Could U name some of those 'many popes' who have led 'unvirtuous' lives...............? Alex VI & 1 or 2 Theophylacts are the only ones that occurs to moi.

There have been anti-popes and a few Popes who were not the greatest. but.......

On the contrary:  To those who questioned the number of popes who led unvirtuous lives the following were accused of murder, ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖity, adultry, fornication, beastiality, bribes, begetting children, and other crimes - although legitimate and valid popes - let us first remember that the first to betray Christ was one of the very twelve of the Apostles, Judas.

- John II (955-964)
- Benedict IX (1032-1048)
- Uban VI (1378-1389)
- Alexander VI (1492-1503)
- Paul II (1464-1471)
- Sixtus IV (1471-1484)
- Leo X (1513-1521)
- Julius III (1550-1550)

Although this list is not exhaustive - we might add Pope Stephen VI who held the famous (cadaver synod) whereby Pope Formosus's body was retrieved and put on trial.  Pope Formosus was previously excommunicated for leaving the papal seat and "conspiring to destroy the papal see" but was later forgiven and returned to Rome.
Pope Honorius I (625-638) was condemned and excommunicated by the 6th General Ecuмenical Council in 680 - note after his death - and the Roman Breviary contained the condemnation of Honorius on the feat of St. Leo II right up to the 18th century.

For those with questions the election of Anacletus (Anachelet) II.  It is a historical fact that the election of Innocent II was against the laws of the Church, was illicit and uncanonical.  In the end Pope Anchelet had the obedience of twenty four Cardinals, the consent and support of the members of the clergy of the Lateran Basilica, the Vatican Basilica, the Basilica of Santa Croce and other archbpriests and prest and clergy of the City of Rome, the Roman magistrates and the Roman peoples.  Innocent II on the other hand had an end total of only sixteen Cardinals and not the support of any one else.

If you would investigate the election of Anchelet II you will find that Saint Berhnard and Saint Norbert did not question the election of legitimacy according to the laws of the Church but rather it was on the basis of Cardinal Pierleone and his electors being "unfit" for office due to - here is the problem with modern history's.  It is hard to find a reason for the valid election of Innocent II and the defense given by St's Bernhard and Norbert, who argued not from the canonical laws and proceedures from the Church but on the "worthiness" being that Innocent II was more "worthy" more "spiritually fit" for the office than Cardinal Pierleone.  Everywhere you read of unfit, unworthy, etc but no real explanation until it is discovered that the reason was that Cardinal Pierleone was a Jєω - who up to the later centuries were forbidden by the cannons of the councils of Toledo and others from holding office above a simple priest for converted Jєωs or those of Jєωιѕн descent and that Cardinal Pierleone and some of the other Curia were in fact secret Jєωs underming the faith. We also find that later Innocent II also employed bribery to bring some of the Cardinals over to his side. Nevertheless, we are thankful that Innocent II became Pope but the situation brings up many questions.  To also say sometimes against certian positions, "but it has never happpened in the Church before" or "show me where in the history of the Church this is a precendent" etc, is to ignore the reality of history which is many time the "first time" something has happened.  There is always a first time for something especially in these most dire times for Holy Mother Church.  Our Lady will bring us the ultimate victory, it is she who will be the cause of the end of thise terrible time in the Church, when the consecration of Russia is done to the Immaculate Heart of Mary - then we will begin to see the victory.

I'm not real good on the Internet but here are some references:

- http://www.xsun.edu/~hcfll004/SV1138.html or Sede Vacante 1138
- A more comprehensive history of the Jєωιѕн 5th Column's infiltration into the Church is "The Plot Against the Church", pub. 1962, under the pen name of "Maurice Pinay" by twelve Vatican Theologian/Historians with the collaboration of several Cardinals and Bishops, who while studing the Vatican Archives of historical docuмents from the Church, papacy and councils, in their original languages, discovered mounds of history that were purposely translated into modern languages by "5th Column Clergy historians" who left out whole histories of the infiltration of Judaism into the Church which has continued up till today.

jarhead-- my apologies as there have been bad popes. If the topic is personal morals of a pope and not his policies, then the only one I am aware that has been accused as a pederast & homo is Boniface VIII(8?). I would also agree w/ U on Urban VI as I have in the past speculated that he( along with Boniface & Benedict XV(15?) may one day be declared an anti-pope. Ben XV would not be on trial for his personal morals.

