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Author Topic: So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....  (Read 2309 times)

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Offline pollozlocoz

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So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
« on: July 07, 2013, 01:31:25 PM »
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  • Where I live, there are no sspx or resistance chapels near by, and I am a minor in a non-Catholic family, so there is no way for me to take a 40 minute trip to the closest independent chapel. So what did I do all this months? I went to an diocesan TLM that is near my house. Today, however I didn't go, here's why:

    I have been thinking a lot lately. The priests at the parish certainly have good intentions, but I feel like I am getting the same modernism but with Latin and polyphony. In other words, they're phonies. You can see this especially when the priest mentions St Faustina in his homily, or when he talks about how the council was misinterpreted and John Paul II and all that nonsense.  This made not want to go many times, but I still attended that mass anyway, until today, because I have read many times that the new rite of ordination might be invalid. So if the priest who offers that mass isn't a priest, does the transubstantiation happen in that mass ? are the confessions that I have made there valid?

    I'm guessing the answer to these questions is no, but I still need your advice. Have I committed a sin by not going to the diocesan mass? Keep in mind that I can't talk to a traditional priest at the moment, and I probably won't be able to do this for a long time. Also, in case you are interested, while I am still unable to go to a traditional chapel (my parent's won't let me) I am planning on asking my parent's to take me to St Mary's in DC every once in a while, where there is an old diocesan priest that says the Latin mass. I am guessing that he must have been ordained with the old rite, so the mass there is valid, I hope.

    I hope I didn't disturb anybody here by saying most of the people, including the priest, at the near by diocesan parish are phonies. Neo-traditionalism (as in, the fake traditionalists in the novus ordo church) is phoniness so that's why I call neo-cons phonies. Hopefully I didn't offend anybody.


    Offline Mithrandylan

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #1 on: July 07, 2013, 01:44:44 PM »
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  • Pollolocoz,

    First, if anyone was offended by anything you said, it is they that should be ashamed of it.  

    With your age disclosure, it's an impressive grace of God for you to have these insights.  I used to go to a diocesan TLM that had quite a bit of 'life long' indulters.  Most people become complacent in these diocesan TLM settings because, after all, they're getting the Latin mass.  Nevermind that their priest (though likely good-willed) is infected with modernism and that their unwillingness to leave and to sit through homilies that you described is a clear sign that they have as well.

    As to your confessions, a lot of traditionalists are of the opinion that NO orders are doubtful and to be presumed invalid.  This is what I think, though obviously some will disagree.  I would make it a point to seek out a traditional priest that you could make a general confession to.  In the meantime, take heart!  If your previous confessions were invalid, it was due to the conniving and deceitful ways of the conciliar Church, not your lacking any requisite (assuming that you confessed with remorse and purpose of amendment).  

    There is certainly no sin in avoiding this diocesan mass.  Even if the priest is undoubtedly ordained, a case could still be made to avoid based on regular heresy from the pulpit.

    God bless you.
    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).


    Offline Charlemagne

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #2 on: July 07, 2013, 02:03:24 PM »
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  • No offense at all. I'm married with four children, and there's a NOM one mile from our house. It's a Poor Clares monastery, and it's probably as reverent as anything the Novus Ordo offers. But you know what? It's still Novus Ordo, and we refuse to have our children infected by the deadly Novus Ordoitis.

    Regarding your situation, far from commiting a sin by not attending the NOM, I believe you have been blessed and received the grace of God in that you have recognized the phoniness - yes, your term is correct - of these wolves. Fr. Cekada has said it very well: You can get to Heaven without the Latin Mass, but you cannot get to Heaven without the Catholic Faith. I just listened to a brief but very good sermon by Fr. Benedict Hughes on today's Gospel, in which Our Lord warns us of wolves and bad fruit: http://traditionalcatholicsermons.org/MiscArchives/FrBenHug_ByTheirFruitYouShallKnowThem_07-15-2012.mp3

    My advice, for what it's worth: Live the Faith. Period. Pray your Rosary, study the writings of the true Popes and Saints, educate yourself regarding the Crisis, guard against the lures of this world. And have nothing - NOTHING - to do with the Conciliar Church. You are VERY blessed at such a young age to recognize the "signs of the times." I'll be praying for you.



