Author Topic: Rosary questions. (Read 4443 times)

Jehanne · « **on:** February 21, 2011, 06:32:14 PM »

1. Is it "vale" or "valley"?

2. How about the Luminous mysteries? What do Trads think of those?

CathMomof7 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 21, 2011, 07:19:20 PM »

I say valley. Our family's nightly Rosary does not include the Luminous mysteries.

Matto · « **Reply #2 on:** February 21, 2011, 07:22:54 PM »

1. I say "valley". I used to say "vale". I don't think it makes much of a difference.
2. I don't think the Luminous Mysteries are popular among the people who visit this site or among traditional Catholics in general. I recently had a traditional Catholic tell me that the Luminous Mysteries were heretical. I didn't quite understand how they were heretical, but I don't pray the Luminous Mysteries or consider them to be a part of the Rosary as given to us by the Blessed Mother.

parentsfortruth · « **Reply #3 on:** February 21, 2011, 08:17:04 PM »

If you read about Saint Dominic, and how he received the Rosary from Our Lady, it was supposed to be a layperson's way of saying the Office, which contains 150 psalms. A 15 decade rosary that MARY handed down to US, with the three sets of mysteries SHE HERSELF gave to Saint Dominic, commemorate 150 psalms.

JPII (IMO) believed he could improve on what Our Lady gave to us, and gave us 5 more of these "luminous" mysteries. My question really is, "WHY WOULD SOMEONE TRY TO IMPROVE ON SOMETHING THAT PERFECTLY MIRRORED THE DIVINE OFFICE ALREADY, THAT OUR LADY HANDED DOWN TO US HERSELF?"

It's just another novelty to undermine tradition, and wipe out any traditional devotions.

I believe personally the "luminous mysteries" should be IGNORED and not even recognized as part of the Holy Rosary of the BLESSED VIRGIN MARY.

Canuk the Lionheart · « **Reply #4 on:** February 21, 2011, 10:36:26 PM »

The Luminous Mysteries, were John Paul II "improvement" of the Rosary given to us by the Blessed Virgin Mary. As the Rosary is not a matter of Faith, neither accepting or rejecting the Luminous Mysteries is heretical. Frankly, the Blessed Virgin gave us the Rosary as she wanted it prayed, any further improvement of the Rosary should only come from one person... the Blessed Virgin Mary. Although I do not presume to know the intentions of the Virgin, I doubt she is going to change Her Psalter any time soon!

TKGS · « **Reply #5 on:** February 22, 2011, 07:11:26 AM »

"Vale" and "Valley" are synonyms. They both mean a long depression in the surface of the land that usually contains a river. The English word vale is slightly older than valley. The choice of which to use is strictly based on personal preference, cadence, and colloquial usage. In is really not something to argue over. If people I am saying the rosary with prefer one over the other, I accommodate them.

The Luminous Mysteries are not part of the most holy Rosary. I don't think there is anything wrong with them and one can say them separately from the Rosary, but a person who says the Luminous Mysteries (which, I think, should be called the Chaplet of John Paul II) should not claim to have said the Rosary.

CathMomof7 · « **Reply #6 on:** February 22, 2011, 07:26:06 AM »

Quote from: Canuk the Lionheart

The Luminous Mysteries, were John Paul II "improvement" of the Rosary given to us by the Blessed Virgin Mary. As the Rosary is not a matter of Faith, neither accepting or rejecting the Luminous Mysteries is heretical. Frankly, the Blessed Virgin gave us the Rosary as she wanted it prayed, any further improvement of the Rosary should only come from one person... the Blessed Virgin Mary. Although I do not presume to know the intentions of the Virgin, I doubt she is going to change Her Psalter any time soon!

:applause:

Jehanne · « **Reply #7 on:** February 22, 2011, 07:32:02 AM »

Quote from: Canuk the Lionheart

The Luminous Mysteries, were John Paul II "improvement" of the Rosary given to us by the Blessed Virgin Mary. As the Rosary is not a matter of Faith, neither accepting or rejecting the Luminous Mysteries is heretical. Frankly, the Blessed Virgin gave us the Rosary as she wanted it prayed, any further improvement of the Rosary should only come from one person... the Blessed Virgin Mary. Although I do not presume to know the intentions of the Virgin, I doubt she is going to change Her Psalter any time soon!

How about the Fatima prayer, then, as approved by Pope Pius XII? Was that something revealed by the Blessed Virgin Mary herself, the three children, or another source?

TKGS · « **Reply #8 on:** February 22, 2011, 09:31:36 AM »

Quote from: Jehanne

How about the Fatima prayer, then, as approved by Pope Pius XII? Was that something revealed by the Blessed Virgin Mary herself, the three children, or another source?

The Fatima Prayer was given to us by the Blessed Virgin herself; and so, it should be considered a part of the Rosary.

