Read an Interview with Matthew, the owner of CathInfo

Author Topic: Children’s Ballet  (Read 1243 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Carissima

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Reputation: +169/-96
  • Gender: Female
Children’s Ballet
« on: December 07, 2017, 01:11:18 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I was recently considering taking my children to a local ballet performance of The Nutcracker done by a children’s ballet company. 
    I decided to look into whether or not The Church had anything to say on attending theatre and came across this article on TIA. 

    http://www.traditioninaction.org/religious/k026pDance.html

    I was surprised that dances have been forbidden in the past and even excommunication was mentioned in an encyclical I believe..aren’t those still binding?
    I have a sister’s wedding to help plan and wondering if I should mention to her the possibility of no dancing?

    If anyone could add their own thoughts on this it would be greatly appreciated...

    Offline Carissima

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 266
    • Reputation: +169/-96
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #1 on: December 07, 2017, 01:23:24 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • From a history on ballet:


    ...’Christian religions had differing views on ballet as an art form. In 1666, the Catholic Church came against the ballet claiming that dancing “does nothing but excite the passions”. (Homans p. 31) Actors and dancers were excommunicated from the Catholic Church and denied a Christian burial.’

    http://faculty.ccri.edu/panaccione/Fa15/TheHistoryofBallet.pdf


    Offline Ladislaus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15739
    • Reputation: +8349/-2679
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #2 on: December 07, 2017, 08:55:14 AM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!0
  • While I don't believe that there's any strict prohibition, I wouldn't go to one or take my family.  Many if not most of the costumes are immodest ... including the large crotch bulges on the men.  What's more, there's always a vibe of homosexuality in the males who perform ballet ... and I personally find that even more disturbing than the immodesty.

    Offline Cantarella

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 7259
    • Reputation: +4351/-556
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #3 on: December 07, 2017, 08:58:14 AM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!0
  • I agree with the TIA article in that dancing itself is no intrinsically bad; but it becomes bad insofar as it favors bad morals. There are some dances which are fine. The folkloric ones, for example, which do not entice lust, romance, or other disordered passions by means of immodest dress or sensual movement. The problem with Ballet is twofold: the immodest outfits and the improper poses for Catholic girls (and boys). In the article, we find a simple criteria for parents to discern the appropriateness of dances:

    1. Dresses are modest
    2. Positions are appropriate
    3. Movements are decent
    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.

    Offline Ladislaus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15739
    • Reputation: +8349/-2679
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #4 on: December 07, 2017, 10:46:13 AM »
  • Thanks!3
  • No Thanks!1
  • CONTEXT.
    Is it unacceptable to watch boxing because the men are shirtless?
    Is it immodest to wear a wetsuit when diving because it shows the figure?
    Did Michaelangelo turn the Sistine Chapel into a "brothel"?


    Philistinism. If anyone sees near occasion or occasion to sin against the Sixth Commandment in watching classical ballet, perhaps the problem lies with HIM, in which case he should be averting his eyes from it, not moralising to those for whom it in an entirely innocent celebration of art and the beauty of the human form and movement that God created.

    It's not just about what's an occasion of sin but about what's appropriate and decent.  I would not suffer the slightest temptation watching a ballet.  I just find that the poses and outfits are vulgar and immodest ... and won't watch out of principle.  I call BS on your "entirely innocent celebration of ... the beauty of the human form".

    Indeed, I would whitewash the Sistine chapel ceiling, or, rather sandblast it so that it can never be "restored".  Michaelangelo's repugnant homoerotic art should find no place in a church.  Again, it causes me no temptation ... but it's repugnant and out of place.  Should I walk into a church with my butt hanging out of my pants?

    St. Paul speaks about modesty of dress from the perspective of what is fitting for a temple of the Holy Spirit.

    Showing up in a sweatshirt at Mass is wrong (unless it's all you have) ... not because it might cause temptations but because it is not fitting for the house of God.

    Women should not watch boxing because it would be inappropriate ... whether or not they'd be "tempted".



    Offline Ladislaus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15739
    • Reputation: +8349/-2679
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #5 on: December 07, 2017, 10:48:29 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • I don't know. What's the dress code for the saints in Heaven who are in principle incapable of sinning?
    Apparently God created the human body in order to be covered up, rather than creating clothing for a fallen man in order to cover his shame.

    So you imagine Our Lady and Our Lord prancing around heaven in the nude, do you?

