Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men  (Read 25904 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Ladislaus

  • Supporter
  • *****
  • Posts: 47373
  • Reputation: +28036/-5238
  • Gender: Male
Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
« Reply #75 on: November 14, 2017, 08:20:44 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • tradsaurus is not entirely incorrect -- the number of women who are capable of objectively discussing issues, without emotion is quite small.

    You talked about the behavior of men and women on the forum, Matthew, but what think you about tradsaurus' allegation that men and women should not interact this way IN PRINCIPLE?

    Offline DZ PLEASE

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2928
    • Reputation: +741/-787
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #76 on: November 14, 2017, 08:22:44 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • I don't know, man.  I would have given my right arm to converse with St. Therese of Lisieux or St. Theresa of Avila or a large number of other women.  Women can have a great deal to offer.  I don't know that there's any strict prohibition on women making their thoughts known to men or even disagreeing with them.  Typically when men cop this attitude, it's a combination of 1) feeling threatened by women and 2) rigorous scrupulosity with regard to the Scripture passages cited.

    Men can easily feel threatened if a woman is superior to them in some way.  So, if a woman has greater intelligence or virtue or some other quality, a man can feel inferior ... and that can be difficult when women are supposed to be their subordinates in the order of nature.  But we can look to St. Joseph there.  He had authority over God and the Mother of God and was, I'm sure, constantly aware of his inferiority.
    Differences aside, credit where due. 

    Who finds error in this quote? I don't see it.


    Offline Jaynek

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4170
    • Reputation: +2318/-1232
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #77 on: November 14, 2017, 08:39:45 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • Differences aside, credit where due.

    Who finds error in this quote? I don't see it.
    I am rather sceptical of this idea about men feeling threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc. I have never seen a man say this about himself. Usually the accusation comes up in an ad hominem argument to avoid addressing the actual topic under debate. It seems to be a knee jerk response to any mention of male authority or superiority. I am not going to believe in these alleged threatened  men until a man tells me that is how he feels. 

    Offline DZ PLEASE

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2928
    • Reputation: +741/-787
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #78 on: November 14, 2017, 08:47:35 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • I am rather sceptical of this idea about men feeling threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc. I have never seen a man say this about himself. Usually the accusation comes up in an ad hominem argument to avoid addressing the actual topic under debate. It seems to be a knee jerk response to any mention of male authority or superiority. I am not going to believe in these alleged threatened  men until a man tells me that is how he feels.
    You'll likely be waiting a long time there ma'am, even if we are actually aware of being issued a feeling of any variety.

    Offline B from A

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1261
    • Reputation: +841/-135
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #79 on: November 14, 2017, 09:03:56 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • I am rather sceptical of this idea about men feeling threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc. I have never seen a man say this about himself. Usually the accusation comes up in an ad hominem argument to avoid addressing the actual topic under debate. It seems to be a knee jerk response to any mention of male authority or superiority. I am not going to believe in these alleged threatened  men until a man tells me that is how he feels. 
    You'll likely be waiting a long time there ma'am, even if we are actually aware of being issued a feeling of any variety.

    I was thinking much the same thing.  (If I understand DZP correctly.)  JayneK, even if a man could ever admit to himself that he feels threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc, he would certainly never admit it to others.  


    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 47373
    • Reputation: +28036/-5238
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #80 on: November 14, 2017, 09:21:39 AM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!1
  • I am rather sceptical of this idea about men feeling threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc.

    As you've already demonstrated, you appear to live under a rock.  I see it all the time.  You've never seen or heard of a Trad man mistreating his wife either.  Either that or the bar for "mistreatment" is so ridiculously high (just short of hospitalizing a woman?) in your mind that you can rightly say you've never seen it.


    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 47373
    • Reputation: +28036/-5238
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #81 on: November 14, 2017, 09:22:49 AM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!1
  • JayneK, even if a man could ever admit to himself that he feels threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc, he would certainly never admit it to others.  

    And, even if he can't admit it to himself, people around him can see it and sense it.

    Absolutely, JayneK will be waiting a long time before he'd admit it ... especially to a woman.  MAYBE to his wife or something ... if the man is honest enough.  But that would be it.

