Author Topic: married clergy  (Read 5663 times)

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Änσnymσus

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married clergy
« on: December 10, 2015, 09:20:26 AM »
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  • Is it feasible for Roman Catholicism to allow men already married to be priests?  the Eastern Catholics and Orthodox do it, why not us?  thoughts?

    Offline TKGS

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    married clergy
    « Reply #1 on: December 10, 2015, 10:04:57 AM »
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  • Is a married clergy in the Roman Rite theologically possible?  Yes.  Of course.

    Is it advisable?  No.  This would be such a drastic change in the traditional practices of the Roman Rite that it would be even more destructive of the Church than all the other changes have already been.

    Is it feasible?  First, the definition of feasible is:  Capable of being accomplished or brought about; possible; Capable of being used or dealt with successfully.  Due to this definition, the answer to the question is no.  A married clergy in the Roman Rite is not feasible at this time because there exists no authority at this time capable of changing canon law to allow such a thing.

    Question for the OP:  Why post this question in the αnσnymσus forum?  The question is not one of a sensitive nature in which anonymity would be needed or even desired.


    Änσnymσus

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    married clergy
    « Reply #2 on: December 10, 2015, 01:26:48 PM »
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  • Obviously the Op had a REASON for privacy.

    Too often we look at the subject matter and conclude it is not worthy of anonimity
    but we don't know the circumstances surrounding the query or statement or even further posts by others.

    The whole purpose of an αnσnymσus thread is privacy which we shouldn't invade.

    Offline Miseremini

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    married clergy
    « Reply #3 on: December 10, 2015, 01:29:23 PM »
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  • Sorry, forgot to click the DO NOT post this αnσnymσusly box .
    "Let God arise, and let His enemies be scattered: and them that hate Him flee from before His Holy Face"  Psalm 67:2[/b]


    Offline JezusDeKoning

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    « Reply #4 on: December 10, 2015, 02:26:07 PM »
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  • It could happen. If it does ever come back, I don't see it happening Roman rite-wide. Maybe certain countries who have a shortage of priests consider it.

    It would also be the only way a married Pope would ever exist, as cardinals (at least in these current times; there have been cardinal-priests and cardinal-deacons, even) are derived from the episcopacy and in the East, they come from the monastic orders and are celibate.
    Remember O most gracious Virgin Mary...


    Offline TKGS

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    « Reply #5 on: December 10, 2015, 06:04:01 PM »
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  • Quote from: JezusDeKoning
    It could happen. If it does ever come back, I don't see it happening Roman rite-wide. Maybe certain countries who have a shortage of priests consider it.

    It would also be the only way a married Pope would ever exist, as cardinals (at least in these current times; there have been cardinal-priests and cardinal-deacons, even) are derived from the episcopacy and in the East, they come from the monastic orders and are celibate.


    There is absolutely no tradition in the Church, East or West, of a married episcopacy after Apostolic times.  A married pope would be an abomination.

    Quote from: Miseremini
    Obviously the Op had a REASON for privacy.


    It is not obvious in any way.  Nor is asking the question is not invading the privacy of the OP as the OP obviously has the option to not answering.

    Änσnymσus

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    married clergy
    « Reply #6 on: January 11, 2016, 10:09:04 AM »
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  • During normal times in the Latin Rite Priests should be celibate for any number of reasons.  To devote themselves 100% to a large parish.  To devote themselves 100% to God.  IMO, Marriage with children and the Priesthood both deserve 100% of one's attention.   Pius XII allowed married Anglican clergy converts to become valid Priests in the Catholic Church but that was by exception.  If and when the Church gets restored to normality the married priests should be phased out, i.e. not continued or added to but the Church should retain the discipline in effect for the 1000 years up until the death of Pius XII.  An ordained person should not get married after being ordained regardless of the times as should be obvious from the long established discipline.  Married Priests must submit to what the next valid Pope declares in their cases or die outside the Church. The next valid Pope would not allow future ordinations of married men in the Latin Rite.

    When we have a valid Pope, Priests who prove to be unworthy would be able to be ferreted out as the Faithful would be able to report any of their errors and or tyrannical acts to one who can hold them accountable.  Those "ordained" in the new rite would need to be looked at in regards to whether they have a legitimate vocation or not but would have to cease pretending to be Priests until (if or when) they are validly ordained for obvious reasons.  

    The next valid Pope's first issue, IMO, would be the problems that resulted from and since V2 and "putting the Church back" in a secure and Catholic place in regards to the liturgy and Sacraments, and in regards to clarifying the novelties, errors and heresies of V2, declaring the council to be invalid of course.  He would clarify the Feeneyism issue.  He would clearly teach on all the controversies of the day and show anyone who did not like the teaching where the door is.  The Church needs to be purged of the modernists.  Then look to the valid Priests who claim to be Catholic and loyal to the Holy See and the needs of the faithful in regards to having access to the Sacraments.  Obviously any validly ordained Priest who is a public heretic or not loyal to the Papacy would be declared to be non-Catholic and or schismatic.  This is when he would either allow the Catholic married Priests to continue their apostolate as is, reduce it to being very private or forbid the Priests to fulfill their orders at all apart from extreme necessity.  This after verifying the validity of their orders and getting those who need to be conditionally ordained ordained if in fact it is deemed that they should continue in their orders.  


