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Traditional Catholic Faith => Fighting Errors in the Modern World => The Earth God Made - Flat Earth, Geocentrism => Topic started by: Truth is Eternal on October 19, 2017, 12:21:43 PM

Title: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 19, 2017, 12:21:43 PM
To Prove a globe earth theory to be fact?
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 19, 2017, 12:26:53 PM
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Facts don't need "theory" -- against a fact there is no argument.
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Maybe you've forgotten all the hundreds of posts already made, like 50-plus reasons, just getting started.
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On the other hand, your failed hypothesis has zero support, because the earth isn't "flat."
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 19, 2017, 12:30:13 PM
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Facts don't need "theory" -- against a fact there is no argument.
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Maybe you've forgotten all the hundreds of posts already made, like 50-plus reasons, just getting started.
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On the other hand, your failed hypothesis has zero support, because the earth isn't "flat."
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What do you believe is the single most compelling piece of evidence to help prove the earth is a globe?
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 19, 2017, 02:32:16 PM
What do you believe is the single most compelling piece of evidence to help prove the earth is a globe?
The Blessed Mother of God when She detailed the way she wanted the Miraculous medal designed. 
She held in Her hand a globe and used the word globe.  
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 19, 2017, 02:37:54 PM
What do you believe is the single most compelling piece of evidence to help prove the earth is a globe?
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For the purposes of this discussion, the fact that you are incapable of learning anything is proof positive the earth is not "flat."
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Very compelling!
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Let's see now, about your manifest errors: 
The horizon does not always appear "flat" 360 degrees around the viewer regardless of elevation, even while flat-earthers say it does.
The horizon does not always "rise" to the level of the observer, even while flat-earthers say it does.
The natural physics of water is not to seek its own level, even while flat-earthers say it is.
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Any more false statements you can dream up, Truth is Transitory?
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 19, 2017, 03:11:22 PM
The Blessed Mother of God when She detailed the way she wanted the Miraculous medal designed.
She held in Her hand a globe and used the word globe.  

According to most of the the websites I've been viewing today, St. Catherine Laboure heard the words..."The golden ball you see represents the whole world, especially France, and each person in particular."

It was a golden ball that was seen, and most of the websites I looked today at used the word "ball," not "globe." You might not think that there's much of a difference. And maybe there isn't.

I have no idea what the original French word that would have been used. It would be interesting to know.

The private revelation of Catherine Laboure does led itself to the idea of a ball earth. But can one really make a specific determination of an important subject from one private revelation?


Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 19, 2017, 03:37:10 PM
Dear Meg,  "Most" you say but most others say "globe" and they do mean the same things, ball does not mean flat for sure. Not only in words does she say ball/globe but she is pictured holding a globe, as St. Catherine said so.  

Anyway since I consider and am trying to live and die a Catholic I will put my Faith on the Blessed Mother with God's grace.  All Catholics should why?  Because they can't go wrong that is why.  
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 19, 2017, 03:42:08 PM
Dear Meg,  "Most" you say but most others say "globe" and they do mean the same things, ball does not mean flat for sure. Not only in words does she say ball/globe but she is pictured holding a globe, as St. Catherine said so.  

Anyway since I consider and am trying to live and die a Catholic I will put my Faith on the Blessed Mother with God's grace.  All Catholics should why?  Because they can't go wrong that is why.  
What would you do if you would find out the globe of creation is not the earth?
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 19, 2017, 03:43:36 PM
Dear Meg,  "Most" you say but most others say "globe" and they do mean the same things, ball does not mean flat for sure. Not only in words does she say ball/globe but she is pictured holding a globe, as St. Catherine said so.  

Anyway since I consider and am trying to live and die a Catholic I will put my Faith on the Blessed Mother with God's grace.  All Catholics should why?  Because they can't go wrong that is why.  


Maybe you can find the original words of St. Catherine, in French. Then we might be able to determine more clearly which word it might be. 'Golden ball' and 'globe' might be the same thing, but maybe not.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 19, 2017, 03:51:58 PM

https://militia-immaculatae.info/media/english/Books/Miraculous_Medal_WEB.pdf
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 19, 2017, 03:54:59 PM

Maybe you can find the original words of St. Catherine, in French. Then we might be able to determine more clearly which word it might be. 'Golden ball' and 'globe' might be the same thing, but maybe not.
   I'm not worried about it.   She did not say anything that might resemble "see this flat earth" etc. 
I am sorry for you and other Catholics who doubt her, perhaps you might consider wearing her medal if you don't already.  
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 19, 2017, 04:04:01 PM
https://militia-immaculatae.info/media/english/Books/Miraculous_Medal_WEB.pdf

Here's a statue of Our Lady holding a golden ball, with a cross on top:

http://www.marys-touch.com/Saints/medal/ball.JPG
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 19, 2017, 04:07:29 PM
  I'm not worried about it.   She did not say anything that might resemble "see this flat earth" etc.
I am sorry for you and other Catholics who doubt her, perhaps you might consider wearing her medal if you don't already.  

