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Author Topic: Fr. Mark on the Traditional Mass  (Read 11654 times)

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Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: Fr. Mark on the Traditional Mass
« Reply #20 on: October 31, 2018, 01:33:04 PM »
Cub asks this question (and answers it incorrectly) because he falsely equates Holy Communion as equal to the Mass itself, instead of distinguishing between the purpose of Mass (ie adoration of God) and the purpose of Communion (the glory of God through our sanctification).  

This is why 99% of novus ordo/indulters argue that a “valid” consecration is all that matters.  To them, the sacrament of the Eucharist is the end goal (which is why they put up with the scandalous liturgical sacrileges).  If they understood Mass in the Catholic way (God centric) then they would see that no matter if the consecration/Communion is valid, God is still blasphemed and outraged by an irreverent and sacrilegious atmosphere or liturgy.  


Quote
If the celebrant runs out of Hosts to distribute, the distribution of Holy Communion ends.  You cannot go back and simply say the words of consecration. 
Absolutely correct. 
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Offline Ladislaus

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Re: Fr. Mark on the Traditional Mass
« Reply #21 on: October 31, 2018, 02:20:29 PM »
Now, a priest, under extreme circuмstances, COULD just say the words of Consecration and have the Consecration be valid.  So this was Cub's way of clumsily arguing short-form theory, that as long as the essential words remain intact, the Mass is valid.  But, as Pax points out, Cub conflates validity with whether the Mass pleases God.  Secondly, in most vernacular versions of the NOM, they DID touch the essential words of consecration ... so that short-form theory had to become much shorter.  If you say that the form goes past "this is the chalice of My Blood...", then the essential words have been tampered with.
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Offline Marcellinus

Re: Fr. Mark on the Traditional Mass
« Reply #22 on: October 31, 2018, 03:46:12 PM »
Many seem to think that a valid consecration equals a valid Mass.  They are not synonymous.

A priest can walk into a bakery, with the intention to consecrate every single piece of bread in that bakery, and if he says the essential form, the Sacrament is confected.  It would be ridiculous to say, in this instance, that a Mass of any sort had just taken place.
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Offline Merry

Re: Fr. Mark on the Traditional Mass
« Reply #23 on: October 31, 2018, 04:05:55 PM »
CAN a priest walk into a bakery and, outside of Mass, say the words of Consecration and the place is full of the Holy Eucharist?

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Offline Marcellinus

Re: Fr. Mark on the Traditional Mass
« Reply #24 on: October 31, 2018, 04:28:54 PM »
Quote from: Merry on October 31, 2018, 04:05:55 PM
CAN a priest walk into a bakery and, outside of Mass, say the words of Consecration and the place is full of the Holy Eucharist?
Yes.  This is a classic sacramental theology question, used to teach the concepts of essential form and intention.
It is GRAVELY illicit for a priest to do such a thing.   
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