Author Topic: What is the problem with the "Dialogue Mass"? (Read 10289 times)

Soubirous · « **Reply #70 on:** May 29, 2023, 06:12:47 PM »

Quote from: 6 Million Oreos on May 29, 2023, 05:26:28 PM

What is the point of the priest celebrating mass in Latin when everyone behind him is reading a direct translation of everything he's saying? Maybe God just thinks latin sounds cool....

I can't speak for anyone else. Yeah about all the miming Et cuм spiritu tuo. But that's the beauty of keeping my eyes either on the missal or on the altar and not on what anyone else is doing.

In advance I read the Propers because it seems that it helps the faith to be at least aware of what's what during the liturgical year. Also, I understand the Latin (being one of those "south of Calais" people), and I don't see the evil in simultaneously hearing and reading along the fully non-dialogue parts from Introit to Last Gospel. There's a fullness to it this way, and for me it's devotional.

Quote

The liturgy is not meant to be 100 percent accessible to the faithful. Not that it is hermetic, but its purpose is other than to be a spectacle for laypeople. Why do you think virtually all sanctuaries were veiled before the year 1500?

I'm not arguing with that. But I'm not holding out for a return to perfect worship during my lifetime. That would simply invite despair, no?

SeanJohnson · « **Reply #71 on:** May 29, 2023, 06:14:20 PM »

Quote from: Ladislaus on May 29, 2023, 06:01:13 PM

There's no doubt that St. Pius X did not have the time to personally investigate / study the voluminous works of Newman. He therefore deferred to the analysis done by this particular bishop. Newman, being the typical Modernist, will intermingle orthodox statements with the Modernist ones, and someone who wanted to defend Newman could do so by cherry-picking (or focusing on) the orthodox statements. Cardinal Manning at one point stated that he had found at least 10 heresies in the works of Newman, and always referred to Newman disparagingly as "Doctor Newman". 6 UK bishops denounced Newman to Rome for heresy. But one need look no further than Newman's statement appealing to a future Pope to correct the definition of infallibility for irrefutable evidence that he was a Modernist.

Translation:

“Pius X couldn’t possibly have the time to disagree with me, and entering his letter into the AAS doesn’t mean anything (but for you RR people resisting stuff in the AAS, well, you’re destroying the magisterium!).”

6 Million Oreos · « **Reply #72 on:** May 29, 2023, 06:22:21 PM »

Quote from: Soubirous on May 29, 2023, 06:12:47 PM

I can't speak for anyone else. Yeah about all the miming Et cuм spiritu tuo. But that's the beauty of keeping my eyes either on the missal or on the altar and not on what anyone else is doing.

In advance I read the Propers because it seems that it helps the faith to be at least aware of what's what during the liturgical year. Also, I understand the Latin (being one of those "south of Calais" people), and I don't see the evil in simultaneously hearing and reading along the fully non-dialogue parts from Introit to Last Gospel. There's a fullness to it this way, and for me it's devotional.

If you understand latin to a large extent, then you must enjoy the richness of the prayers, proper and ordinary, of the Mass and you should be thankful, for the liturgy is absolutely wondrous.

However, you've been saying something in a couple of posts that is just not true. People, be they from certain meridional parts of latin countries or not, do not understand latin simply in virtue of their mother tongue. This has not been the case for quite some time.

Soubirous · « **Reply #73 on:** May 29, 2023, 06:45:40 PM »

Quote from: 6 Million Oreos on May 29, 2023, 06:22:21 PM

If you understand latin to a large extent, then you must enjoy the richness of the prayers, proper and ordinary, of the Mass and you should be thankful, for the liturgy is absolutely wondrous.

However, you've been saying something in a couple of posts that is just not true. People, be they from certain meridional parts of latin countries or not, do not understand latin simply in virtue of their mother tongue. This has not been the case for quite some time.

Thankful I am.

But not the standard national languages as spoken now, rather, the much older obscure forms that nobody's commonly spoken for ages and that young adults in those countries today barely recognize. I learned it in infancy from people born in the 19th century who hadn't been reprogrammed by liberal public education. If I say that I was astonished at my first [adult] TLM at how much I understood without a missal, I'm not making it up. I also remember the old mass from when I was little. True, nobody carried a missal back then.

Pax Vobis · « **Reply #74 on:** May 29, 2023, 06:47:59 PM »

Quote

What is the point of the priest celebrating mass in Latin when everyone behind him is reading a direct translation of everything he's saying?

This question makes no theological sense.

CathInfo.com

Author Topic: What is the problem with the "Dialogue Mass"? (Read 10289 times)

Soubirous

Re: What is the problem with the "Dialogue Mass"?

SeanJohnson

Re: What is the problem with the "Dialogue Mass"?

6 Million Oreos

Re: What is the problem with the "Dialogue Mass"?

Soubirous

Re: What is the problem with the "Dialogue Mass"?

Pax Vobis

Re: What is the problem with the "Dialogue Mass"?