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Author Topic: “We do not want to separate ourselves from Rome, we belong to the Church”  (Read 4111 times)

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Offline Geremia

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“We do not want to separate ourselves from Rome, we belong to the Church”
« on: November 23, 2024, 12:59:40 PM »
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: “We do not want to separate ourselves from Rome, we belong to the Church”
    « Reply #1 on: November 23, 2024, 03:46:02 PM »
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    • Correction:

    “We do not want to separate ourselves from Rome the schism, we belong to the newChurch”
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    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline St Giles

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    Re: “We do not want to separate ourselves from Rome, we belong to the Church”
    « Reply #2 on: November 24, 2024, 04:01:36 PM »
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    • Is this true?

    "In our fraternity, it has never been questioned that the Novus Ordo is intrinsically valid."
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    Offline Twice dyed

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    Re: “We do not want to separate ourselves from Rome, we belong to the Church”
    « Reply #3 on: November 25, 2024, 11:37:29 AM »
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    • Quote from: St Giles on November 24, 2024, 04:01:36 PM
    Is this true?

    "In our fraternity, it has never been questioned that the Novus Ordo is intrinsically valid."
    It would be clearer if the term " Novus Ordo" was examined in its different aspects. Ok, the New Mass is valid according to +Lefebvre, but illicit as in BASTARD MASS. Re. each sacrament, N.O. , possibly valid...doubtful..etc. Catholics must not, can not receive doubtful sacraments,
    Neo sspx now accepts  N.O. mass as " legitimately promulgated", and for certain +Lefebvre disagrees on this point. Same reasoning for consecrations: N.O. are doubtful, which is the simple reason why +L. consecrated 4 bishops. If Fr. Phluger is saying that ALL OF NOVUS ORDO is valid, ie VatII docuмents, magisterium, canonisations, etc , he hasn't meditated sufficiently. He should read: Timebombs of Vatican II by Fr. S.
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    Offline Meg

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    Re: “We do not want to separate ourselves from Rome, we belong to the Church”
    « Reply #4 on: November 25, 2024, 12:44:01 PM »
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    • Quote from: Twice dyed on November 25, 2024, 11:37:29 AM
    It would be clearer if the term " Novus Ordo" was examined in its different aspects. Ok, the New Mass is valid according to +Lefebvre, but illicit as in BASTARD MASS. Re. each sacrament, N.O. , possibly valid...doubtful..etc. Catholics must not, can not receive doubtful sacraments,
    Neo sspx now accepts  N.O. mass as " legitimately promulgated", and for certain +Lefebvre disagrees on this point. Same reasoning for consecrations: N.O. are doubtful, which is the simple reason why +L. consecrated 4 bishops. If Fr. Phluger is saying that ALL OF NOVUS ORDO is valid, ie VatII docuмents, magisterium, canonisations, etc , he hasn't meditated sufficiently. He should read: Timebombs of Vatican II by Fr. S.
    Pray.

    It's my understanding as well that +ABL and the former SSPX (vs. the neo-SSPX) believed that the new mass is valid but illicit. It sounds like the SSPX is now saying that it's licit?
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    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29
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