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Author Topic: The New Divine Innocents  (Read 2128 times)

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Offline andysloan

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The New Divine Innocents
« on: October 06, 2015, 12:52:44 PM »
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  • Dear all,

    For you prayerful discernment, Our King and Queen of Glory are appearing in England in management of an Apostolate regarding the unborn. The aborted children will eventually be claimed by the Church as the new Holy Innocents and the grace thereby generated will contribute to usher in the new age of peace through the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart. Please see the following website for info;

    http://divine-innocence.org/

    As Our Lord said to Maria Valtorta in the 1940's;

    Pg. 8 "The First In The Ranks of The New Redeemers Are Innocent Infants"

    Jesus speaks:

    "Are you sad about them? So am I. Poor babies! Little children whom I so loved and who had to die like that! And I caressed them with the tenderness of a Father and a God who sees in each little infant the masterpiece of His creation, not yet profaned; children who die, killed by hatred, and in a chorus of hatred."

    "Oh! let fathers and mothers not curse and thus profane the h0Ɩ0cαųst of their broken flowers! Father and mothers must understand that not one tear of their little ones, not one moan of these immolated innocents, remains without echo in My Heart. Heaven is opened for them, for they are in no way different from their little brothers of an earlier time, killed by Herod out of hatred for Me. These too are killed by wicked "Herods", guardians of a power which I gave them to do good, and for which they will have to render an account to Me."

    "I would come for everyone, but especially for these, recently born for life, which is a gift of God, and already snatched from life by fierce violence which is a gift for the devil. But you must know that in order to wash the contaminated blood that pollutes the Earth, and which is shed with spite and malediction, to spite and curse Me Who am Love, this dew of innocent blood is needed, for it is the only one that is shed without cursing or without hating, just as I, the Lamb, poured out My Blood for you. These innocents are the little lambs of the new era, the only ones whose sacrifice, gathered up by Angels, is wholly pleasing to My Father."

    "After them come the repentant, But only after them, because even the most perfect repentant drags along, with his sacrifice, the remains of human imperfections, of hatred, of selfishness. The first in the ranks of the redeemers are those infants, whose eyes are closed in the midst of horror, to be reopened on My Heart, in Heaven."



    God bless all!!


    Offline Stubborn

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #1 on: October 06, 2015, 01:03:07 PM »
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  • Where do you come up with this stuff I wonder?
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse


    Offline Matto

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #2 on: October 06, 2015, 02:10:29 PM »
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  • Pelagianism.
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #3 on: October 06, 2015, 02:52:26 PM »
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  • Quote from: andysloan
    As Our Lord said to Maria Valtorta in the 1940's;


     :facepalm:

    Offline Matto

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #4 on: October 06, 2015, 02:55:50 PM »
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  • I should pretend to have divine revelations and see if anyone believes me. Maybe I could even ask for donations. :incense:
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.


    Offline andysloan

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #5 on: October 06, 2015, 03:07:20 PM »
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  • To Holy French stigmatic sweet Marie Julie Jahenny


    The Sacred Heart warned another forerunner (of the chastisement) would be when Christians would have no peace amongst themselves and begin to tear each other apart:    “When the time to purify the Earth will be close, when minds revolt one against another, when there will be neither peace nor justice in My Christians, not in the world but in My Christians, the hour of My justice will be close. I will purify the earth of all those impure and unjust souls that insult and outrage Me. I will strike down their bodies with a feature of My Justice so precipitate, so fast, that it will be fast as lightning ... then My anger and My Justice. (...) Never has any punishment happened like this which is close, very close. Never has the world been as corrupt, deceitful, deceptive, greedy, ambitious and wicked. (...) I do not want you to open the depth of these infamous crimes. If you knew the infamous correspondences that are under the influence of Satan. They sell My Holy Church, they sell in secret the head of the priest, the sell in secret the poor earth that they subject to a horrible punishment. It has not seen, it did not understand and today it makes a hellish trade that the world has never seen before take place. All is delivered up, everything is sold and plots being hatched, every day, the hunger for human flesh to devour, the thirst for human blood makes all their bodies seethe with unrest and a desire to reach the goal as soon as possible. All this is happening in the room of hell (Chamber of Deputies, Paris France), under the chairmanship of souls sold to the spirit of evil.” (November 12, 1924)


    http://www.mysticsofthechurch.com/2015/07/marie-julie-jahenny-breton-stigmatist.html

