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Author Topic: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish  (Read 1724 times)

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Offline SeanJohnson

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Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2023, 04:03:49 PM »
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    This is an fantastic post and you should not have received a downvote for this. When selecting a place to live, access to Mass and a chapel (preferably with a resident priest) must be the TOP priority. And if people live a distance from Mass, they have to attend as often as they can.

    The Mass is the most important thing in the entire world, by far. Nothing else even comes close.

    I can see where a job transfer might put you in the boonies, and the only option would be destitution or accepting the transfer.

    That said, I know of SSPXers who request dispensations from Mass to go on vacations.  One apparently received a dispensation to go on vacation without Mass twice/year (and if they did, then it must be common practice for SSPX priests to grant such dispensations to others as well).

    To get stuck without Mass is one thing, but to voluntarily and deliberately choose recreation over duty to God is a scandal to me. 

    What's the purpose of this life again???
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Miseremini

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #16 on: March 26, 2023, 04:17:26 PM »
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  • To get stuck without Mass is one thing, but to voluntarily and deliberately choose recreation over duty to God is a scandal to me. 

    What's the purpose of this life again???
    As a kid we had a priest who every spring gave the same warning from the pulpit. It went something like this.
    "Well we're in planning season for vacation.  Remember this does not release you from your Sunday obligation.  If you choose a vacation spot where there is no Mass,...there also will be no priest.  If you should have an accident you will be in willful mortal sin without a priest."
    "Let God arise, and let His enemies be scattered: and them that hate Him flee from before His Holy Face"  Psalm 67:2[/b]



    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #17 on: March 26, 2023, 04:32:03 PM »
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  • I can see where a job transfer might put you in the boonies, and the only option would be destitution or accepting the transfer.

    That said, I know of SSPXers who request dispensations from Mass to go on vacations.  One apparently received a dispensation to go on vacation without Mass twice/year (and if they did, then it must be common practice for SSPX priests to grant such dispensations to others as well).

    To get stuck without Mass is one thing, but to voluntarily and deliberately choose recreation over duty to God is a scandal to me. 

    What's the purpose of this life again???

    It occurs to me that this matter of SSPX and SSPXers requesting/granting/receiving dispensations from Mass is similar to same having rather lax requirements for NFP, and/or overemphasizing the importance of SSPX school attendance, and/or permitting the death vax:

    All four cases seem to be based upon modernist "quality of life" considerations:

    If the wife is too stressed out to have more kids (which becomes, "She'll suffer a nervous breakdown; I know this one woman...");

    If she is too stressed out to homeschool (which again becomes, "She'll suffer a nervous breakdown...");

    [The real solution is that husbands need to get off their asses and help out.]

    If the husband is too stressed out by his own family that he needs to go away for longer than a week at a time fishing, hunting, or whatever (which becomes, "Otherwise he'll snap and leave his family...").

    Or if both husband and wife need to be dispensed for a vacation (i.e., they need a break from God)...

    Or if your job requires the abortion/death vax, well, "you need to support your family."

    Of if your New Zealand SSPX school requires the clotshot, "Well if we don't comply, its back to homeschooling, which will be stressful for you, and a shame to close it after all the money we spent on it."

    Backing up:

    I recall a conference with Fr. Iscara in St. Paul (maybe around 2006?), in which he discussed end of life issues, and in the course of doing so, noted the modernist shift in medical morals, which since Vatican II has obscessed upon "quality of life considerations."

    Seems like that same trend is to be found among trads/trad clergy, with the rationale being the same: "You need this, and things will be better for you."

    No, I think things will be better for me if I manage to schedule my recreations around my duties, which is commonsense in every other aspect of life.

    We commonly recognize one who places his recreations above his duties as a derelict in secular life.  How much more so in the spiritual life should the same censure apply?
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Soubirous

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #18 on: March 26, 2023, 04:58:27 PM »
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  • I guess upon further retrospection this boils down more to the issue that my husband does not care or does not see the difference between diocesan and SSPX.  It’s all TLM to him.  I want to support the SSPX.  When I discuss with him he says I’m just being a loyalist.  And that’s not what it is for me.  I’ve always found truth and peace at SSPX chapels and my “loyalty” to them was confirmed during COVID when they were the only ones still saying mass.  It should be apparent to him too since the diocese is trying to do away with the diocese TLM he likes there anyways. 

    He’s a good dad and husband.  I’m not saying otherwise.  Had I had the faith I do today back when I met him, perhaps I would have looked for someone with similar thoughts.  But I’m faithful to the sacrament.  Also, our move was out of necessity and he did what he had to do for the welfare of our family.  Yes, it’s harder to get to TLM but not impossible and we knew that when we moved.  I do not doubt in the least he followed Gods will with the move.  I’m grateful for him for that. 

