Author Topic: Is this Sin by omission? (Read 12578 times)

Änσnymσus · « **Reply #20 on:** November 02, 2023, 11:42:44 AM »

It would have been good to explain to the child that non-Catholics cannot enter into Heaven, however we do not know the state of someone's soul when he dies. Therefore, if perchance there was a conversion to the True Faith right before the moment of death, then certainly prayers could be offered for the soul.

"Mass cannot be said publicly for a pagan who has died without having given any positive sign of conversion or contrition ; if some such sign was given, it could be said privately, and conditionally on the pagan having died in
the state of grace.

If a heretic or schismatic died after having given signs ofrepentance, Mass may be offered publicly for him ; if he gave no sign of repentance, Mass may be offeredprivately, if no scandal be given. Consequently, a priest may accept stipends and say Masses for a non-Catholic who died firmly adhering to his or her sect, provided there is no scandal and the Mass is said privately. Scandal could be precluded by explaining the true doctrine on the matter. In cases of heretics, schismatics or pagans, who have died without any sign of repentance or conversion, Mass cannot be announced for them on the ground of scandal and indifferentism. But a private Requiem Mass with proper prayers may probably be said, though the proper prayer is usually not added." - H. Davis, SJ, Moral and Pastoral Theology Vol III.

As for the Dimond's assertion of the bishop being censured by the pope, as always, the Dimond's bend and twist reality to support their own twisted theology. The bishop was censured for mentioning the name of a non-Catholic in the Memento of the Canon.. that is PUBLIC prayer as the Mass is an official liturgy of the Church.
If the bishop simply said, "Please pray for the soul of the deceased monarch... may God have mercy on his soul", this would be no problem because this is a PRIVATE admonition to others to pray.

Änσnymσus · « **Reply #21 on:** November 02, 2023, 06:18:22 PM »

Quote from: Simeon on November 02, 2023, 09:31:43 AM

Well.......anything I say in this reply should not be taken as me arguing a position, because I am merely revealing the movements of my own soul, which, I am sure, is full of illusions.

I don't know what a vessel of destruction is. I've never heard that term before. Of course the term vessel of election was used by our Lord himself, referring to St. Paul. I searched the term 'vessel of destruction' in the Douay, and nothing came up.

I think I have heard it said somewhere in the past that Pilate's wife's visions were from the devil, but that is not determinative for me; it would not change my desire to pray for him.

1. The very first demonic vision came to Eve. She was tricked by it, and sinned against herself and her husband because of it. But in the Exsultet we hear the Church pray, O Happy Fault!

2. All demonic visions are permitted by God to bring about God's own purposes.

3. Peter was certainly being guided by the devil when he suggested to our Lord that He should not go to Jerusalem if that meant His Death. Jesus rebuked him, calling him satan. And yet, consider the grace and instruction that has flowed down to Christians throughout two centuries, as a direct result of the Apostle's temptation.

4. We are often instructed more by temptations - ours and those of others - than by clear acts of virtue.

5. Everything the devil did on Good Friday boomeranged on him, slapped him in the face, increased his humiliation, and lowered his position in Hell. From the standpoint of his soul, Pilate's wife's dream served as a warning to him. It provided him with a kind of light - the devils can tell the truth for nefarious reasons. It was, in fact, a grace that commenced a terrible and grave struggle in Pilate's poor miserable soul. Fr. Groenings has far less sympathy for Pilate than I do. He found him a nasty, prideful profligate. I side more with Jesus, Who loved Pilate. Jesus loved him. Jesus, in that short span, gave Pilate a lifetime of instruction.

Pilate failed in his first test, but so did Peter and the Apostles.

6. What is a vessel of destruction? We don't believe in Calvinistic predestination. We believe in the hope of God's mercy for the worst sinners. What is it?

Thank you for your response, I have considered your points.

As for vessels I had the wrong term - vessels of wrath

Quote

What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath, fitted for destruction,
[Romans 9:22]

hgodwinson · « **Reply #22 on:** November 09, 2023, 11:42:36 PM »

Quote from: Simeon on November 02, 2023, 08:26:18 AM

One other thought. I pray for dead non-Catholics the same way I pray for living ones. Prayer is outside of time. You can pray that they receive the grace of conversion at the moment of their death. You can pray this hours, days, years, even centuries after their death.

You'll think I'm nuts, but I pray for Pontius Pilate, the poorest slob this world has ever known. Talk about a victim of circuмstances. How many of us would have stood up to that onslaught of persecution? Yes, Pilate was persecuted by the Jєωs. And we know that his wife was touched by grace. Even our Lord encouraged him by telling him his sin was not as great as that of the Jєωs.

I have deep, deep sympathy for Pilate, my countryman. I pray for him, that he repents and confesses the truth before he closes his eyes. I read once on Traditio that he is venerated as a Saint in the East. That gave me much happiness.

Now, none of this is mental fodder for an 8 year old. All he requires for now is that it is a good and holy thing to pray for the dead. When he is older, he will be ready for distinctions and subtleties enough.

He is certainly old enough now to be taught a prayer or two in Latin, and how to practice daily devotions for the Poor Souls. So, you can focus on amping his praxis.

Pax!

I know you didn't ask but praying that someone has a deathbed conversion in the past is like praying someone stops mortally sinning in the past. God is outside of time. Man is not.

hgodwinson · « **Reply #23 on:** November 09, 2023, 11:46:56 PM »

Quote from: Änσnymσus on November 01, 2023, 07:15:58 PM

Op here, i will add that I am quite scrupulous and that bis mothers side is Catholic (novus ordo) and fathers side is eastern orthodox.

I could be wrong but, to my understanding it was likely a sin of omission. However being barely over the age of reason and having a schismatic and a Novus Ordo for parents will not incline him to the doctrine. Also, if I were in your position, I cannot say I would take any different course of action.

2Vermont · « **Reply #24 on:** November 10, 2023, 06:22:29 AM »

Quote from: Änσnymσus on November 01, 2023, 07:15:58 PM

Op here, i will add that I am quite scrupulous and that bis mothers side is Catholic (novus ordo) and fathers side is eastern orthodox.

OK, so this is probably why your nephew immediately assumed his grandfather is in Purgatory. The Novus Ordo mother probably also believes this and told him this (I'm surprised he didn't think he was already in Heaven). Although his father is EO, it sounds like he's being raised NO.

I think, as uncle, you did your best in the moment. At some future time, when he is older, you might be able to expound on your initial instruction by teaching him that we pray for the "Catholic" souls in Purgatory. Sometimes we have to make inroads a little at a time if we have the opportunities.

So, I'm not a priest, but I think there is no sin here.

CathInfo.com

Author Topic: Is this Sin by omission? (Read 12578 times)

Änσnymσus

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Änσnymσus

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hgodwinson

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hgodwinson

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2Vermont

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