Author Topic: Sacrificial Language and Valid Ordinations  (Read 477 times)

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Offline Mercyandjustice

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Sacrificial Language and Valid Ordinations
« on: June 10, 2019, 07:00:45 PM »
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  • I see the claim frequently the ordination rite has to mention the priest's powers of offering sacrifice in order for it to be valid. And that that is why the Anglican orders are were judged invalid, because such language was dropped. There are, however, ancient ordination prayers that don't have such language.

    Here is a prayer found in The Statutes of the Apostles, from the 4th century, which contains no sacrificial language:


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    Statute 23: Concerning the ordination of presbyters. If the bishop desires to ordain a presbyter, he shall lay his hands upon his head; and all the presbyters shall touch him and shall pray, saying: My God, the Father of our Lord and our Saviour Jesus Christ, look down upon this thy servant, and impart to him the spirit of grace and the gift of holiness, that he may be able to direct thy people with pure heart: as thou lookesdst upon thy chosen people and commendedst Moses to choose presbyters whom thou fillest with the Holy Spirit which thou grantedst to thy servant and minister Moses, so now, Lord, give to this thy servant the grace which fails not, preserving to us the spirit of thy favour, and vouchsafe to us whilst thou fillest us with thy worship in our heart, to glorify thee, through thy Son Jesus Christ, through who to thee be glory and power, to the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit in the holy Church now and always and for ever and ever. 
    And all the people shall say: Amen and Amen. He is worthy of it.
    https://archive.org/details/statutesapostle00unkngoog/page/n188


    And here is another ordination prayer from the sacramentary of St. Serapion of Thmius, which again lacks sacrificial language:

    https://archive.org/details/bishopsarapionsp00sera/page/72

    So it appears that sacrificial language isn't necessary..What do you all think?

    Christians who preach their doctrine with bitterness and sarcasm don't preach out of love for God or souls, but only to assert dominance over others; out of pride.

    Offline Mercyandjustice

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    Re: Sacrificial Language and Valid Ordinations
    « Reply #1 on: June 10, 2019, 09:36:00 PM »
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  • Also, Pope Pius XII's 'Scramentum Ordinis' states the prayers which were necessary for validity of the ordination. The prayer for the priestly ordination doesn't mention sacrifice.
    Christians who preach their doctrine with bitterness and sarcasm don't preach out of love for God or souls, but only to assert dominance over others; out of pride.


    Offline Mercyandjustice

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    Re: Sacrificial Language and Valid Ordinations
    « Reply #2 on: June 12, 2019, 04:04:04 PM »
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  • weeell?
    Christians who preach their doctrine with bitterness and sarcasm don't preach out of love for God or souls, but only to assert dominance over others; out of pride.

    Offline songbird

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    Re: Sacrificial Language and Valid Ordinations
    « Reply #3 on: June 12, 2019, 10:14:35 PM »
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  • Valid Ordination is necessary, for all sacraments.  No one has sacraments, except the Catholic Church.  Maybe we should be concerned about "sacrament".

    That is why we are not protestant or otherwise.  We need sacraments.

    Offline confederate catholic

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    Re: Sacrificial Language and Valid Ordinations
    « Reply #4 on: June 13, 2019, 06:37:41 PM »
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  • Oldest intact and still used in the some rites
    Divine grace elects X as (priest,deacon) with imposition of hand.
    Other words vary.
    قامت مريم، ترتيل وفاء جحا و سلام جحا


    Offline confederate catholic

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    Re: Sacrificial Language and Valid Ordinations
    « Reply #5 on: June 13, 2019, 10:42:16 PM »
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  • The fact that it was done and is done differently in the past and currently by eastern catholics doesn't matter since Latin canon law is different
    قامت مريم، ترتيل وفاء جحا و سلام جحا

     

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