    Matthew 24:12

    And because iniquity hath abounded, the charity of many shall grow cold.

    Offline Stubborn

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #6 on: October 06, 2015, 04:36:23 PM »
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  • The more devout the NOer, the more truth they let go of as they embrace their errors, including embracing false prophets.



    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline andysloan

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #7 on: October 08, 2015, 03:03:06 PM »
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  • For the record, I am a Traditional catholic.  But I believe attendance at the NO is acceptable in absence of a Latin Mass.

    Excerpt from 1970's Exorcism


    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/on.com/gp//ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=on.com/gp/&linkCode=as2&tag=httpwwwchanco-20


    TRADITIONALISTS


    Exorcist: In the name...!

    Beelzebub:
    There are numbers of “traditionalists”, as many lay people as priests, who are full of self-righteousness, who are steeped in a kind of new phariseeism. They say, and sometimes they preach: “We are the good ones, we are the just, the rest are not worth much any more. We will go to Heaven.” That is pretty close to the sects: they say the same thing. Those up there (he points upward) do not like this behavior at all.. They do not love men very much who are righteous in their own eyes.

    If, in this book, it has been necessary to speak about the Mass and about the Church, and amongst other things, the Mass of Saint Pius V, that does not mean to say that certain “traditionalists” should exalt themselves above the modernists, as if they were the only ones who know how to make a sound judgment, in a suitable way, and with all the necessary competence. That is not what this book is all about. It is simply intended to expose all the abuses in the Church, such as they exist today.

    But, to complete the picture, we must still say this: The priests who say: “It is better for you to stay at home rather than go to such Masses”, are making a mistake. If the Mass is degraded to that point where the priest himself no longer believes in the words of the Consecration, and no longer pronounces the words as they should be pronounced, if he no longer has the intention of consecrating, then the host is not consecrated, it is true... but, for all that, people can still pray in the church.

    I have to say this also: they are defrauded of Christ and of the fullness of the graces, it is true, but certain graces are still attached to it. Especially when good Christians, of deep faith, go to Mass and Communion full of devotion, with the intention of receiving Christ, then Heaven is fair enough not to say simply: “Because the priest is not doing things properly, there will be no graces here!” Those people nevertheless do receive certain graces.

    E: Do these people fulfill their duty to the Lord?

    B: If the people have the opportunity of going to a Mass of Saint Pius V, then Heaven prefers that, very much so. But if there is no other possibility, they may go to another Mass. After the Mass of Saint Pius V in Latin, the Tridentine Mass in the vernacular comes in second place, provided that it comprises the totality of the words of the Tridentine Mass as far as this is possible. Only after these, in third place, comes the New Mass. But those people, if they do not know these things and are of good faith, nevertheless fulfill their duty to the Lord, in so far as that is their intention.

    On the other hand, if they know very well that a kilometer further away, they would find a Mass of Saint Pius V, and if they say to themselves: “Bah! That, is too far away for me, I am not going to run over there!”; and if they know very well that that would be better, then we have a different situation. Then, they have lost out enormously through negligence. They should have gone that kilometer. Do you know (in a tearful voice) how far we would go, if we were still able to share in such great graces? Ah! We would travel to the ends of the earth, if we still had a chance! We do not wish to imply by this, that the other Masses are as good. We have already said enough about which Mass Those up there prefer (he points upward).