    Offline DZ PLEASE

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2928
    • Reputation: +741/-787
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #82 on: November 14, 2017, 09:37:45 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • I was thinking much the same thing.  (If I understand DZP correctly.)  JayneK, even if a man could ever admit to himself that he feels threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc, he would certainly never admit it to others.  
       Thanks ma'am, but that "certain" bit takes it too far the other way; what that is essentially saying is that we're incapable of acting in humility, at least in this regard.

       Also, I wasn't even getting to the self-admission bit yet; the mere awareness of these... "feeling" things of which ya'll speak is often  a labor all unto itself.

       I'm "certain" that most any female, if upon reflection, knows this to be so; we certainly hear loads of hen-cluck about it for it to be otherwise.


    Offline DZ PLEASE

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2928
    • Reputation: +741/-787
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #83 on: November 14, 2017, 09:41:00 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • As you've already demonstrated, you appear to live under a rock.  I see it all the time.  You've never seen or heard of a Trad man mistreating his wife either.  Either that or the bar for "mistreatment" is so ridiculously high (just short of hospitalizing a woman?) in your mind that you can rightly say you've never seen it.
     Do you hate her for some reason?

    Offline Jaynek

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4170
    • Reputation: +2318/-1232
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #84 on: November 14, 2017, 09:42:53 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!1
  • I was thinking much the same thing.  (If I understand DZP correctly.)  JayneK, even if a man could ever admit to himself that he feels threatened by women who are more intelligent, etc, he would certainly never admit it to others.  
    I agree it is unlikely. Nevertheless the people who claim to have observed this have not done so. It is not possible to observe feelings. We observe actions and deduce or project the feelings that underlie them. People who think they have seen men feeling threatened think that as much because of their own assumptions as because of what they have actually seen. 

    I have seen many instances of someone dismissing a man's words with "You are just saying that because you feel threatened by women." And I have seen no sign at all that he actually felt this way.  In my experience, the accusation far exceeds the reality. 

    The only man I know well enough for him to have shared his feelings on this is my husband. He is definitely not threatened by women having more intelligence, etc. than he does. 

    Offline Jaynek

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 4170
    • Reputation: +2318/-1232
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #85 on: November 14, 2017, 09:45:09 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Do you hate her for some reason?
    Maybe he feels threatened by me.  ;D


    Offline DZ PLEASE

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2928
    • Reputation: +741/-787
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #86 on: November 14, 2017, 09:49:04 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Maybe he feels threatened by me.  ;D
       I feel threatened by dust-bunnies, for example; therefore I"d best not throw stones, which are also pretty scary now that I think about it so, time for my meds and then under the bed with me. 

    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 47373
    • Reputation: +28036/-5238
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #87 on: November 14, 2017, 10:30:12 AM »
  • Thanks!3
  • No Thanks!1
  • It is not possible to observe feelings. We observe actions and deduce or project the feelings that underlie them. People who think they have seen men feeling threatened think that as much because of their own assumptions as because of what they have actually seen.

    Hogwash.  In many cases, you can very accurately deduce these feelings based on things people say or how they say them or even from how they react to certain things.  You must have very poor people skills, Jaynek.  I know lots of people who can practically read the minds of others from their behavior and from what they say and how they say it.  I'm very good at this myself.

    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 47373
    • Reputation: +28036/-5238
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #88 on: November 14, 2017, 10:33:47 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Do you hate her for some reason?

    Not at all.  I'm adamantly opposed to the ideas that she's promoting here on CI.  Men are not personal about such things.  In fact, I objected to the tradosaur who wanted her and other women silenced ... simply for being women.  If I would want her to keep silent, it's only because I consider her opinions to be harmful ... and not because she's a woman.  I very much prefer intelligent women -- and I married accordingly.

    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 47373
    • Reputation: +28036/-5238
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Misogyny and Traditional Catholic Men
    « Reply #89 on: November 14, 2017, 10:38:33 AM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!1
  • Maybe he feels threatened by me.  ;D

    Hardly.  I can be very forceful in arguing my ideas.  You should see me going after the guys over in the Crisis forum.  I mince no words.  And men don't take things personally.  DZ should know that.  If I met you, I'd probably say hello with a smile ... whereas many women would probably never speak to each other again after exchanges like this.

    As for being threatened, I much prefer intelligent women, which is why I married the woman I did.  As pretty and kind and sweet as a woman might be (and my wife is all those things and more), it would drive me crazy if I couldn't have an intelligent conversation with her about things that matter to me.