situation now prevailing, We have been weighed upon by the thought that a matter of this kind [i.e. error in respect of the Faith] is so grave and so dangerous that the Roman Pontiff,who is the representative upon earth of God and our God and Lord Jesus Christ, who holds the fullness of power over peoples and kingdoms, who may judge all and be judged by none in this world, may nonetheless be contradicted if he be found to have deviated from the Faith. Remembering also that, where danger is greater, it must more fully and more diligently be counteracted. - Pope Paul IV, cuм ex Apostolatus Officio 1559

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Offline Stubborn

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Re: Poll: cuм Ex - What did Pope Paul VI say we should do?
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2025, 01:16:50 PM »
You go a mile to get a block, then get lost on the journey.

I know well what the pope teaches in cuм ex, yet there is one very clear, very specific thing he tells us to do about a pope who deviates from the faith, what does he tell us to do? It's not in the select quotes from the rest of cuм ex you keep posting, he does not tell us to do anything in your quotes so why do you keep posting those quotes? 

I will post again the only place he tells us what to do in all of cuм ex, do you see it?

1.In assessing Our duty and the situation now prevailing, We have been weighed upon by the thought that a matter of this kind [i.e. error in respect of the Faith] is so grave and so dangerous that the Roman Pontiff,who is the representative upon earth of God and our God and Lord Jesus Christ, who holds the fullness of power over peoples and kingdoms, who may judge all and be judged by none in this world, may nonetheless be contradicted if he be found to have deviated from the Faith. Remembering also that, where danger is greater, it must more fully and more diligently be counteracted. - Pope Paul IV, cuм ex Apostolatus Officio 1559
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Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: Poll: cuм Ex - What did Pope Paul VI say we should do?
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2025, 02:10:56 PM »

Quote
What did Pope Paul IV through cuм Ex expect us to do?
cuм Ex is an official docuмent of the church, directed towards the clergy and those with authority in the Vatican.  "They" are the ones who have a duty to call out Francis, as have all Traditional clergy, including those still alive, such as +Williamson, +Vigano, +Sanborn, etc, etc.


"We the laity" are expected to do nothing in regards to the pope, except to ignore him and continue on worshipping God in the orthodox/Traditional rites.  "We the laity" have no authority to do anything, except to save our own souls and those of our family/friends.
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Offline Stubborn

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Re: Poll: cuм Ex - What did Pope Paul VI say we should do?
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2025, 02:37:56 PM »
Quote from: Johannes on January 09, 2025, 01:21:52 PM
cuм ex tells us Francis was never the pope to begin with due to his preexisting heresies and the subsequent loss of membership in the Church that follows heresy - so how you read the above portion about a pope "deviating from the faith" is irrelevant.
Wrong. You should realize that your dishonesty is on display for all to see. How I read the above portion is as it is written, to actually mean what the pope actually told us what we are to do about a pope who deviates from the faith.

How you read it is nearly word for word contrary to what he teaches. Somehow you are fine with this. 

 
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