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Author Topic: Is Akita a true private revelation?  (Read 924 times)

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Offline Pelly

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Is Akita a true private revelation?
« on: January 20, 2013, 02:34:58 PM »
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  • Should a Traditionalist accept Akita? Since it began in 1973, it is doubtful, since it says that we should pray for the "Pope"? Is it a legit apparition?


    Offline Elizabeth

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    Is Akita a true private revelation?
    « Reply #1 on: January 20, 2013, 04:12:27 PM »
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  • I think it's for real.  


    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Is Akita a true private revelation?
    « Reply #2 on: January 20, 2013, 05:56:15 PM »
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  • Yeah.
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Is Akita a true private revelation?
    « Reply #3 on: January 20, 2013, 08:18:56 PM »
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  • Quote from: Pelly
    Should a Traditionalist accept Akita? Since it began in 1973, it is doubtful, since it says that we should pray for the "Pope"? Is it a legit apparition?




    Akita is a stumbling block for sedevacantism.  There is nothing about the locutions
    or the events or the visions of Akita that are doubtful for the Catholic sense,
    especially due to the fact that it was examined carefully by the local bishop and he
    gave his approval under ordinary jurisiction.  That is all that is necessary for the
    Church to "apporove" an apparition.  What the "approval" consists of, is that "There
    is nothing here in conflict with the Faith of Catholics, and this may be regarded as
    worthy of Catholic attention."  It does not say that it becomes definitive of the
    Faith or a dogma or a requirement or whatever.  It just says that learning about
    the message is not a danger to your faith.  

    But it is a stumbling block for sedevacantists.  They don't want to listen to what
    the bishop has to say, because he's not a sedevacantist bishop.  Curiously, and
    this is not a small point, there is no sedevacantist bishop who has now, or ever
    will have in the future till the end of time (so long as he remains sedevacantist),
    the jurisdiction necessary to render such an assessment of any vision, locution, or
    phenomenon of any kind.  So don't bother looking for a sede bishop to give you
    any clarity on this matter.  All he can do is run you ragged, round and round in
    circles to no resolution.  That is the nature of sedevacantism.

    Akita is a great example of a stumbling block for sedes.  It is probably the only
    verifiable authentic apparition of Our Lady since Fatima.  Not to say there have
    been no others, but there have been none that have received the Church's
    approval is all.  Akita has been approved.  And for very good reasons.  All this
    adds up to it being a great example.  

    If you're going to throw it out because it fails the sede litmus test, then maybe
    it's time to step back and take another look at the sede litmus test.

    What about Fatima?  Maybe the Message of Fatima fails the sede litmus test too.  
    Well, then you shouldn't add the Fatima Decade prayer to your Rosary.  And
    you shouldn't be worried or even curious about the Third Secret, because it would
    all be a deception of the devil and unworthy of your attention.  

    By the way, that would mean that the devil inspired 3 innocent
    children to heroic virtue and to live the rest of their lives doing
    extreme penances after seeing a vision of hell and telling all the
    world about it -- that would be the same hell that the devil wants
    you and everyone else to disbelieve in its existence: check.  


    And you shouldn't even be thinking about the Collegial Consecration or the errors
    of Russia
    or the bad fruit of Vatican II or SSPX-Rome negotiations or just about
    anything that happens in the News regarding the Church, because its all a
    deception of the devil
    .

    My one caution to you is, what are you going to do when the Pope and Bishops
    of the world make the Collegial Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart
    of Mary one day (it doesn't seem likely it will be any time very soon) and Russia
    converts and there is a period of peace that follows, as Our Lady promised?  

    Are you going to say, "That's just a deception of the devil and I don't have to
    believe it?"  

    Remember there were those who accused Our Lord of casting out
    demons using the power of the demons.  So this is nothing new.  


    Oh, one more thing:  
    You won't find any sede bishop or priest who can do an exorcism.  
    Why not?  Because in order to do one you have to have local jurisdiction.
    And if you try to do an exorcism without local jurisdiction you are taking
    your life in your hands because the devil knows you don't have jurisdiction
    and he most certainly will use that against you to the fullest effect possible.  

    Even to your temporal demise, your "substantial change."

    So if you have a problem with demonic possession, you're going to be stuck,
    as a sede.  But wait......  There are no sedes with that problem, are there......  

    Hmm..

    I wonder why that would be?



