Quote from: Jaynek

Quote from: parentsfortruth

A woman who works outside the home, truly undermines her husband by usurping his role, and lacks trust in him.

As a wife, if you want things to go well in your marriage, you will not take his role as the provider on yourself. This makes him feel like less of a man.

What if the husband tells her to get a job?  Should she go against his authority?

This would be a poor reflection on him. Is this person hypothetical? Are these hypothetical people impoverished?

I've known couples in this situation, but none well enough to know the details.

I thought it would be a good idea to outline why I hold the opinion I have. I've cited this book earlier in the thread, and it is not online, just portions of it for sample reading to get you to purchase the book, but I guarantee, it's the best $8 you can spend as a wife and mother if you don't already have it. Yes it was written by a protestant, but most of what is in there is more Catholic than any Novus Ordo book you'll pick up.

Exerpt from Fascinating Womanhood:

The Provider

A man needs to function, feel needed, and excel women as a provider.

Since the beginning of time, the man has been recognized as the provider. The first commandment given him was, "In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread till thou return to the earth, out of which thou wast taken: for dust thou art, and into dust thou shalt return." This commandment was given, not to the woman, but to the man. The woman was instructed to bring forth children. From this time forth their duties have been thus divided.

This arrangement has been honored by tradition, custom, and even courts of the law. In the event of divorce men are still legally bound to pay alimony; thus they continue to earn the bread so the mother can nurture the children. This plan is important to live, however, not because of custom or law but because it is God's command.

Another reason the man should provide: Inborn in a man is a keen sense of responsibility to provide the living and to function effectively in this role. Being successful in this area of his life is as important to his feeling of worth, as a woman's is in succeeding as a mother and homemaker.

As the man fulfills his masculine duty as the provider, it presents a tender, romantic scene as the following nursery rhyme:

By, baby bunting,
Daddy's gone a hunting,
To get a little rabbit skin,
To wrap his baby bunting in.

Picture, if you can, a mother at home nurturing her little ones, making a comfortable home for her family, the father goes out into the world struggling against the elements and oppositions of life to bring home the necessities and comforts for his loved ones. This romantic scene, instead of being taken for granted, should be viewed as the heart and core of life which, when lived properly, brings soul satisfaction that cannot be measured. There is nothing equal to it and nothing more important.

A man also has an inborn need to feel needed as a provider, to feel that his wife depends on him for financial support and can't get by without him. In addition, he has an inborn need to excel women as a provider. A man's feeling of worth can be undermined when he sees women in the workforce doing a better job than he, advancing to a higher position, or earning more pay. How much worse when his own wife excels him.

What a Man Should Provide

An excellent description of what a man should provide is from my husband's book, Man of Steel and Velvet:

"Simply stated, the man should provide the necessities. This means food, clothing, and a shelter, plus a few comforts and conveniences.... Through all generations of time it has been recognized that when a man marries, his wife and children are entitled to his financial support. Failure to meet this obligation has been just cause for divorce, and even after the marriage separation, a man is still under financial obligation. Financial support and, along with this, fidelity have always been the two main entitlements for a woman in marriage. But whether these laws remain in force or not, the moral and sacred obligation is just as binding, the need just as great.

"It's important that a man provide a shelter separate from anyone else. This is important for the sake of privacy and giving the wife the opportunity of making a home in her own way. Perhaps this is why a special instruction was given by God in the very beginning: Wherefore a man shall leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they shall be two in one flesh. (Gen 2:24) Under stress of circuмstances there may be occasions when a man must move his wife and children into another household. Although there may be justification temporarily, it's contrary to the divine plan and unfair to the wife if this situation extends beyond a brief emergency.

"Although a man has a sacred and binding obligation to provide the necessities, he is under no such obligation to provide the luxuries. Women and children are not entitled to ease and luxury, to style and elegance. His duty is not to provide a costly home, expensive furniture, and decor. Concerning the education of his children, he has an obligation to provide a basic education, but such a binding obligation doesn't extend to a higher education, music lessons, the arts and cultures. He may wish to provide these, and it may bring him much pleasure to do so, but it's not mandatory.

"In providing a high standard of living, some men make near economic slaves of themselves, with great disadvantage to themselves and their families. Too often a man is so consumed with meeting ever-increasing demands, not only by his family, but by himself. that he does not preserve himself for things of greater value. He has little time to give to his wife and children, time to teach them the values of life, how to live, standards to follow, and time to build strong family ties.

"A man is also entitled to time for himself, for recreation, study, and meditation. He has a further need to be of service outside his own circle, a commitment to society. Church service is an important responsibility. Men have talents which need to be shared, ability which could be developed to make the world a better place. It is not right for a man to spend his entire time and energy to provide luxuries for his own family circle."