    Änσnymσus

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    married clergy
    « Reply #7 on: January 11, 2016, 10:54:15 AM »
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  • Quote
    During normal times in the Latin Rite


    never has there been normal times in the church since men have been sinners


    Offline Matthew

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    married clergy
    « Reply #8 on: January 11, 2016, 11:01:15 AM »
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  • Anyone who muses about the Church opening up the priesthood to married men has not spent time at a Seminary or read many books about the priesthood and what it's about.

    That is to say, they haven't learned about (much less meditated upon) the grave responsibility and dignity of the priesthood.

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    Änσnymσus

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    married clergy
    « Reply #9 on: January 11, 2016, 11:15:38 AM »
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  • This is very true and Eastern Rite Priests should reflect on this as the married Anglican clergy who were allowed to be Priests under Pius XII.  Pius XII himself should have reflected on it as the Church herself for the first 1000 years of her existence.  At least we know now.  

    Saint Hilary pray that we get a Pope soon so the dogmatic opinions will end and so we can focus on saving souls instead of all the problems that come with having no Pope for so long.

    Änσnymσus

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    married clergy
    « Reply #10 on: January 11, 2016, 11:18:47 AM »
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  • Quote from: Guest
    Quote
    During normal times in the Latin Rite


    never has there been normal times in the church since men have been sinners


    How about normal from 400 AD - 1958?  I'd settle for all the fluctuation during those times compared to since.  I'd even take 33 -  400 as being more normal that since 1958.  At least that is what I took the poster to mean.  


    Änσnymσus

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    married clergy
    « Reply #11 on: January 11, 2016, 04:07:12 PM »
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  • Perhaps it's time to look at how celibacy (unmarried men) came about in the church.
    It came as a continuation from the Jєωιѕн Temple rites.

    When it was a priests turn to  offer sacrifice in the temple, he had to remain celibate from his wife for the time he was on duty and possibly the two weeks before.(Pg 94)

    A Priest offers the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass  DAILY so therefore must remain celebate always.  NO MARRIED PRIESTS.

    Also,  both men and women ate the first Passover in Egypt but afterwards God gave them special regulations and restricted the feast to men alone (Pg 131)
     That is why there were no women at the Last Supper and why ONLY MEN CAN BE PRIESTS.

    Christ said He came not to destroy the law but to fulfill it.

    In the book, How Christ Said the First Mass by Father James Meagher D.D. 1906 are examples of where the Church gets her rubrics, ceremonies, traditions etc.  ....everything from why we use holy water Pg 56 , why the clergy wear cassocks and their different colours Pg 297,  why 3 P.M. is important Pg 92,  death of the scapegoat Pg 74, Judas, Caiphas' nephew the only strict Jew among the apostles Pg 247. only linen to be used for altar cloths at Mass Pg 287 Jerusalem first called Salem "peace" by Melchisedech then Jireh "possession" by Abraham then joined to make Jerusalem "City of Peace" Pg 224.
    Sem, Noah's son became know as Melchisedech the just king Pg 223

    If we just knew why Christ continued to do traditional things we wouldn't be questioning every little thing and certainly not the big things.

    I recommend this book to everyone looking for answers.  I've quoted from the Tan edition 1984 which is word for word from the original but EACH PAGE is headed with the subject of that page and makes for easy reference.

    Offline Miseremini

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    « Reply #12 on: January 11, 2016, 04:08:33 PM »
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  • Sorry, forgot again to hit the Do Not Post αnσnymσusly
    "Let God arise, and let His enemies be scattered: and them that hate Him flee from before His Holy Face"  Psalm 67:2[/b]


    Offline ClarkSmith

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    « Reply #13 on: January 11, 2016, 04:47:16 PM »
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  • Eastern Orthodox priests can get ordained if they were already married. Their priests  don't typically get married after they've been ordained - at least that's what I've been told.

    I think if they opened the door to married priest the seminary would be full of unsuitable men.  You would get men that wouldn't want to make priesthood their whole life.  

    Offline TKGS

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    « Reply #14 on: January 11, 2016, 05:50:44 PM »
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  • Quote from: Matthew
    Anyone who muses about the Church opening up the priesthood to married men has not spent time at a Seminary or read many books about the priesthood and what it's about.

    That is to say, they haven't learned about (much less meditated upon) the grave responsibility and dignity of the priesthood.


    Evidently, there are quite a few Conciliar priests and bishops who haven't spent much time at a Seminary, read many books about the priesthood, or learned about (much less meditated upon) the grave responsibility and dignity of the priesthood, because that's where I hear the most talk in favor of it.


     

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