    We have to reveal the error which many priests are making. It is a fundamental error to instill into men that they must not go to any New Mass, that it comes from the devil, etc... That also is throwing the baby away with the bath-water, it is going to the opposite extreme. Never does such a condemnation have any place under the mantle of love of neighbor. In these circuмstances there are modernists who have love of neighbor, who are sometimes better than such “traditionalists” who exalt themselves above others. We are obliged to say that as part of this... and everything we have just said about the Sacraments and other subjects...

    And it should also be said that there are many “traditionalists” who are Pharisees.




    The book essentially exposes the remarks and gestures made by a possessed woman in Switzerland during 1975‑1978. Speaking through the possessed woman, the demons were forced to tell the truth by Our Lady under the Solemn Church Exorcism, which was witnessed by the following priests who have all expressed their conviction of the authenticity of the revelations made by the demons upon the order of the Blessed Virgin.

    1. Abbot Albert‑l`Arx, Niederbuchorten

    2. Abbot Arnold Elig, Ramiswil

    3. Abbot Ernest Fischer, Missionary, Gossau (St.‑Gall).

    4. Rev. Father Pius Gervasi, O.S.B., Disentis

    5. Abbot Karl Holdener, Ried

    6. Rev. Father Gregoire Meyer, ‑ Trimbach

    7. Rev. Father Robert Rinderer, C.P.P.S., Auw

    8. Abbot Louis Veillard, Cerneux‑Pequignot

    All eight priests are Swiss, except Father E. Fischer, a German. All participated in the exorcisms except Father G. Meyer who was spiritual director of the possessed woman. Two other French priests also participated in the exorcisms.


    DECLARATION



    Some of the shepherds of the Church who ought to be protectors of the Faith and of the Truth are that no longer. That is why the Blessed Virgin Mary forces Satan -the father of lies - to tell the truth and to teach the pure doctrine of the Church, even while he fulminates against these Warnings. It is a question of waking the shepherds up and bringing about the triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, the Mother of the Holy Church.

    It must be understood that all these communications should be compared with the authentic doctrine of the Church and with its present situation. But it is certain, here and now, that the contents of this book show the way towards a profound renewal of the Church.

    Reverend Father Arnold Renz



    DECLARATION

    THE UNDERSIGNED, DOCTOR MICHEL MOURET, CHIEF DOCTOR OF THE PSYCHIATRIC DEPARTMENT OF THE LIMOUX HOSPITAL (AUDE), AFTER HAVING EXAMINED MRS. R.B. IN SWITZERLAND, AND HAVING BEEN PRESENT THIS DAY, APRIL 26, 1978, AT AN EXORCISM INVOLVING HER, IN THE PRESENCE OF FOUR PRIESTS, OF A DURATION OF THREE AND A HALF HOURS, DECLARE THAT IN THE TYPE OF MANIFESTATIONS PRESENTED BY THE SUBJECT THERE WAS NO EVIDENCE OF EITHER A RAVING PSYCHOSIS, NOR OF AN HYSTERICAL PERSONALITY - TWO DIAGNOSES TO BE ELIMINATED IN THIS CASE. BUT HERE WAS EVIDENCE OF MEDIUMISTIC PHENOMENA THAT THE CHURCH IS ACCUSTOMED TO CALL POSSESSION, WHICH IS MORE OR LESS, TRANSITORY.

    Dr. Michael Gabriel Mouret


    Offline andysloan

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    « Reply #8 on: October 08, 2015, 03:08:27 PM »
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  • And Maria Valtorta has strong sponsorship;

    His Holiness Pope Pius XlI, February 26 1948:


    "Publish this work as it is. there is no need to give an opinion about its origin, whether it be extraordinary or not. Who reads it, will understand."

