Last Tradhican, you did not answer my question either: you said you denied Baptism of Desire, even of the catechumen, the idea of the Dimonds. I showed you five sources, (1) St. Luke, (2) St. Peter, (3) St. Augustine, (4) St. Thomas (5) Fr. Haydock that said plainly that Cornelius received the Holy Spirit, Baptism of Desire, before his Water Baptism. How do you explain this? I can also show St. Alphonsus, and St. Robert, beside other Theologians, who teach the same. The plain sense of Scripture itself indicates it, and it is very clear.
I post only Fr. Haydock again below: "
Such may be the grace of God occasionally towards men, and such their great charity and contrition, that they may have remission, justification, and sanctification, before the external sacraments of baptism, confirmation, and penance be received; as we see in this example: where, at Peter's preaching, they all received the Holy Ghost before any sacrament" https://www.ecatholic2000.com/haydock/ntcomment105.shtmlDo you deny Acts 10:47? Or do you interpret it contrary to the authorized official interpretation of the Catholic Church?
To your question, what I agree with is the below declaration by Bp. Athanasius and Cardinal Burke, which the SSPX has endorsed, and which I've promoted many times, including on CI: "
“After the institution of the New and Everlasting Covenant in Jesus Christ, no one may be saved by obedience to the law of Moses alone without faith in Christ as true God and the only Savior of humankind” (Rom 3:28; Gal 2:16)." https://fsspx.news/en/news-events/news/two-cardinals-and-three-bishops-remember-catholic-doctrine-48875Dimond-disciples and Fr. Feeney followers have confused the issue by focusing on Baptism of Desire, which all the manuals teach. Those same manuals, including St. Alphonsus' Moral Theology, teach that the REAL QUESTION is "EXPLICIT vs IMPLICIT FAITH". I am with St. Alphonsus, Fr. Mueller, Msgr. Fenton etc in believing explicit faith is a necessary means for salvation in the NT. Even Fr. Laisney in the article I cited earlier said, "
We can concede that if a point of doctrine is not yet defined, one may be excused in case of ignorance or may be allowed to discuss some precision within the doctrine. In the case of baptism of desire, for instance, we are allowed to discuss how explicit the Catholic Faith must be in one for baptism of desire. But one is not allowed to simply deny baptism of desire and reject the doctrine itself. Rigorism always tends to destroy the truth."Since all Catholics can safely follow St. Alphonsus, per the Popes, they can hold what he taught both on BOD and on Explicit Faith.No, Pax Vobis, it's not me who is in the vortex of confusion. You reject the clear declaration of Trent, as explained by a Priest who is competent in Latin and quotes the Council to prove his point. Why do you appeal to Doctors, when you're going to reject them anyway?Here is St. Alphonsus, a Doctor like you asked: "Now it is "de fide" that men are also saved by Baptism of desire, by virtue of the Canon Apostolicam, "de presbytero non baptizato" and of the Council of Trent, session 6, Chapter 4 where it is said that no one can be saved 'without the laver of regeneration or the desire for it.'" Other readers will notice how the Doctor practically equates justification and salvation, knowing well, as Fr. Laisney said, and as Trent had taught, that nothing more is required for salvation after justification than perseverance. St. Benedict's Centre concedes someone who now dies in grace will certainly be saved and the opposite is heretical. Do you agree with St. Alphonsus? Yes, it is interesting to see that, Joe Cupertino. Thanks for posting. I would say the first indicates Baptism or its Desire Justifies, whereas the second indicates that Baptism, or its desire, since the promulgation of the Gospel, is the only means of Justification. A subtle difference, but an important one nonetheless. Still, even the original draft would have been prepared by competent and orthodox Catholic Bishops among the Tridentine Fathers.
Now, let's look at where we are. Trent says: "Without Baptism, or Without its Desire", there is no Justification. It can also be stated as
Trent: "Baptism, OR ITS DESIRE, is necessary for justification/salvation" [since justification is necessary for salvation].
Thus, Canon Law summarizes the Tridentine dogma in this way:
Canon Law: "Baptism, in fact or at least in desire necessary unto all for salvation".
Dimond: "Baptism, BUT NOT ITS DESIRE, is necessary for both justification and salvation"
SBC: "Baptism, OR ITS DESIRE, is necessary for justification. Baptism is necessary for salvation".
St. Robert: "The Council of Trent declared Baptism is necessary in fact or in desire".
St. Alphonsus: "It is de fide that souls are saved by Baptism of Desire ... in virtue of the Council of Trent ... where it is said no one can be saved "without the laver of regeneration or the desire for it"
Pope St. Pius X: "Baptism is absolutely necessary to salvation ... the absence of Baptism can be supplied by ... Baptism of Desire."
Pope St. Pius V also implied Baptism of Desire, in two dogmatic infallible condemnations. If you reject them, you may as well hold to Calvinism or Jansenism, like the Jansenist Michael Baius whom Pope St. Pius V infallibly condemned.
Catholic Encyclopedia: "The same
doctrine is taught by
Pope Innocent III (cap. Debitum, iv, De Bapt.), and the contrary propositions are condemned by
Popes Pius V and
Gregory XII, in proscribing the 31st and 33rd propositions of
Baius."
Pope St. Pius V condemned: "Charity can be in both Catechumens and Penitents without the Remission of sins"
Therefore, the dogmatic Truth: "Charity in both Catechumens and Penitents obtains the Remission of sins"
Pope St. Pius V condemned: "That Charity which is the fullness of the law is not always connected with the Remission of sins"
Therefore, the dogmatic Truth: "That Charity which is the fullness of the law IS always connected with the Remission of sins."
Charity or Contrition, in which the desire for the Sacrament is implicit, obtains the remission of sins both before and after Baptism.