    Offline Carissima

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 266
    • Reputation: +169/-96
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #6 on: December 07, 2017, 11:05:41 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!1

  • But if you want to believe that a performance of the Nutcracker by a children's ballet company is somehow lascivious and an occasion of sin to be lumped into the same category as the Medieval equivalent of a nightclub, go ahead.
    I’m sorry I don’t remember giving my opinion on the matter yet, I only asked a question and left two articles for people to read so we could discuss. 

    Offline Carissima

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 266
    • Reputation: +169/-96
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #7 on: December 07, 2017, 11:11:13 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • While I don't believe that there's any strict prohibition, I wouldn't go to one or take my family.  Many if not most of the costumes are immodest ... including the large crotch bulges on the men.  What's more, there's always a vibe of homosexuality in the males who perform ballet ... and I personally find that even more disturbing than the immodesty.
    Yes I would have to agree with you, the homosexual vibe is a problem in theatre companies and I find it more disturbing also. That was something I hadn’t considered or rather forgot it was such a prominent issue. 


    Offline Carissima

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 266
    • Reputation: +169/-96
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #8 on: December 07, 2017, 11:23:09 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I agree with the TIA article in that dancing itself is no intrinsically bad; but it becomes bad insofar as it favors bad morals. There are some dances which are fine. The folkloric ones, for example, which do not entice lust, romance, or other disordered passions by means of immodest dress or sensual movement. The problem with Ballet is twofold: the immodest outfits and the improper poses for Catholic girls (and boys). In the article, we find a simple criteria for parents to discern the appropriateness of dances:

    1. Dresses are modest
    2. Positions are appropriate
    3. Movements are decent
    I do like the idea of folkloric dancing because it is much more modest than most modern dancing and always has a charming theme as well. 
    My children are mostly German and Italian so it would be fun to search out performances by these and other nationalities as well. I think Irish dancing is just lovely. 

    Offline Carissima

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 266
    • Reputation: +169/-96
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #9 on: December 07, 2017, 11:31:10 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!2
  • Indeed, I would whitewash the Sistine chapel ceiling, or, rather sandblast it so that it can never be "restored".  Michaelangelo's repugnant homoerotic art should find no place in a church.  Again, it causes me no temptation ... but it's repugnant and out of place.  
    Indeed, just because it is in the Sistine Chapel does not make it ok. I would do the same given the chance.  :applause:

    Offline Ladislaus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15739
    • Reputation: +8349/-2679
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #10 on: December 07, 2017, 12:07:58 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Indeed, just because it is in the Sistine Chapel does not make it ok. I would do the same given the chance.  :applause:

    Yes, I can just imagine being a priest, offering Mass there, elevating the Sacred Host, looking up at Him, only to see male genitalia dangling right next to Our Lord.


    Offline Marlelar

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3475
    • Reputation: +1809/-222
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #11 on: December 09, 2017, 11:17:52 PM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!0
  • Yes I would have to agree with you, the homosexual vibe is a problem in theatre companies and I find it more disturbing also. That was something I hadn’t considered or rather forgot it was such a prominent issue.


    I've seen various performances of the Nutcracker and classical ballets but have never noticed any with a "homosexual vibe".  

    Offline Carissima

    • Jr. Member
    • **
    • Posts: 266
    • Reputation: +169/-96
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #12 on: December 10, 2017, 12:10:44 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0

  • I've seen various performances of the Nutcracker and classical ballets but have never noticed any with a "homosexual vibe".  
    I think it may be more common in certain cities where being gay is very popular and encouraged even. Homosexuals, male and female are very open where I live, and it would make sense they’d be performing in local theatre here. 

    Offline Ladislaus

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15739
    • Reputation: +8349/-2679
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #13 on: December 10, 2017, 08:06:40 AM »
  • Thanks!3
  • No Thanks!2

  • I've seen various performances of the Nutcracker and classical ballets but have never noticed any with a "homosexual vibe".  

    Uhm, every guy who does ballet has homosexual vibe.  But then women's "gaydars" are not nearly as sensitive as those of men.

    Offline shin

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1489
    • Reputation: +753/-1
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Children’s Ballet
    « Reply #14 on: December 10, 2017, 04:08:04 PM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!1

  • Amen to sandblasting the Sistine chapel ceiling.

    Abbe Henri-Louis Hulot's book on dancing contains many references and citations.
    Sincerely,

    Shin

    'Flores apparuerunt in terra nostra. . . Fulcite me floribus.' (The flowers appear on the earth. . . stay me up with flowers. Sg 2:12,5)'-

     

    Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16