    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline Elizabeth

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    Is Akita a true private revelation?
    « Reply #4 on: January 20, 2013, 08:38:14 PM »
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  • Quote from: Neil Obstat



    Oh, one more thing:  
    You won't find any sede bishop or priest who can do an exorcism.  
    Why not?  Because in order to do one you have to have local jurisdiction.
    And if you try to do an exorcism without local jurisdiction you are taking
    your life in your hands because the devil knows you don't have jurisdiction
    and he most certainly will use that against you to the fullest effect possible.  

    Even to your temporal demise, your "substantial change."

    So if you have a problem with demonic possession, you're going to be stuck,
    as a sede.  But wait......  There are no sedes with that problem, are there......  

    Hmm..

    I wonder why that would be?
    [/size]




    This is the huge elephant in the room for me.





    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Is Akita a true private revelation?
    « Reply #5 on: January 21, 2013, 01:45:36 PM »
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  • I've taken the liberty of quoting Neil Obstat at a normal size so that the rest of you don't have headaches.  Some day, he will learn to stop typing in extremely large font because it's annoying.


    Quote from: Neil Obstat

    Akita is a stumbling block for sedevacantism.  There is nothing about the locutions
    or the events or the visions of Akita that are doubtful for the Catholic sense,
    especially due to the fact that it was examined carefully by the local bishop and he
    gave his approval under ordinary jurisiction.  That is all that is necessary for the
    Church to "apporove" an apparition.  What the "approval" consists of, is that "There
    is nothing here in conflict with the Faith of Catholics, and this may be regarded as
    worthy of Catholic attention."  It does not say that it becomes definitive of the
    Faith or a dogma or a requirement or whatever.  It just says that learning about
    the message is not a danger to your faith.  

    But it is a stumbling block for sedevacantists.  They don't want to listen to what
    the bishop has to say, because he's not a sedevacantist bishop.  Curiously, and
    this is not a small point, there is no sedevacantist bishop who has now, or ever
    will have in the future till the end of time (so long as he remains sedevacantist),
    the jurisdiction necessary to render such an assessment of any vision, locution, or
    phenomenon of any kind.  So don't bother looking for a sede bishop to give you
    any clarity on this matter.  All he can do is run you ragged, round and round in
    circles to no resolution.  That is the nature of sedevacantism.

    Akita is a great example of a stumbling block for sedes.  It is probably the only
    verifiable authentic apparition of Our Lady since Fatima.  Not to say there have
    been no others, but there have been none that have received the Church's
    approval is all.  Akita has been approved.  And for very good reasons.  All this
    adds up to it being a great example.  

    If you're going to throw it out because it fails the sede litmus test, then maybe
    it's time to step back and take another look at the sede litmus test.

    What about Fatima?  Maybe the Message of Fatima fails the sede litmus test too.  
    Well, then you shouldn't add the Fatima Decade prayer to your Rosary.  And
    you shouldn't be worried or even curious about the Third Secret, because it would
    all be a deception of the devil and unworthy of your attention.  

    By the way, that would mean that the devil inspired 3 innocent
    children to heroic virtue and to live the rest of their lives doing
    extreme penances after seeing a vision of hell and telling all the
    world about it -- that would be the same hell that the devil wants
    you and everyone else to disbelieve in its existence: check.  


    And you shouldn't even be thinking about the Collegial Consecration or the errors
    of Russia
    or the bad fruit of Vatican II or SSPX-Rome negotiations or just about
    anything that happens in the News regarding the Church, because its all a
    deception of the devil
    .

    My one caution to you is, what are you going to do when the Pope and Bishops
    of the world make the Collegial Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart
    of Mary one day (it doesn't seem likely it will be any time very soon) and Russia
    converts and there is a period of peace that follows, as Our Lady promised?  

    Are you going to say, "That's just a deception of the devil and I don't have to
    believe it?"  

    Remember there were those who accused Our Lord of casting out
    demons using the power of the demons.  So this is nothing new.  


    Oh, one more thing:  
    You won't find any sede bishop or priest who can do an exorcism.  
    Why not?  Because in order to do one you have to have local jurisdiction.
    And if you try to do an exorcism without local jurisdiction you are taking
    your life in your hands because the devil knows you don't have jurisdiction
    and he most certainly will use that against you to the fullest effect possible.  

    Even to your temporal demise, your "substantial change."

    So if you have a problem with demonic possession, you're going to be stuck,
    as a sede.  But wait......  There are no sedes with that problem, are there......  

    Hmm..

    I wonder why that would be?






    [size=14]WASN'T THAT BETTER?[/size]
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    Is Akita a true private revelation?
    « Reply #6 on: January 21, 2013, 04:11:00 PM »
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  • Yes, I also believe that Akita is for real.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.