    See also;

    http://www.valtorta.org/church_approval_history_reviews_and_critiques.asp


    http://www.maria-valtorta.net/



    Multiple Bishops and Archbishops (one of whom is a Major Archbishop, Padiyara of Ernakulam, head of the Syro-Malabar rite) have written letters of approval for the Malayalam translation of the Poem. Among them include; Archbishop Gregorous of Trivandrum, Bishop Benjamin of Darjeeling, Bishop D'souza of Pune, Bishop Kundukulam, Bishop Kureethara, and Bishop Soosa of Trivandrum. Bishop Soosa is later promoted to Archbishop by pope John Paul II


    Offline Stubborn

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    « Reply #9 on: October 08, 2015, 03:12:09 PM »
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  • Quote from: andysloan
    For the record, I am a Traditional catholic.  But I believe attendance at the NO is acceptable in absence of a Latin Mass.
     


    You're another one of the compromisers then.

    Thankfully there were enough faithful Catholics who did not compromise back in the early days of the revolution. Just think, if everyone believed like you that the NO is acceptable, there would be no traditional Catholics or TLM today.


    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline Croixalist

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    « Reply #10 on: October 08, 2015, 03:54:54 PM »
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  • Quote from: andysloan
    And Maria Valtorta has strong sponsorship;

    His Holiness Pope Pius XlI, February 26 1948:


    "Publish this work as it is. there is no need to give an opinion about its origin, whether it be extraordinary or not. Who reads it, will understand."

    See also;

    http://www.valtorta.org/church_approval_history_reviews_and_critiques.asp


    http://www.maria-valtorta.net/



    Multiple Bishops and Archbishops (one of whom is a Major Archbishop, Padiyara of Ernakulam, head of the Syro-Malabar rite) have written letters of approval for the Malayalam translation of the Poem. Among them include; Archbishop Gregorous of Trivandrum, Bishop Benjamin of Darjeeling, Bishop D'souza of Pune, Bishop Kundukulam, Bishop Kureethara, and Bishop Soosa of Trivandrum. Bishop Soosa is later promoted to Archbishop by pope John Paul II



    In general I think I can agree about charity running cold among Catholics. We sometimes go too far in trying to correct others and not far enough in building up the good things. But that's really cheap to bring up the moment such a controversial set of topics isn't instantly applauded.

    What you are doing here is attempting to make Valtorta into something she is not, namely a formally approved visionary by the proper Church authorities in any way shape or form. I know, I know you'll say that the Vatican condemnation hardly holds weight against the supposed approval of Pius XII. I suppose it wouldn't, but what Pope would neglect to put in writing what he thought was important enough to approve? It doesn't matter really because hearsay has no weight. It might give you hope for some future recognition, but it doesn't give you the right to say it's good enough right now. It isn't, it really isn't.

    Couple that with a desire to force all of us to agree with you lest we come across as "uncharitable" is a power play as much as any might pull around here. Precisely one of the reasons abortion is so abominable is because it robs those souls of the beatific vision. To all of the sudden reverse that church teaching because of one "mystic" is incredibly irresponsible. Not to mention, relying on an ill-advised conversation with a demoniac in the process!

    You can do a lot better. If you're so concerned about unity among Catholics, then try to stay clear of the fringe topics. No one needs to believe Valtorta, a demon's ravings about anything, or the idea that all of the aborted go to Heaven. Is it really that difficult to stick to the tried and true? Do we have to constantly test each other's limits when we don't have to?

    Prudence is a virtue!
    Fortuna finem habet.


    Offline andysloan

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    « Reply #11 on: October 08, 2015, 09:57:38 PM »
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  • It is not Church teaching that aborted children do not receive the beatific vision, but the opinion of a number of theologians.

    In fact, aborted children receive the baptism of blood, being crucified in their innocence.


    As for Maria Valtorta, the endorsement of Pius XII is hardly an approval that should be dismissed out-of-hand!

    Both the Divine Mercy devotion and Our Lady of Lipa were prohibited by the Church, but are now fully approved.

    And you think I shouldn't be indignant when I see so many Catholics reject what Our Lord has given as a tremendous gift to the faithful? See what Our Lord had to say Himself to the holy priest Fr Michelini about the revelations to Maria Valtorta. You can also see the true definition of prudence!