    I guess besides praying for him, I don’t have a lot of other options.  We discussed it this morning and it resulted in words. I’m just going to go to the mission on my own with the kids and do what I can to the best of my ability.  Maybe the priest can meet with me and advise.  He also doesn’t contribute to the church so I’m not sure how we’ll ever be seen as members. 

    Appreciate the prayers for my family.  I worry for my boys. 

    Reading your OP two days ago, sentences 2 & 3 ("My husband is a TLM-er but less concerned about where he attends.  We just moved from a large city with a SSPX priory to a very rural setting. ") gave me a hunch that what you said today was indeed the situation, but I didn't want to say so without hearing more details. It's difficult to be in your position, with obedience to your husband on one side and trying to do what's best for your children's souls on the other side. :pray: Please, fellow CathInfo people, she's an earnest recent revert and a concerned wife and mother, and that's why she's asking for advice. (Note boldface added above.) This thread isn't necessarily about the SSPX per se, nor about what other bad Catholics tangentially have done. It's about how to manage this particular complex and delicate situation. Caeli, perhaps give it some time and then the answers you need will arise, God willing.
    Let nothing disturb you, let nothing frighten you, all things pass away: God never changes. Patience obtains all things. He who has God finds he lacks nothing; God alone suffices. - St. Teresa of Jesus

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #19 on: March 26, 2023, 05:26:58 PM »
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  • Reading your OP two days ago, sentences 2 & 3 ("My husband is a TLM-er but less concerned about where he attends.  We just moved from a large city with a SSPX priory to a very rural setting. ") gave me a hunch that what you said today was indeed the situation, but I didn't want to say so without hearing more details. It's difficult to be in your position, with obedience to your husband on one side and trying to do what's best for your children's souls on the other side. :pray: Please, fellow CathInfo people, she's an earnest recent revert and a concerned wife and mother, and that's why she's asking for advice. (Note boldface added above.) This thread isn't necessarily about the SSPX per se, nor about what other bad Catholics tangentially have done. It's about how to manage this particular complex and delicate situation. Caeli, perhaps give it some time and then the answers you need will arise, God willing.
    Yes, I got the same impression.  
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)


    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #20 on: March 26, 2023, 05:30:54 PM »
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  • I guess upon further retrospection this boils down more to the issue that my husband does not care or does not see the difference between diocesan and SSPX.  It’s all TLM to him.  I want to support the SSPX.  When I discuss with him he says I’m just being a loyalist.  And that’s not what it is for me.  I’ve always found truth and peace at SSPX chapels and my “loyalty” to them was confirmed during COVID when they were the only ones still saying mass.  It should be apparent to him too since the diocese is trying to do away with the diocese TLM he likes there anyways. 

    He’s a good dad and husband.  I’m not saying otherwise.  Had I had the faith I do today back when I met him, perhaps I would have looked for someone with similar thoughts.  But I’m faithful to the sacrament.  Also, our move was out of necessity and he did what he had to do for the welfare of our family.  Yes, it’s harder to get to TLM but not impossible and we knew that when we moved.  I do not doubt in the least he followed Gods will with the move.  I’m grateful for him for that. 

    I guess besides praying for him, I don’t have a lot of other options.  We discussed it this morning and it resulted in words.  I’m just going to go to the mission on my own with the kids and do what I can to the best of my ability.  Maybe the priest can meet with me and advise.  He also doesn’t contribute to the church so I’m not sure how we’ll ever be seen as members. 

    Appreciate the prayers for my family.  I worry for my boys. 
    Ouch.  This doesn't feel right.  I would address the priest validity issue for sure.  If he understands that the priest in the diocese is more than likely doubtful, then perhaps he will want to go to the mission church as well.

    And as for the move that got you farther away from mass, I understand.  We were in a situation where we had to move farther away.  We were already very far, but now farther.  We still try to make mass monthly.
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #21 on: March 26, 2023, 05:38:18 PM »
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  • I didn’t realize this forum was so anti-SSPX.  The description at the top says this is for SSPX followers.  I assumed that was a sincere description.  I’ve gone to SSPV and CMRI.  I’ve spoken to their priests.  Choosing the SSPX for me was not an uneducated decision.  I’m not going to argue the whys and what nots here about that decision. 

    I wouldn’t call anyone here intolerant and judgmental but it does reaffirm that there is a sect out there that really does not want to authentically help others who are seeking truth…they only want to further the hurt and embarrassment “newbies” might feel after suffering years of being poorly catechized (outside of their control usually subjected on them by Vat2 families and bad parochial schools) and having to navigate their faith without clear direction from trusted leaders/clarity. 

    For those who have given me some good solid resources to help my family and I….it is truly appreciated.  May God bless you for your efforts and reward you! 

    Apologies, Coeli.  I wasn’t making any judgments upon you, but was commenting more upon the current state of the SSPX (which is a bit off topic, admittedly, so I can see where you might have thought I was criticizing you personally).

    In your situation, I’d drive the 1.5 hrs.

    To get your husband on board, I’d use the old, “Honey, I don’t ask for much, but this is important to me.”  Pour him a brandy, make him his favorite dinner, tell him he can get that four-wheeler, if only he’ll make this one small sacrifice for you.

    I’d give you an 85% chance of success.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Meg

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #22 on: March 26, 2023, 06:03:04 PM »
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  • And as for the move that got you farther away from mass, I understand.  We were in a situation where we had to move farther away.  We were already very far, but now farther.  We still try to make mass monthly.

    We had to move farther away too. If only traditional chapels were often located in areas with inexpensive homes. But that does not seem to be the case, at least in my area. The average home price in the area of the SSPX chapel that I used to be able to attend regularly is $825,000. 
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Offline HeavyHanded

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #23 on: March 26, 2023, 07:06:54 PM »
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  • I guess upon further retrospection this boils down more to the issue that my husband does not care or does not see the difference between diocesan and SSPX.  It’s all TLM to him.  I want to support the SSPX.  When I discuss with him he says I’m just being a loyalist.  And that’s not what it is for me.  I’ve always found truth and peace at SSPX chapels and my “loyalty” to them was confirmed during COVID when they were the only ones still saying mass.  It should be apparent to him too since the diocese is trying to do away with the diocese TLM he likes there anyways. 

    He’s a good dad and husband.  I’m not saying otherwise.  Had I had the faith I do today back when I met him, perhaps I would have looked for someone with similar thoughts.  But I’m faithful to the sacrament.  Also, our move was out of necessity and he did what he had to do for the welfare of our family.  Yes, it’s harder to get to TLM but not impossible and we knew that when we moved.  I do not doubt in the least he followed Gods will with the move.  I’m grateful for him for that. 

    I guess besides praying for him, I don’t have a lot of other options.  We discussed it this morning and it resulted in words.  I’m just going to go to the mission on my own with the kids and do what I can to the best of my ability.  Maybe the priest can meet with me and advise.  He also doesn’t contribute to the church so I’m not sure how we’ll ever be seen as members. 

    Appreciate the prayers for my family.  I worry for my boys. 
    "Every house divided amongst itself shall not stand" Matthew 12:25. 
    My Grandmother is Catholic. My grandfather never went to church, ever. 0 of their 5 children kept the faith. 
    If your husband won't budge, you should submit to him and at least appear to be united to your children. 

    Offline cletus1805

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #24 on: March 27, 2023, 07:10:21 PM »
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  • I didn’t realize this forum was so anti-SSPX.  The description at the top says this is for SSPX followers.  I assumed that was a sincere description.  I’ve gone to SSPV and CMRI.  I’ve spoken to their priests.  Choosing the SSPX for me was not an uneducated decision.  I’m not going to argue the whys and what nots here about that decision. 

    I wouldn’t call anyone here intolerant and judgmental but it does reaffirm that there is a sect out there that really does not want to authentically help others who are seeking truth…they only want to further the hurt and embarrassment “newbies” might feel after suffering years of being poorly catechized (outside of their control usually subjected on them by Vat2 families and bad parochial schools) and having to navigate their faith without clear direction from trusted leaders/clarity. 

    For those who have given me some good solid resources to help my family and I….it is truly appreciated.  May God bless you for your efforts and reward you! 
    Meant to upvote not downvote you, caeli. I will pray for you. 

    Offline caeli34

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    Re: Baptism and joining SSPX vs diocese parish
    « Reply #25 on: April 12, 2023, 04:09:09 PM »
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  • We found out the diocesan TLM priests are not allowed to do any other sacraments in the EF.  Fortunately, my husband is on the same page on making sure the baby is baptized under the EF.  So….we are joining the chapel 2 hours away And baby will be baptized by the SSPX priest.

    Thanks for the replies, and the kind words.  And for letting me know about the women’s forum on here as well.  I think my concern is definitely a deeper issue with some of my husband’s indifference in matters of faith.  The house divided comment and my children’s salvation and their faith upbringing is what I’m really seeking answers for.  But….that’s a different thread on a different forum.  Thank you all!