Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism  (Read 3340 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline pickoverthecliff

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 40
  • Reputation: +15/-0
  • Gender: Male
Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
« on: June 17, 2014, 07:37:36 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I was reading about the protestant work ethic. Anyone have books or resources on what a Catholic work ethic is?


    Offline PereJoseph

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1411
    • Reputation: +1978/-0
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #1 on: June 18, 2014, 02:19:01 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I have heard very good things about the book "Leisure, the Basis of Culture" by Josef Pieper. It is easily obtainable through many online bookstores. That would be a good place to start.


    Offline s2srea

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5106
    • Reputation: +3896/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #2 on: June 18, 2014, 08:58:07 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: PereJoseph
    I have heard very good things about the book "Leisure, the Basis of Culture" by Josef Pieper. It is easily obtainable through many online bookstores. That would be a good place to start.


    Thanks for the direction, PereJoseph. For the record, here's an online copy of the book:

    Leisure - the Basis of Culture

    There is another one available from Scribid, but it had far too many ads on it. I hope to read this soon!

    Offline s2srea

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5106
    • Reputation: +3896/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #3 on: June 18, 2014, 09:10:39 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • By the way, here are some notes by a professor which I found very interesting and helpful! There are some good definitions and contextual explanations I believe might help us read Pieper more accurately (historically).

    Teaching Note on
    Josef Pieper’s Leisure the Basis of Culture
    An Integration of the Contemplative and Active Life:
    https://www.stthomas.edu/cathstudies/cst/curriculum/PortlandCurr/NaughtonTeachingNote.pdf

    Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2049
    • Reputation: +1285/-0
    • Gender: Female
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #4 on: June 18, 2014, 09:19:32 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: s2srea
    By the way, here are some notes by a professor which I found very interesting and helpful! There are some good definitions and contextual explanations I believe might help us read Pieper more accurately (historically).

    Teaching Note on
    Josef Pieper’s Leisure the Basis of Culture
    An Integration of the Contemplative and Active Life:
    https://www.stthomas.edu/cathstudies/cst/curriculum/PortlandCurr/NaughtonTeachingNote.pdf


    Excellent!   Thank you, PereJoseph, and s2srea for providing this link w/notes.

    I think the prot work ethic vs catholic culture argument is one of my favorites when in discussion w/ family and friends.  They are usually intrigued instead of hostile (as in when I bring up that pesky dogma stuff), so your link will help me to explain better.


    Offline s2srea

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5106
    • Reputation: +3896/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #5 on: June 18, 2014, 09:34:11 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta

    Excellent!   Thank you, PereJoseph, and s2srea for providing this link w/notes.

    I think the prot work ethic vs catholic culture argument is one of my favorites when in discussion w/ family and friends.  They are usually intrigued instead of hostile (as in when I bring up that pesky dogma stuff), so your link will help me to explain better.


    Not a problem PED!

    I agree. Most people have no conception of what Liesure is. Here are a few notes from Dr. Naughton's notes I really like so far:

    Quote from: [url=https://www.stthomas.edu/cathstudies/cst/curriculum/PortlandCurr/NaughtonTeachingNote.pdf
    Dr. Michael Naughton Teaching Note on Leisure[/url]]"Properly understood and practiced, leisure enables us to become more whole because it engages the fundamental questions of our being: origin (where did I come from), destiny (where am I going) and present (who am I). It is precisely because leisure embraces this wholeness that it helps us to be authentically free to be who we were meant to be, not merely free to do whatever we want."
    “The essence of leisure is not to assure that we may function smoothly but rather to assure that we, embedded in our social function [of work], are enabled to remain fully human. That we may not lose the ability to look beyond the limits of our social and functional station, to contemplate and celebrate the world as such, to become and be that person who is essentially oriented toward the whole of reality.”
    "What Leisure is not! (because it is a condition of the soul not necessarily an external thing)
    1. Leisure is not just a result of external factors. It is not just spare time, a holiday, a weekend, etc. It is not non-activity, but “attitude of the mind and condition of the soul.”
    2. Leisure is not merely a break from work, so as to re-energize us to go back to work (sharpening the saw). Leisure does not exist for the sake of work, although it certainly has implications for work. Rather
    work exists for the sake of leisure."