Canuk the Lionheart · « **Reply #9 on:** February 23, 2011, 07:23:33 PM »

Quote from: CathMomof7

Quote from: Canuk the Lionheart
The Luminous Mysteries, were John Paul II "improvement" of the Rosary given to us by the Blessed Virgin Mary. As the Rosary is not a matter of Faith, neither accepting or rejecting the Luminous Mysteries is heretical. Frankly, the Blessed Virgin gave us the Rosary as she wanted it prayed, any further improvement of the Rosary should only come from one person... the Blessed Virgin Mary. Although I do not presume to know the intentions of the Virgin, I doubt she is going to change Her Psalter any time soon!

:applause:

Yes, and there are examples of the Blessed Virgin changing her Psalter for use by the Faithful. The one which comes to mind at the moment, is the Franciscan Crown Rosary. There was a young monk who as a child was in the practice of weaving a crown of roses daily for the Virgin. When he entered the Franciscans he was deeply saddened as he would no longer be able to do this, as consulation Mary appeared to him and revealed to him a new type of Rosary. The Crown Rosary consists of seven decades of ten beads (plus the Our Father beads) to meditate upon the Joys of Mary. This seems like a complete change in the rosary, however it is great to pray as this variation was requested by Mary! Unlike the Luminous Mysteries which were never a requested change. Again, as the rosary is not a matter of Faith, your position on the Luminous Mysteries (whichever it might be) does not make you heretical. But we need to remember that this is Our Lady's Psalter, not ours to change as we wish.

Hobbledehoy · « **Reply #10 on:** February 23, 2011, 07:51:15 PM »

Quote from: TKGS

Quote from: Jehanne
How about the Fatima prayer, then, as approved by Pope Pius XII? Was that something revealed by the Blessed Virgin Mary herself, the three children, or another source?

The Fatima Prayer was given to us by the Blessed Virgin herself; and so, it should be considered a part of the Rosary.

The "Fatima Prayer" is to be commended not only because it was the express wish of Our Lady of the Rosary at Fatima to recite it after the decades, but also because of its inherent excellence. It ought to remind the individual soul reciting the Rosary that there are innumerable sinners who reprobate themselves every day because no one prays for them or makes sacrifices for them. It ought to be said, therefore, with the spirit of selfless reparation that our Blessed Mother urgently spoke of at the Apparitions at Fatima and elsewhere. It also ought to excite sentiments of humility and gratitude in us, in that God through the mediation of the Holy Virgin Mary has vouchsafed us the graces of faith and prayer, which are denied to many, many, many souls who may probably have less defects than we have. We must be mindful that we of ourselves are utterly unworthy of the grace of God, Who does not owe it to Himself in strict justice to give us anything. If He does so, it is out of His infinite and eternal charity toward us and through the merits of Our Lord, through the mediation of Mary Most Holy.

Sigismund · « **Reply #11 on:** February 23, 2011, 10:30:19 PM »

Quote from: Matto

1. I say "valley". I used to say "vale". I don't think it makes much of a difference.
2. I don't think the Luminous Mysteries are popular among the people who visit this site or among traditional Catholics in general. I recently had a traditional Catholic tell me that the Luminous Mysteries were heretical. I didn't quite understand how they were heretical, but I don't pray the Luminous Mysteries or consider them to be a part of the Rosary as given to us by the Blessed Mother.

Vale for me.

They are certainly not heretical as they are all scriptural. Whether they are a good idea or not is a different question. I see no reason to change or add to a form of prayer that is so old and may well have been revealed by Our Lady herself. I will say them if I am reciting the rosary in common and the leader uses them, but not otherwise. I never use them when praying privately.

Sigismund · « **Reply #12 on:** February 23, 2011, 10:31:32 PM »

Quote from: TKGS

Quote from: Jehanne
How about the Fatima prayer, then, as approved by Pope Pius XII? Was that something revealed by the Blessed Virgin Mary herself, the three children, or another source?

The Fatima Prayer was given to us by the Blessed Virgin herself; and so, it should be considered a part of the Rosary.

That seems reasonable.

Kephapaulos · « **Reply #13 on:** February 25, 2011, 12:32:37 AM »

I remember learning from the answer given by Fr. Peter Scott, SSPX in response to a question about the Luminous mysteries in the Q & A section of an issue of Angelus Magazine that the 15 traditional mysteries of the Rosary directly have to do with the Redemption, whereas the Luminous mysteries do not. The one mystery among that has a more significant relation to the Redemption would be, of course, the Institution of the Eucharist, although it is an indirect relation.

Also, from what I understand, the Luminous mysteries have more to do with what our Lord did on earth during His public ministry. The traditional mysteries do indeed take you directly to the very reason why our Lord became man and lived on earth: the Redemption.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #14 on:** February 25, 2011, 08:36:03 AM »

My opinion of the luminous is that they remind me of how Protestants vision Our Lord on a cross, in His glory only. They refuse to look at His suffering. They only want the glory of His life without the suffering.