Aside from John XII( Theophylact) though, this is the first I have heard of any moral accusations against any of the other popes mentioned. Leo X liked the good life too much but I haven't heard him accused of any personal crimes.

I have read Pinay & my impression of the anti-pope Pierleone was that ( among other things) he was a simoniacal.

SB-- Bad popes and anti-popes are 2 different things. U can rest assured that I am aware of all the anti-popes.

Von Hoffman is not believable. This has been discussed b4 and the truth is there was no meeting between Pius XII & Alinsky. Did Pius X meet with Herzel? Yes-- why aren't U going after him?

I suspect the poster Saint Basil is none other than Walt Disney from freedomportal.net

More docuмentation, now from a Traditionalist Source,  it appears Saul Alinsky was an advisor to the Pope.
Link Below
http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/f062_Scenario.htm


'In the Archbishop's palace of Milan, Montini was counseled by Maritain, and Alinsky'
Already in Milan, Archbishop Montini was hosting ecuмenical activities, principally by receiving successive delegations of non-Catholic theologians, mostly Anglicans. Another visitor was Jacques Maritain, whose integral humanism Montini and Pacelli had been promoting for the last 20 years.

In summer of 1958, Maritain brought to Montini’s residence a man he considered to be “one of only three revolutionaries worthy of the name, indeed one of the few really great men of this century.” (4) That man was the young Saul David Alinsky.






An Intriguing Scenario

Prof. Remi Amelunxen

There was a paradoxical relationship among three men, Saul David Alinsky, Jacques Maritain and the Archbishop of Milan Giovanni Battista Montini who became Paul VI. Before describing their interrelationship, a short biography of each of the three will be presented.

Alinsky, a radical Marxist
Alinsky, revolutionary to the core.
Saul David Alinsky, a Russian Jєω, was born in 1909 and died in 1972. He was a dedicated Marxist who helped establish the political tactics of subversion that characterized the 1960s in this country.

In the Alinsky paradigm, organizing is a euphemism for revolution, with the objective that any “oppressed” group of the population should acquire power by radically transforming the social and economic structure of the U.S.

As a subtle revolutionary he avoided flaunting bloody radicalism, as set out in his infamous book Rules for Radicals. Instead, for the victory of Marxism he recommended infiltration of churches, unions and political parties to transform them from within. His aim was to ultimately crush the Establishment and install Socialism.



Maritain and his integral humanism

Jacques Maritain, a French Catholic philosopher, was born in in 1882 and died in 1973. He was a Protestant who became a Catholic in 1906 during his student days at the Sorbonne. From 1945 to 1948, he was the French Ambassador to the Vatican. His reputation to be a Thomist scholar and lectures at the Pontifical Institute of Medieval Studies enhanced his prestige and enabled him access to Pope Pius XII and his pro-Secretary of State, Msgr. Montini, with whom he often visited privately. In 1948 he returned to America to take a professorship at Princeton.

In 1936 Maritain expounded his liberal thinking in political philosophy in a book he titled Integral Humanism. In it he promotes a new Christendom rooted in a theocentric pluralism, informed by rights of man of the Enlightenment and conjoined to the philosophy of democracy. Creating this integral humanism would not be a matter of trying to establish the Kingdom of God on earth, Maritain tells us, but rather of making the world a “place of a truly and fully human earthly life.” (1)



In 1966 Maritain and Thomas Merton, the well-known progressivist Trappist monk  
In it he proposes that people of different religions and philosophies cooperate to achieve common good. Society would be governed by a pragmatic consensus, forged by members of a community, who supposedly transcend their religious or philosophical differences to live harmoniously together. (2)

He further developed this progressivist thinking in a second work Man and the State in 1951. In its final pages, he speculates on the possibility of a world government.