    "Among these priests is X; he is dear to Me because of his desire
    of perfection and also by his love for the marvelous work that the
    world ignores and that the proud reject, but that the humble love:

    “The Poem of the Man-God.”

    It is a work desired by divine Wisdom and Providence for the
    new times; it is a source of living and pure water.
    It is I, the living and eternal Word, who am giving myself as
    food to the souls that I love. I am light, and light is not confused,
    nor much less fused, with darkness. Where I enter, darkness is
    dissipated, to give place to the light.
    Where there is no life, there is death, and death is putrefaction.
    There is a spiritual putrefaction that is no less nauseating than
    organic putrefaction of bodies that rot. I, who am truth and life,
    living water and the light of the world, how could I make my
    dwelling in souls infected with the concupiscence of the flesh and
    of the spirit?
    Son, this also proves that he who has not felt in the "Poem" the
    savor of the divine, the perfume of the supernatural, has his soul
    darkened and filled with obstacles.
    There are bishops, priests and men and women religious who
    still hide themselves in this prudence, for them the cause of so
    many imprudences. They withdraw inside themselves and know
    not that they are in the refuge of the demon. Prudence is virtue,
    and virtue is not nauseated at the presence of the divine.
    My son, to what depths have we arrived!
    Let Rev. X know that every time he re-reads the “Poem of the
    ManGod,” he is giving Me joy, for all those who have denied it to Me.
    Let him fear nothing, even if there are those who reject it and
    do not understand it."




    http://english.michelini.in/


    Page 245

    Offline Matto

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    The New Divine Innocents
    « Reply #12 on: October 08, 2015, 10:06:42 PM »
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  • Quote from: andysloan
    It is not Church teaching that aborted children do not receive the beatific vision, but the opinion of a number of theologians.


    So now everyone has BOB even all of those babies who die without baptism. The Church defined that those who die in original sin alone all go to hell for no reason because all of those who die in original sin alone really have Baptism of Blood and nobody goes to hell. You have no faith. :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline andysloan

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    « Reply #13 on: October 08, 2015, 11:31:01 PM »
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  • Matto, are you not able to maturely state your case? Why are the mocking icons necessary to you?
       

    Proverbs 3:32


    "For every mocker is an abomination to the Lord, and his communication is with the simple."

       

    John 13:34


    "A new commandment I give unto you: That you love one another, as I have loved you, that you also love one another."


    And then I am told I have no faith, which is ridiculous (8th commandment).

    The Church teaching you quote is correct. But the case with the aborted babies is distinct from this. In direction of providence, they are subjected to the cruelest murder in attack and destruction of their innocence. The point of doctrine is that they are thereby martyrs, baptised in their own innocent blood.


    You can study the website of the Divine Innocence, if you wish to understand the theology.

    http://divine-innocence.org/



     

    Offline Stubborn

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    « Reply #14 on: October 09, 2015, 06:00:32 AM »
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  • Quote from: Pope Pius IX
    We address to the members of this Congress well-merited praise, because.... they have recognized and accepted that all Catholics are obliged in conscience in their writings to obey the dogmatic decrees of the Catholic Church, which is infallible..........this perfect adhesion to revealed truths, which they have recognized to be absolutely necessary to the true progress of science and the refutation of error,


    So Andy, Pope Pius IX decrees it "absolutely necessary" to use the "dogmatic decrees" to refute error.

    Produce dogmatic decrees (not an interpretation of dogmatic decrees) that support your belief that salvation is rewarded to people who die without ever having been baptized and you will achieve victory in this debate.

    Since you will never be able to accomplish this, accept that the feeneyites ALWAYS follow the teachings of the Church and Pope Pius IX and produce many dogmatic decrees to refute the error of a BOD - why do you remain disobedient to the dogmatic decrees?
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse