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Author Topic: Is there a One Ring in Tradition, to rule them all?  (Read 30243 times)

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Re: Is there a One Ring in Tradition, to rule them all?
« Reply #135 on: June 04, 2021, 11:12:56 AM »
Well, Fr. Voigt began working with Fr. Pfeiffer before he was conditionally ordained (this was before the conflict between Pfeiffer and Williamson), and when I started squawking about it on CI, Pfeiffer had him conditionally ordained by +Williamson.

So not sure if that counts.

But at least as regards the Resistance allied with the 4 bishops today, I am not aware of any clergy who were not at least conditionally ordained.

The faithful are rightfully intolerant of even the slightest doubts regarding priestly validity.

Re: Is there a One Ring in Tradition, to rule them all?
« Reply #136 on: June 04, 2021, 11:16:57 AM »
Ok, since my fellow ex-seminarians utterly failed to answer this question for you, I will:

DE FACTO the Resistance does have a position on this. Priests from the Novus Ordo are to be conditionally re-ordained. And the Resistance only makes use of known good or "certainly valid" bishops -- such as +Lefebvre-line.

All priests working in the Resistance are either conditionally ordained by a +Lefebvre line bishop, or they were already ordained by one in the SSPX.
Seems pretty straightforward to me. Classic SSPX position, once again.

Is that really the Classic SSPX position? We know of NO priests that were not conditionally ordained even during +Lefebvre timeline. Also, I personally know of an NO priest, who was conditionally ordained by +Williamson, even though there was no positive doubt and it was done because people complained. 

If the Resistance require conditional ordination, how does that apply to Francis? If there is a sacramental theological reason to doubt all NO priests, then we could easily come to the conclusion that Francis is at best a deacon or worst a layman.

Side note concerning conditional sacraments: I have been finding that more protestant converts to NO church never had their protestant baptism investigated. And as they move to tradition, the neo-SSPX  does not investigate it either.


Re: Is there a One Ring in Tradition, to rule them all?
« Reply #137 on: June 04, 2021, 11:21:03 AM »
Side note concerning conditional sacraments: I have been finding that more protestant converts to NO church never had their protestant baptism investigated. And as they move to tradition, the neo-SSPX  does not investigate it either.
I find it interesting that they perform conditional confirmations on demand to all who ask, but don't perform conditional baptisms or ordinations.

Re: Is there a One Ring in Tradition, to rule them all?
« Reply #138 on: June 05, 2021, 01:08:36 PM »
Ok, since my fellow ex-seminarians utterly failed to answer this question for you, I will:

DE FACTO the Resistance does have a position on this. Priests from the Novus Ordo are to be conditionally re-ordained. And the Resistance only makes use of known good or "certainly valid" bishops -- such as +Lefebvre-line.

All priests working in the Resistance are either conditionally ordained by a +Lefebvre line bishop, or they were already ordained by one in the SSPX.
Seems pretty straightforward to me. Classic SSPX position, once again.
Didn't Lefebvre himself sometimes abstain from conditional ordinations?  I admittedly don't remember the details on this so maybe I'm wrong.  I'll see if I can find proof tomorrow or the next day.

Re: Is there a One Ring in Tradition, to rule them all?
« Reply #139 on: June 05, 2021, 02:24:45 PM »
Didn't Lefebvre himself sometimes abstain from conditional ordinations?  I admittedly don't remember the details on this so maybe I'm wrong.  I'll see if I can find proof tomorrow or the next day.
I asked the same question earlier, with no response.. Why would it take an ex seminarians to answer it?