Maritain’s theories called for a basic shift in the way the Church looks at herself, i.e. her function and identity. Integral humanism, like the theories of the pantheist-evolutionist Fr. Teilhard de Chardin, sees every religion converging toward a single human ideal in a world civilization where all will be reconciled in peace, love and justice, which supposedly will lead all to a mysterious fulfillment of the Gospel.

In the integral humanism of Jacques Maritain, man enters a universal fraternity where the Catholic Church does not demand or even suggest that she is the one true Church. Maritains’ theory is a call for Catholics to set aside dogmatic differences with her enemies and achieve the desired unity throughout practical arrangements.



Maritain & Alinsky

From Pius XII onward, Maritain was praised and promoted by the Vatican. Paul VI’s enthusiasm for his theories was life-long. Maritain’s thinking on integral humanism and the rights of man spoke to the central concerns of Montini’s life and ministry.


Paul VI welcoming Maritain on the closing day of the Council
Pope Paul VI readily admitted the profound influence of the French theologian’s thinking, and he even cited Maritain’s Integral Humanism in his Encyclical Populorum progressio. At the close of the Vatican Council II, the Pope's "Address to Men of Thought and Science" was dedicated to his dear friend and mentor.

Maritain’s thinking influenced many of the docuмents of Vatican II that dealt with human dignity, ecuмenism and the relations between Church and State. Maritain's presentation on rights is the language of rights that Dignitatis humanae employs.



Many Catholics are unaware of the strong 30-year friendship between the progressivist philosopher Jacques Maritain and the Marxist agitator Saul Alinsky. They were “devoted friends” from their first meeting in 1940, visiting often and discussing issues of social justice. When Maritain was in Rome as ambassador, he sent Alinsky copies of all his articles and talks, and in return he reviewed Alinsky’s manuscript of Rules for Radicals.

In Alinsky’s organizations, Maritain found a near-perfect embodiment of the mediating structures he had called for in Integral Humanism. He also approved of Alinsky’s subversive methods as outlined in Rules for Radicals. (3)





Paul VI , a longtime admirer of Maritain

A short biography of Paul VI follows before we reach the intriguing scenario that involves the three men – Montini, Maritain and Alinsky. Giovanni Battista Martini was born in 1897 and died in 1978. He was pro-Secretary of State from 1922 to 1954 and was protected and promoted by Pius XI and Pius XII. In 1954 Pius XII named him Archbishop of Milan. In 1958, John XXIII made him a Cardinal, a perfect timing for Montini to be elected Pope in 1963, after the short reign of John XXIII.

Already in Milan, Archbishop Montini was hosting ecuмenical activities, principally by receiving successive delegations of non-Catholic theologians, mostly Anglicans. Another visitor was Jacques Maritain, whose integral humanism Montini and Pacelli had been promoting for the last 20 years.

Intriguing scenario

In summer of 1958, Maritain brought to Montini’s residence a man he considered to be “one of only three revolutionaries worthy of the name, indeed one of the few really great men of this century.” (4) That man was the young Saul David Alinsky.



In the Archbishop's palace of Milan, Montini was counseled by Maritain, middle, and Alinsky, bottom
It was Maritain who advised Card. Montini to consult Saul Alinsky on how to organize communities and how to train leaders for work on social justice. The communist Alinsky, the progressivist Maritain and the Cardinal of Milan spent an entire week discussing the Church’s relations with the powerful local communist trade union. Alinsky’s meeting with Maritain convinced Card. Montini that his brand of revolution could become part of the Catholic Church.

Alinsky called this “the Church of today and tomorrow,” which should be a Church free of dogma. He stated, “I detest and fear dogma. Nobody owns the truth, and dogma, whatever form it takes, is the ultimate enemy of known freedom.” (5)

And so we find Alinsky, Maritain and Montini together in the Cardinal’s palace exploring the common interests bridging Communism and Catholic Church, a truly intriguing scenario.

We find an Alinsky-like call for an “evangelization of love” at the 1974 Synod where Card. Karol Wojtyla (the future John Paul II) acted as official theologian. His introductory intervention, “Bishops as Servants of the Faith” breathed Maritain’s Integral Humanism. (6) This new evangelization should set aside the dogma that supposedly alienates, and instead seek to find a set of fundamental moral criteria around which all could agree on to achieve goals for the common good. The Church Militant becomes the Church Loving.