(I'll add more later.)

Continuing...

His Pressing Responsibility to Provide

A woman needs to understand with an all-comprehending sympathy what a man faces in earning the living. An excellent description is found in Dr. Marie Robinson's Book, The Power of sɛҳuąƖ Surrender, from which I quote:

"The majority of men, when they come of age and marry, take on an enormous burden which they may not lay down with any conscience this side of the grave. Quietly, and without histrionics, they put aside, in the name of love, most of their vaunted freedom and contract to take upon their shoulders full social and economic responsibility for their wives and children.

"As a woman, consider for a moment how you would feel if your child should be deprived of the good things of life; proper housing, clothing, education. Consider how you would feel if he should go hungry. Perhaps such ideas have occurred to you and have given you a bad turn momentarily. But they are passing thoughts: a woman does not give them much credence; they are not her direct responsibility; certainly she does not worry about them for long.

"But such thoughts, conscious or unconscious, are her husband's daily fare. He knows, and he takes the carking thought to work with him each morning (and every morning) and to bed with him at night, that upon the success or failure of his efforts rests the happiness, health, indeed the very lives of his wife and children. In the ultimate he senses he alone must take full responsibility for them.

"I do not think it is possible to exaggerate how seriously men take this responsibility; how much they worry about it. Women, unless they are very close to their men, rarely know how heavily the burden weighs sometimes, for men talk about it very little. They do not want their loved ones to worry.

"Men have been shouldering the entire responsibility for their family group since earliest times. I often think, however, when I see the stresses and strains of today's marketplace, that civilized man has much harder going, psychologically speaking, than his primitive forefathers.

"In the first place, the competition creates a terrible strain on the individual male. This competition is not only for preferment and advancement, it is often for his very job itself. Every man knows if he falters, lets up his ceaseless drive, he can and will be easily replaced.

"No level of employment is really free of this endless pressure. The executive must meet and exceed his last year's quota or the quota of his competitors. Those under him must see that he does it, and he scrutinizes their performance most severely, and therefore constantly.

"Professional men-- doctors, lawyers, professors-- are under no less pressure for the most part. If the lawyer is self-employed, he must constantly seek new clients; if he works for an organization he must exert himself endlessly to avoid being superseded by ambitious peers or by pushing young particles just out of law school and fired with the raw energy of youth. A score of unhappy contingencies can ruin or seriously threaten a doctor's practice, not the least of which is a possible breakdown in his ability to practice. A teacher must work long hours on publishable projects outside of his arduous teaching assignments if he is to advance or even hold his ground.

"There is no field of endeavor that a man may enter where he can count on complete economic safety; competition, the need for unremitting year-in, year-out performance is his life's lot. Over all this he knows, too, stands a separate specter upon which he can exert only the remotest control. It is the joblessness which may be caused by the cyclical depression and recessions that characterize our economy."

Do Women Who Work Feel the Same Pressure Men Do?

Women who work do not feel the same kind of pressure men do. This is because they have a different orientation to the world of work. Whereas a man feels he cannot turn aside from his work with a clear conscience, a woman doesn't feel this same sense of duty. She can resign her job at any time and for any reason, without a feeling of guilt. Economic problems may result but she won't have a lower opinion of herself or feel disgraced in the eyes of the public.

On the other hand, if an able-bodied man were to stop working it would injure his feeling of worth and his image to the public. He and everyone else would consider him a failure if he were to neglect this important duty. A woman feels pressure, but of a different kind-- a time pressure which comes from living a double role. A man feels a binding moral pressure.

(Posting more later.)

PFT, in what year(s) were these books written?

Quote from: MaterDominici

PFT, in what year(s) were these books written?

I'll answer my own question...

Fascinating Womanhood has a copyright of 1963, but notes that it was inspired by a set of anonymous booklets published in the 1920s.

Yep, and it was the nightmare of the feminists in the 1960's.

One would have to consider that this was written by a Mormon, so not EVERYTHING in there is in the Catholic context, including that statement.

Is it unreasonable for me to expect in a future wife that she:

-primarily dresses in skirts/dresses

-primarily does the cooking/cleaning

-Emphasizes the faith to our children

-Does the grocery shopping

-Has a dinner prepared at least 5 nights a week

-Is the "heart of the home" while still being a firm disciplinarian when needed

Im asking this because I shared these desires with family/friends who are not traditional catholics and they said my expectations are unrealistic and I need to get with the times, otherwise I will be miserable forever. Kind of like the posts regarding the recent fisheaters thread. I think the term used was "candyland."

You will be MISERABLE FOREVER, if you don't stick to these expectations.