    I can't help think that this is so important to Catholics. Especially considering the Sabbath. And I cannot also help but think of my wife. We were talking about this the other day. That the Sabbath is not just meaningless rest. Its not about going to birthday parties. Its not about taking a day off work to go shopping. (All things we have been guilty of). But its about reflection, prayer, contemplation, etc. I haven't done a very good job of being the example I need to be for her and my children, in this regard. Please pray that I succeed in working towards this end. :)

    Offline s2srea

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5106
    • Reputation: +3896/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #6 on: June 18, 2014, 10:24:02 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Actually, here's the Scribid link. Its not so bad as I thought:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/28873477/Leisure-the-Basis-of-Culture

    Offline Marlelar

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 3473
    • Reputation: +1816/-233
    • Gender: Female
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #7 on: June 18, 2014, 04:28:45 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: s2srea
    Actually, here's the Scribid link. Its not so bad as I thought:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/28873477/Leisure-the-Basis-of-Culture


    Looks like you have to pay to use scribid :(

    Marsha


    Offline s2srea

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5106
    • Reputation: +3896/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #8 on: June 18, 2014, 04:31:38 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Marlelar
    Quote from: s2srea
    Actually, here's the Scribid link. Its not so bad as I thought:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/28873477/Leisure-the-Basis-of-Culture


    Looks like you have to pay to use scribid :(

    Marsha


    Really?? I think you only have to pay if you want to download it.

    Offline poche

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 16730
    • Reputation: +1218/-4688
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #9 on: June 19, 2014, 03:07:08 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Look around you. The perdominantly Catholic Irish who built up this country. The predominantly Catholic Poles, Slovaks, Italians, all had a hand in building up this country and made it what it is today. What do you think that is fueling much of the Illegal immigration? It is the desire of the predominantly Catholic Latin Americans to work.  

    Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2049
    • Reputation: +1285/-0
    • Gender: Female
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #10 on: June 19, 2014, 12:54:53 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: s2srea
    Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta

    Excellent!   Thank you, PereJoseph, and s2srea for providing this link w/notes.

    I think the prot work ethic vs catholic culture argument is one of my favorites when in discussion w/ family and friends.  They are usually intrigued instead of hostile (as in when I bring up that pesky dogma stuff), so your link will help me to explain better.


    Not a problem PED!

    I agree. Most people have no conception of what Liesure is. Here are a few notes from Dr. Naughton's notes I really like so far:

    Quote from: [url=https://www.stthomas.edu/cathstudies/cst/curriculum/PortlandCurr/NaughtonTeachingNote.pdf
    Dr. Michael Naughton Teaching Note on Leisure[/url]]"Properly understood and practiced, leisure enables us to become more whole because it engages the fundamental questions of our being: origin (where did I come from), destiny (where am I going) and present (who am I). It is precisely because leisure embraces this wholeness that it helps us to be authentically free to be who we were meant to be, not merely free to do whatever we want."
    “The essence of leisure is not to assure that we may function smoothly but rather to assure that we, embedded in our social function [of work], are enabled to remain fully human. That we may not lose the ability to look beyond the limits of our social and functional station, to contemplate and celebrate the world as such, to become and be that person who is essentially oriented toward the whole of reality.”
    "What Leisure is not! (because it is a condition of the soul not necessarily an external thing)
    1. Leisure is not just a result of external factors. It is not just spare time, a holiday, a weekend, etc. It is not non-activity, but “attitude of the mind and condition of the soul.”
    2. Leisure is not merely a break from work, so as to re-energize us to go back to work (sharpening the saw). Leisure does not exist for the sake of work, although it certainly has implications for work. Rather
    work exists for the sake of leisure."