A side note of surprising importance is that Barach Hussein Obama was a dedicated student of the then-dead Saul Alinsky and of his live mentor Bill Ayers, who had been an actual student of Saul Alinsky. The destructive effects of the Alinsky doctrine in the politics of Obama is apparent. Today we are seeing the establishing of a socialist-autocratic State, the redistribution of wealth, a persecution against the wealthy, the near financial bankruptcy of the country, moral decadence, military weakness and many other evils.

Thus we see the long arms of the teaching of Alisnsky, which continues to influence both the State and the Catholic Church.
1. D. Q. McInerny, “The Social Thought of Jacques Maritain,” Catholic Social Science Review, p. 165
2. Ibid., p. 164
3. C.J. Wolfe, “Lessons from the Friendship of J. Maritain with S. Alinsky,” The Catholic Social Science Review, 16 (2011), pp. 229-230
4. Mary Ball Martínez, The Undermining of the Catholic Church, 1991, pp. 100-102.
5. Ibid.
6. Ibid., p. 149.

Another Source:


http://www.traditio.com/comment/com0909.htm
(scroll down a bit)

Pope Paul VI Learned from a Meeting with the Atheist/Anarchist Alinsky
How to Introduce Revolution into the Catholic Church to Turn It into the Modernist Newchurch


One summer [Jacques] Maritain brought to Montini's house an American who he considered to be "one of only three revolutionaries worthy of the name, indeed, one of the few really great men of this century."
It was Saul David Alinsky. The self styled "professional radical" was to spend a week with Archbishop Montini discussing the Church's relationship with the powerful communist trade union.
 "There I was", Alinsky told his biographer S.K. Sanders, "sitting between the Archbishop and the beautiful blonde union official discussing the common interests bridging communism and capitalism.

Alinsky's disparagement of religion was well known. He dedicated his book, Rules for Radicals, to "the first radical, Lucifer." As for the destruction of the Catholic Church, Saul Alinsky explained his position to Playboy a few years later.
He had left his strict Jєωιѕн family to join the International Brigade in the Spanish cινιℓ ωαr. Going on to develop his theory of "people power," he said that it was after meeting Jacques Maritain that he began to see how the revolution could become part of the Catholic Church.

Alinsky, however, preferred to call the institution the "Church of Today and Tomorrow."
It was a Church that he felt must become quite free of dogma: "I detest and fear dogma. Nobody owns truth and dogma, whatever form it takes; it is the ultimate enemy of human freedom.
Alinsky, Maritain, and Montini expressed serene accord that the Church Militant must give way to the 'Church Loving.'" And that is the Church that Benedict-Ratzinger heads today, one that is, in the Modernist style, devoid of definite doctrine and "liturgies" detached from Tradition, which can be selected cafeteria style to suit any taste.

Pope Paul VI's interest in Marxism seems to have quite a history.  It has been said and reported that he was found to be continually reading and passing out Marxist literature within the Roman seminaries and then he arranged a secret meeting with Russian/Communists without the permission of Pope Pius XII.  When Pius found out it is rumored that he gave then Cardinal Montini 48 hour to clear himself out of the Vatican and Rome and was banished to a remote See in Italy.  John Paul himself was seen publically often reading Marxist literature,so we see that the infiltration of Modernism/Marxism via the real culprits ʝʊdɛօ/Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ.

Again, we may recall the 1968 raid on the P2 Masonic Lodge in Rome by the authorities wherein they discovered and published the names of over 100 Cardinals/Bishops and clergy of high rank who had been initiated into the Masonic Lodge, with their given initiation names and dates.  Twice more before 2000 the same P2 Lodge was raided for different reasons and each time was discovered names of many of the hierarchy that were secretly initiated into Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ.  A recent Italian Illuminati, who claims that he was a member of several lodges and of high rank, has revealed that there is a "very secret" members list of hight ranking Freemasons within the Curia that is kept very secret and accessible by very few.  That ʝʊdɛօ/Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ is entrenched withing the Church is a forgone conclusion.  The aim of ʝʊdɛօ/Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ was  to destroy the faith but not the legislative or the operating structure of the Church but rather to use the Church, blind obedience and ecuмenism to form the one world church.  Pope Benedict not long ago opined that we should have a one world religion, government, and new order.