    "This principle is most certain: The non-Christian cannot in any way be Pope. The reason for this is that he cannot be head of what he is not a member. Now, he who is not a Christian is not a member of the Church, and a manifest heretic is not a Christian, as is clearly taught by St. Cyprian, St. Athanasius, St. Augustine, St. Jerome, and others. Therefore, the manifest heretic cannot be Pope." -- St. Robert Bellarmine

    Offline Matto

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #3 on: July 07, 2013, 03:03:39 PM »
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  • If you do not go to the indult because you think they are phonies I don't blame you and I don't think you are sinning. If your priests are heretics (not to mention the possibility that they are not really priests) you should avoid them. I would make a general confession as soon as possible with a traditional priest. That is what I did when I came out of the Novus Ordo because of the possibility that the priests I confessed to in the Novus Ordo were not priests at all and so therefore my sins were not forgiven.
    R.I.P.
    Please pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline Frances

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #4 on: July 07, 2013, 03:16:02 PM »
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  •  :applause:
    Dear Crazy Chicken,

    IMO, you have committed no sin either in attending or in not attending.  To go back to what you NOW recognize as heresy and dangerous to your faith would be sinful.  God is not a tyrant who holds you responsible for what you do not know.  So far as the validity of the priest's ordination, it is "doubtful," but again, you are not culpable in this situation.  In the worst case, if he is not a priest, God knew and honored the intent of your heart.  None but the most cruel of persons or priests would say you've committed sacrilege or made bad confessions!  If you are tempted with thoughts along these lines, know that it is the devil.  Call on Our Lady and see if he doesn't vanish!  May I suggest in lieu of Mass that you read the missal and then look on YouTube for the sermon of Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer or Fr. David Hewko.  I also recommend a book by Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, Against the Heresies.  Check on Amazon.  Study it thoroughly along with the particular encyclical.  It will immunize you against falling prey to heresy.
    You may also want to email H.E. Bishop Richard Williamson through his on-line newsletter, Elieson Comments.  He can advise you far better than I.
    Thank God for the grace to recognize Truth at such a tender age.  Well done, Spring chicken!

    Yours in Christ,
    Frances

    p.s.  There is a Colombian chicken restaurant in Corona, Queens, NYC, called Pollos Locos.]
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  


    Offline Frances

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #5 on: July 07, 2013, 03:25:33 PM »
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  • p.p.s.  You might also contact Fr. Ronald Ringrose, St. Athanasius Roman Catholic Church,
    in Vienna, VA.  He is rock-solid so far as dogma, but knows about the novus ordo and all that is connected to Vatican II, like the "extraordinary" Mass in the diocese.
     St. Francis Xavier threw a Crucifix into the sea, at once calming the waves.  Upon reaching the shore, the Crucifix was returned to him by a crab with a curious cross pattern on its shell.  

    Offline songbird

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #6 on: July 07, 2013, 03:26:56 PM »
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  • By the first commandment, you are to keep Holy, the Lords Day, and you can do that at home, if need be.

    Next, that statement by Cekada?  What we all need and want is the Precious Blood. It is in All the sacraments.  The enemy weakens us by taking the Powers of the Precious Blood away.  

    Those phonies no they are phony!  They are against Christ and are Piped Pipers to take more with them.  As my mom s once said, "Trouble Loves Company".

    And like all the other posts said, Wow, how awesome, that you are so Graced, and All Graces come through Our Lady from God.

    Because you have been so Graced, much will be asked of you!  Prayers to you!

    Offline pollozlocoz

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #7 on: July 07, 2013, 07:06:53 PM »
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  • Quote
    p.s.  There is a Colombian chicken restaurant in Corona, Queens, NYC, called Pollos Locos.

    Wow that's awesome!

    Quote

    p.p.s. You might also contact Fr. Ronald Ringrose, St. Athanasius Roman Catholic Church,
    in Vienna, VA. He is rock-solid so far as dogma, but knows about the novus ordo and all that is connected to Vatican II, like the "extraordinary" Mass in the diocese.

    I am planning on going there as soon as I can drive in the highway very well. It's the closest traditional chapel there is.

    Quote
    If your priests are heretics (not to mention the possibility that they are not really priests) you should avoid them.

    I don't think they're really heretics, well, maybe, but I've seen worse. They're just phonies. The main reason why I'm not going to that church anymore is because the priests might not be real priests.

    Quote
    And have nothing - NOTHING - to do with the Conciliar Church. You are VERY blessed at such a young age to recognize the "signs of the times." I'll be praying for you.

    Thank you for your prayers! I think I already have nothing to do with the conciliar church. I used to believe all the Micheal Voris type of nonsense about council and how pope Benedict was the good guy. As soon as I saw "pope" Francis, however, I knew he was the biggest phony of them all!


    Thank you all for your advice. I have read all your answers.


    Offline s2srea

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #8 on: July 08, 2013, 09:46:47 AM »
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  • PL- You will be in my prayers! Good for you!

    Here is some advice to keep in mind that someone else gave to anther person in a similar situation. I don't think you need this advice exactly, but should a situation arise, its good to remember this sort of stuff:

    Quote
    If you are a minor, you ought to remember that your father (together with your mother) holds absolute primacy in your home and has sovereign rights upon your person, until you reach an age whereat you become an self-sufficient adult and are therefore no longer bound to your father's authority. You owe him obedience and filial devotion at all times, and you must never think, say or do anything that might fall short of such a grave obligation. Your manners and behavior should demonstrate this to your parents, that they may see that you have embraced the profession and practice of the faith for love of God and holy zeal, and not for the sake of self-serving false piety that is really in the case of some young traditionals a "hallowed rebellion."