    I can't help think that this is so important to Catholics. Especially considering the Sabbath. And I cannot also help but think of my wife. We were talking about this the other day. That the Sabbath is not just meaningless rest. Its not about going to birthday parties. Its not about taking a day off work to go shopping. (All things we have been guilty of). But its about reflection, prayer, contemplation, etc. I haven't done a very good job of being the example I need to be for her and my children, in this regard. Please pray that I succeed in working towards this end. :)


    I will indeed my friend, and if you remember me for the same in the charity of your prayers?   I have the same problem. It seems that some trad priests are vehement about keeping Sundays, and others not quite as rigid.  One young independent trad priest gave a sermon a few years ago that was all fire and brimstone about any shopping or working (without exemption from the Church).  It opened my eyes.  Still, I slip up and forget.  Such as, if we stop at Home Depot on the way home from Mass.  In the confessional I'm questioned about intent of course, as in, was it a quick stop due to other weekly obligations that caused forgetfulness or was it a shopping "event" (lots of purchases) that could be postponed?  However, none of the priests since that young man a few years ago, seem to take it quite as seriously.  

    You are so right re: overall, how important this issue is for Catholics, not just keeping Sunday holy.  It's a critical sleeper issue.  In His Own words:
    Quote
       Psalms 45:11
    Be still and see that I am God;


    Just fyi, the other night I began reading the book and read the pdf in entirety.  I'd like to download and send both to my large family and other Catholic friends.  
    See how many souls you and PereJoseph will assist?  My own miserable one in particular  :jumping2:

    I liked this excerpt



    Offline s2srea

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5106
    • Reputation: +3896/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #11 on: June 19, 2014, 01:03:18 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: poche
    Look around you. The perdominantly Catholic Irish who built up this country. The predominantly Catholic Poles, Slovaks, Italians, all had a hand in building up this country and made it what it is today. What do you think that is fueling much of the Illegal immigration? It is the desire of the predominantly Catholic Latin Americans to work.  


    I don't' think I quite grasp the point you're trying to make here...

    Offline s2srea

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5106
    • Reputation: +3896/-48
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #12 on: June 19, 2014, 01:11:11 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta

    I will indeed my friend, and if you remember me for the same in the charity of your prayers?  


    But of course; you didn't even have to ask :)

    Quote


    Just fyi, the other night I began reading the book and read the pdf in entirety.  I'd like to download and send both to my large family and other Catholic friends.  
    See how many souls you and PereJoseph will assist?  My own miserable one in particular  :jumping2:


    I am also almost done reading it. I got about half way on my lunch break yesterday. Its a very easy read, actually; not much by way of metaphysical abstraction, which is nice.

    Offline PG

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1734
    • Reputation: +457/-476
    • Gender: Male
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #13 on: June 19, 2014, 02:38:31 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Read Fr. Denis Fahey.  I repeat, read Fr. Fahey!  Read his book titled "the church and farming".  Read a book he translated titled "the workingmen's guilds of the middle ages" by godefroid kurth.

    A Catholic will work to provide for his family/necessities in an occupation that certainly does not act as a direct obstacle to his and his neighbor's eternal salvation.  Catholics should endeavor to work in such a way that aids our own and our neighbor's eternal salvation.  For example: Catholics believe abortion is evil, therefore, we cannot work for planned parenthood.  The catholic church teaches that farming(and not gmos!) is the highest of the arts/occupation(the тαℓмυd teaches that it is the lowest), therefore, catholics should be farmers.

    Keep this in mind when thinking about work ethics.  

    "A secure mind is like a continual feast" - Proverbs xv: 15

    Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2049
    • Reputation: +1285/-0
    • Gender: Female
    Protestant Work Ethic v. Catholicism
    « Reply #14 on: June 19, 2014, 05:30:14 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: + PG +
    Read Fr. Denis Fahey.  I repeat, read Fr. Fahey!  Read his book titled "the church and farming".  Read a book he translated titled "the workingmen's guilds of the middle ages" by godefroid kurth.

    A Catholic will work to provide for his family/necessities in an occupation that certainly does not act as a direct obstacle to his and his neighbor's eternal salvation.  Catholics should endeavor to work in such a way that aids our own and our neighbor's eternal salvation.  For example: Catholics believe abortion is evil, therefore, we cannot work for planned parenthood.  The catholic church teaches that farming(and not gmos!) is the highest of the arts/occupation(the тαℓмυd teaches that it is the lowest), therefore, catholics should be farmers.

    Keep this in mind when thinking about work ethics.  



    +PG+  I will always be grateful to you for promoting Fr. Fahey. I was woefully neglectful in reading his works prior to your encouragement a few months ago.