Bishop Williamson, after one of the Society's earlier visits to Rome and with talks with Ecclesia Dei told his seminarians (my son was in the seminary for four years) that there were four groups within the Vatican:  Three of the groups are competing Masonic groups which conspire with each other for control of the Church but at the same time conspire against each other, each wanting to be the power brokers; the fourth is a group of loose conservative Cardinals, few in number, with no appreciable organization. If some of you recall Fr. Malachy Martins book "Winswept House" and the story of the assassination of head of the Vatican Guard, you then remember that not long after the book came out low and behold the Chief of the Vatican guard was αssαssιnαtҽd by his second in command.  This apparently was ordered and carried out by the in house Vatican Masons.  Let us recall also from the same book, a book that Fr. Martin claimed was 90% true with some names and circuмstances changed in order to protect his sources, and to avoid any charges of defamation, etc, that he had to write the book as a "novel".  There was the "Masonic Ritual" that was held in St. John's Lateran at midnight simultaneously with one in Charleston S.C. 33 parallel, wherein they ritually murdered a young girl and by phone co-ordinated the ritual with the one in St. John's Lateran.  I guess we could bring out many articles, revelations, etc, to paint a very dire picture of the terrible situation in the Church, whereby the enemies of Christ and His Church have gotten control of not only the Church but of the governments of the world - as B. Williamson said some time ago - Fɾҽҽmαsσɳɾყ is at the height of its power, that it has never been in such a exalted position of power before as it is today, so that there is no human power to match or oppose them decisively.  However, the promise of "indefectability" guarantees that before the enemy would gain total victory over Christ and His Church, God will intervene and ultimately save the Church and the world in spite of ourselves or the hierarchy, this victory is left to Our Lady, but in the mean time things will get much worse.

Lets never give up hope, here are some side brief stories of Catholic heroism and courage.

I have been much reflecting on the movie "Lord of the Rings" by Tolkien - how many times did it seem that the good was on the verge of defeat, that there seemed to be no hope and the end was near - and then unexpectedly, suddenly the battle turned and victory.  Never despair, never give up hope, never surrender, the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary are on our side.  
In 1215, the Catholics faced the maurading Albengensians.   The Catholics had 200 horse and 800 infantry against 100,000 mounted battle hardened Albegensians - the Catholics knelt down and prayed the Rosayr and attacked - the Albegensians were slaughtered and only 8 Catholics wounde and 2 killed.
Then there is the great El Cid (who by the way did not die in battle and was never ever defeated - contrary to the epic movie made staring Charlton Heston - El Cid die of natural cause in old age) There is a story and book to read of Catholic heroism in battle.  During the time of Isabella of Spain - the Catholic Knights stood on one side of the battle field opposite an overwhelming force of Moslems - the Catholics charged, surely to their deaths, but bravely and courageously.  As the Catholic knights charged, out of the clouds came three horses with the three Archangels riding them into and joining the charge of the Catholic Knights and delivering the Moslems to their destiny - true story - there is a statue in Spain commemoration this battle and the joining of the Archangels.
How many have ever read the story of "St Michael" in Korea - google the story of how St. Michael saved a Marine in Korea by cutting off the heads of six enemy Chi-choms (Chinese Communists).  I'm an old Vietnam Marine and even I have seen and heard stories in Vietnam and other wars where miracles happened to say those who were on the verge of defeat and death, by the Saints and Angels.
Never give up your faith nor your trush in Our Lord and Our Lady, not until you are standing there with them in heaven for all eternity in the love of God.

...we might add Pope Stephen VI who held the famous (cadaver synod) whereby Pope Formosus's body was retrieved and put on trial. ...

What is your problem with the cadaver synod?

I, for one, would welcome another cadaver synod to dispatch all the V2 and post-V2 monsters: "annul their acts, installations, and consecrations, damn their desacralized and blasphemous rites, defrock their cadavers, cut off the three fingers of their right hands used in their 'installations' and 'consecrations,' burn their works, and toss their rotten cadavers in the Tiber."