    Many youths who become traditional have great regard for the theological virtues, especially faith and the virtue of religion wherewith it is concomitant, but they often seem to neglect the acquired moral virtues, especially those that ought to be exercised in the household (such as filial obedience, temperance in thought and act, modesty of manners, &c.) and would edify their parents and friends more than any learned apologetical discourse.

    If your attempts to have a reasonable and amicable exchange with your parents (wherein you calmly laid out the reasons why you have chosen the Roman Mass over the N.O. service) have failed, then you ought to speak with actions: focus on the cultivation of the interior life, and practice mortification, self-detachment, prayerful manners, &c. and your parents will see that you are becoming a better person because of your traditional faith. This, coupled with a persevering refusal to regress to the N.O. services, may perhaps make them think twice about the matter.

    If you are old enough, and if you have won the trust and consent of your parents, you can go on your own to the Latin Mass somehow, either by driving or hitching a ride with others whom you know and trust and attend a traditional Chapel.

    The first and best recourse is, as always, prayer. Pray a lot for your parents, and encourage the practice of the Family Rosary and other devotions as much as you can, and accompany this with a truly edifying example of Christian virtue and filial piety.


    Offline s2srea

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #9 on: July 08, 2013, 09:53:33 AM »
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  • Thumbs down? Care to explain where I went wrong?

    Offline Telesphorus

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #10 on: July 08, 2013, 09:56:48 AM »
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  • The cult of parental authority over whether or not children may practice the true religion or enter a religious vocation or marry is something very French (and under the despotic Bourbons Spanish) but not Catholic at all.

    It is much more Protestant and obscurantist than Catholic.




    Offline s2srea

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #11 on: July 08, 2013, 10:03:03 AM »
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  • Quote from: Telesphorus
    The cult of parental authority over whether or not children may practice the true religion or enter a religious vocation or marry is something very French (and under the despotic Bourbons Spanish) but not Catholic at all.


    Cult? French? Um... Okay; interesting, since my quote was written by a Hispanic Mexican who has proved he is far more learned in matters of theology and morality than most on this forum- including you or I.

    Quote
    It is much more Protestant and obscurantist than Catholic.


    I would argue the opposite. PolloLoco is free to decide, and it seems the HolyGhost is guiding him towards the Faith regardless. But I don't want to derail this thread. Carry on.

    Offline Telesphorus

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #12 on: July 08, 2013, 10:07:31 AM »
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  • You don't have to be learned to understand that the practice of the Catholic Faith overrides parental authority.

    It's a simple principle.

    Offline Mithrandylan

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #13 on: July 08, 2013, 10:37:58 AM »
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  • Quote from: Telesphorus
    You don't have to be learned to understand that the practice of the Catholic Faith overrides parental authority.

    It's a simple principle.


    I didn't read anything in that quote that suggested that.  It was more along the lines of evangelizing within the home by showing filial loyalty and submission to one's parents.  THAT post didn't say anything about not practicing the faith because one's parents don't want one to.
    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).

    Offline Telesphorus

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    So I didnt go to the diacesan mass today....
    « Reply #14 on: July 08, 2013, 11:40:48 AM »
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  • Quote from: Mithrandylan
    I didn't read anything in that quote that suggested that.  It was more along the lines of evangelizing within the home by showing filial loyalty and submission to one's parents.  THAT post didn't say anything about not practicing the faith because one's parents don't want one to.


    I didn't say that that particular passage did say it.

    However, practically speaking that is what it encourages.  Nowhere does it authorize disobedience to parents in such matters.  Such an omission is glaring.

    The cult-like tendencies of the SSPX come from the fact that it teaches undue obedience to their authority figures and to parents.

    Such an attitude is not Catholic.

    Here is a Catholic source:

    Quote from: St. Alphonsus Liguori
    Nor is it necessary to mention the matter to parents, unless one is certain that one
    has nothing but encouragement to expect from them. In this respect, all things being
    equal, children are not bound to obey their parents when they seek to prevent them
    from obeying the call of God. The Council of Toledo says: "It shall be lawful for
    children to take upon themselves the yoke of religious observance, whether it be
    with the consent of their parents, or only the wish of their own hearts." (1) The
    same is prescribed by the Council of Tribur, and taught by St. Ambrose, St. Jerome,
    St. Augustine, St. Bernard, St. Thomas and St. John Chrysostom. The last mentioned
    saint says: "When parents stand in the way in spiritual things, they ought not even
    to be recognized."


    When the SSPX cult priests stand in the way of spiritual things by falsifying the religion, they should not be recognized.