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Author Topic: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive  (Read 2792 times)

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Offline Meg

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Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2022, 05:29:41 PM »
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  • I tend to think that rather, Putin must be saddened and very concerned over it.  I think he'd rather see a sane, cooperative and mutually respectful America than a failed state that endangers the world.

    I agree. 
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Meg

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #16 on: December 16, 2022, 05:47:05 PM »
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  • In my mind, this sentence is the best resolution in answer to all the Russia/American arguments on the forum recently.

    Whether people prefer the U.S. or Russia... 

    Both countries have their faults and we should pray for the conversions of both countries.

     

    I agree that we should pray for both countries, but I can't help but be upset by my country's involvement in the Ukraine. We have no business there, and we shouldn't be giving money and weapons to them. That money would be far better spent here. The U.S. has a long history in meddling in the affairs of other counties. The U.S. has worked to overthrow legitimate governments all over the world, sometimes at the behest of Zionists. Then they install a puppet dictator who will do the bidding of the US. At least Putin is having his dispute with a bordering country. But our government (mainly CIA) is willing to go anywhere in the world to wreak havoc. It just isn't right. The neo-cons here may disagree.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Offline Marius

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #17 on: December 16, 2022, 06:00:45 PM »
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  • This is just nuts.  I stated "Perhaps nothing compared to what God Almighty is willing to do to not only America, but the whole world."

    From there you are agreeing with Marius' response: "So nihilism is it? No call for penance and amendment, just open support for a non-Catholic ruler to establish an empire on the burned out ashes of your own people."  Wow, talk about a rash and utterly false judgment based on an outright ignorance of who I am.  Marius has interpreted my statement in a completely wrong way.

     I wonder what he would have told Noah if he ever heard Noah telling people that God was willing to flood the whole world!

    For the record I have never been nor by the grace of God will I ever be anything even approaching a nihilist!

    And then you get up on your pedestal and preach to me by telling me I should "pray that America and Russia are both converted and the Faith restored."  Little do you know that that is what I have been doing for over 30 years!

    But then it gets even crazier if that be possible.  You have the gall to imply that I am wishing "for the destruction of everything through World War III."  You are utterly 100% wrong!
    I do not consider my judgment to have been rash, but based on previous threads in addition to this one. A long history of pro-Kremlin propaganda and pro-Putin apologia, including calling Russia "Holy Mother Russia" even after being informed of its historical and theological meanings, among others. There has been no acknowledgment of the moral state of Russia versus the propaganda version despite repeated discussions where many have been corrected regarding abortion, divorce, church attendance, etc., and continuing pushing the same message. 

    In this thread, Putin was praised as a Statesman; when that assessment was challenged, your response referenced the Divine Wrath and with America as the particular focus. If I misinterpretation that statement, then I am happy to be corrected. It came across as despairing of the state of the country to the point of looking forward to its destruction by God himself, which may be His Will, but the instruments to achieve such a chastisement are not therefore good or "Holy." I do not see how I was entirely wrong when a comment about the Deluge is in the follow up, suggesting the annihilation of everything.

    I do know who you are, nor what you do or say elsewhere in regard to America and Russia. I can only base my judgment on what I have seen over the past year in particular on this forum. Claiming in both this comment and an earlier one that I am "Wong! Wrong! Wrong!" or, while not addressed to me but in the same vein "You are utterly 100% wrong!" does not substantiate anything by itself nor can it without further context or information.


    This is just nuts.  I stated "Perhaps nothing compared to what God Almighty is willing to do to not only America, but the whole world."

     I wonder what he would have told Noah if he ever heard Noah telling people that God was willing to flood the whole world!
    The implication being that I would have scoffed and disbelieved. Insinuate what you like, but I will point out that in my post I mentioned a lack of any call for penance or amendment (or indeed conversion to the Faith) in response to a country and world so wicked to deserve the call for God's Justice.
    If the world is against the Truth, then I am against the World. - St. Athanasius
    In necessariis unitas, in dubiis libertas, in omnibus caritas - St. Augistine

    Offline Meg

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #18 on: December 16, 2022, 06:08:44 PM »
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  • Ok, great. Let's see an end to the non-stop Russian propaganda and panegyrics. Otherwise people might be confused at your desired outcome.

    We aren't going to stop pointing out the good things that Russia/Putin is doing, even if you don't like it. It's not promoting Russian propaganda to point these things out. I can't believe that you can't see the difference. I think you do know the difference.

    And we will keep pointing out the bad things that Zelensky is doing. Do you have a problem with that?
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline dxcat40

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #19 on: December 16, 2022, 06:14:25 PM »
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  • I agree that we should pray for both countries, but I can't help but be upset by my country's involvement in the Ukraine. We have no business there, and we shouldn't be giving money and weapons to them.
    The US/NATO promised to protect Ukraine if it gave up its nuclear weapons (back to Russia). Russia promised to respect Ukraine's borders. Ukraine was the country that got the bad deal; Russia couldn't have invaded if Ukraine had kept its nuclear arsenal.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum


    Offline Meg

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #20 on: December 16, 2022, 06:15:13 PM »
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  • The US/NATO promised to protect Ukraine if it gave up its nuclear weapons. Russia promised to respect Ukraine's borders. Ukraine was the country that got the bad deal; Russia couldn't have invaded if Ukraine had kept its nuclear arsenal.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum

    So you believe that the U.S. is justified in supporting Ukraine? 
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline dxcat40

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #21 on: December 16, 2022, 06:25:50 PM »
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  • We aren't going to stop pointing out the good things that Russia/Putin is doing, even if you don't like it. It's not promoting Russian propaganda to point these things out. I can't believe that you can't see the difference. I think you do know the difference.
    It must be the truth for it to be good for you to promote it. Various pro-Russian posters uncritically forward propaganda and take it at face value. They couldn't accept "proof" the US blew up Russia's pipelines fast enough.

    And we will keep pointing out the bad things that Zelensky is doing. Do you have a problem with that?
    Already answered.

    So you believe that the U.S. is justified in supporting Ukraine?
    I "believe" that it's very probable that the Soviet Union set up this conflict, and others, through strategically placing Russians and claiming to be protecting Slavs a la Hitler and Germans in Eastern Europe.

    You should be satisfied with following Resistance blogs (and nothing else). You have nothing to add here other than more sealioning.

    Offline Meg

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #22 on: December 16, 2022, 06:32:16 PM »
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  • It must be the truth for it to be good for you to promote it. Various pro-Russian posters uncritically forward propaganda and take it at face value. They couldn't accept "proof" the US blew up Russia's pipelines fast enough.
    Already answered.
    I "believe" that it's very probable that the Soviet Union set up this conflict, and others, through strategically placing Russians and claiming to be protecting Slavs a la Hitler and Germans in Eastern Europe.

    You should be satisfied with following Resistance blogs (and nothing else). You have nothing to add here other than more sealioning.

    I've asked you this before - are you Russian? 

    What groups are you affiliated with? Are you pro-Zelensky, and if so, why? You seem to be on some sort of mission here. 
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Offline dxcat40

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #23 on: December 16, 2022, 06:53:41 PM »
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  • I've asked you this before - are you Russian?

    ...
    FYI, these aren't honest questions. It doesn't follow that someone must be Ukrainian, Russian, or a Jєωιѕн (real accusation on CathInfo) mix of one of the two or both to oppose Russia's propaganda. It doesn't mean that I am following Biden or Zelensky, either. I've said where I am from, and I have stated my position multiple times, but you always engage in the sealioning questioning and attempt to discredit anyone posting an opinion you don't like. You should follow my advice in my previous post and spare us the drama.

    Offline Meg

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #24 on: December 16, 2022, 07:01:17 PM »
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  • FYI, these aren't honest questions. It doesn't follow that someone must be Ukrainian, Russian, or a Jєωιѕн (real accusation on CathInfo) mix of one of the two or both to oppose Russia's propaganda. It doesn't mean that I am following Biden or Zelensky, either. I've said where I am from, and I have stated my position multiple times, but you always engage in the sealioning questioning and attempt to discredit anyone posting an opinion you don't like. You should follow my advice in my previous post and spare us the drama.

    Well, in case you haven't noticed, I'm not the only one here who isn't going along with your agenda. We traditional Catholics are interested in politics. We don't have to agree with your view of the situation. 
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline dxcat40

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #25 on: December 16, 2022, 07:51:36 PM »
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  • Well, in case you haven't noticed, I'm not the only one here who isn't going along with your agenda. We traditional Catholics are interested in politics. We don't have to agree with your view of the situation.
    In this very thread, there are traditional Catholics who disagree with you. Traditional Catholics aren't bound to be Kremlinites. Even some pro-Russian members on the forum disagree with some other of +Williamson's other opinions. It's disingenuous of you to attempt to single me out when---out of those that even follow politics on the forum---the active posters can be split on either side depending on the topic and timing of the post.

    Maybe you just like to argue, but you aren't good at this.


    Offline Meg

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    Re: Viktor Bout: Back home from imprisonment | RT exclusive
    « Reply #26 on: December 16, 2022, 07:58:23 PM »
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  • In this very thread, there are traditional Catholics who disagree with you. Traditional Catholics aren't bound to be Kremlinites. Even some pro-Russian members on the forum disagree with some other of +Williamson's other opinions. It's disingenuous of you to attempt to single me out when---out of those that even follow politics on the forum---the active posters can be split on either side depending on the topic and timing of the post.

    Maybe you just like to argue, but you aren't good at this.

    Of course there are some who disagree with me, and some who disagree with you. You don't know much about how traditional Catholicism works in the U.S.

    We are allowed to have differing views, and we don't have to go along with yours. And I will keep saying good things about Russia and Putin, if I see that there are good things to say. That's doesn't mean that I'm promoting Russia propaganda. I don't see that anyone here has been promoting Russian propaganda, yet you keep making this accusation. That's just a silly idea that you have.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29