Of course you would accuse me of doubting Our Lady. Sedevacantists are mean and spiteful that way, and can't seem to keep from saying things like that.  

Of course Our Lady didn't say anything about a "flat earth" to St. Catherine. We know that.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: DZ PLEASE on October 19, 2017, 04:50:50 PM
JjjjjjjjjjjjjJєωwwwwwwwwww......
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 19, 2017, 04:53:49 PM
Of course you would accuse me of doubting Our Lady. Sedevacantists are mean and spiteful that way, and can't seem to keep from saying things like that.  

Of course Our Lady didn't say anything about a "flat earth" to St. Catherine. We know that.
I didn't mean to be spiteful, however, why do you keep insisting or looking for other words that she must have said or meant instead of what she did say. It is very clear!  
Anyway, it is you who has a mean outlook on anyone who claims to explain the Roman Catholic Church as being in the state of Sedevacantism.  This topic has nothing to do with sedevacantism and yet you insist that Sedevacantist are mean and spiteful.  You are mistaken, most don't even care what you or your ilk think about the shape of the earth.  
For myself the answer is right there especially for Catholics no matter how you want to slice it, Blessed Mother talks about the earth being a globe-like shape. Forget the science!   She should know for she has traveled from earth to heaven during her Assumption into heaven and her many apparitions back and forth, as the children have seen her coming and going, up into the heavens. 
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 19, 2017, 05:52:27 PM
I didn't mean to be spiteful, however, why do you keep insisting or looking for other words that she must have said or meant instead of what she did say. It is very clear!  
Anyway, it is you who has a mean outlook on anyone who claims to explain the Roman Catholic Church as being in the state of Sedevacantism.  This topic has nothing to do with sedevacantism and yet you insist that Sedevacantist are mean and spiteful.  You are mistaken, most don't even care what you or your ilk think about the shape of the earth.  
For myself the answer is right there especially for Catholics no matter how you want to slice it, Blessed Mother talks about the earth being a globe-like shape. Forget the science!   She should know for she has traveled from earth to heaven during her Assumption into heaven and her many apparitions back and forth, as the children have seen her coming and going, up into the heavens.
The globe our Lady is referring to is the globe of creation.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Stubborn on October 19, 2017, 07:43:41 PM
https://youtu.be/FgqW_hgpuEI?t=80 (https://youtu.be/FgqW_hgpuEI?t=80)
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 19, 2017, 07:49:51 PM
JjjjjjjjjjjjjJєωwwwwwwwwww......
Hey Meg: You know how you and kiwiboy have asked Dizzy in the past if he's autistic?
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I'm leaning toward BIPOLAR.
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: DZ PLEASE on October 19, 2017, 07:51:37 PM
Oh look, it's Sigmund Goyd...
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 19, 2017, 07:51:58 PM
The globe our Lady is referring to is the globe of creation.
^^THIS^^
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 19, 2017, 07:54:23 PM
Oh look, it's Sigmund Goyd...
What, you don't like my Dx, DZ?
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: DZ PLEASE on October 19, 2017, 08:02:54 PM
What, you don't like my Dx, DZ?
"YIPYIPYIP!"
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 19, 2017, 08:21:28 PM
https://youtu.be/FgqW_hgpuEI?t=80 (https://youtu.be/FgqW_hgpuEI?t=80)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBv3_0j0y_4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBv3_0j0y_4)
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 19, 2017, 10:45:34 PM
The globe our Lady is referring to is the globe of creation.


As in this image:
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 19, 2017, 11:24:17 PM

As in this image:
Notice the lack of landmasses; that image represents the globe of creation.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 20, 2017, 10:22:42 AM



Globe not a dish, disk, or any other rounded flat surface, if the earth was then it would be so.  Our Lady does not make mistakes.  It is not always necessary, depending on the style of art to show details as you know very well.  

Straw you use, as in a distorted, exaggerated, or misrepresented version of the position of the argument. 

Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 20, 2017, 10:41:05 AM


Globe not a dish, disk, or any other rounded flat surface, if the earth was then it would be so.  Our Lady does not make mistakes.  It is not always necessary, depending on the style of art to show details as you know very well.  

Straw you use, as in a distorted, exaggerated, or misrepresented version of the position of the argument.
The disk is in the middle. ;D
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 20, 2017, 12:20:35 PM


Anything to destroy the Blessed Mother and her message as She spoke it.  

May God have mercy on those who are so Proud as to twist definitions to suit themselves.  

Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 20, 2017, 12:25:26 PM

Anything to destroy the Blessed Mother and her message as She spoke it.  

May God have mercy on those who are so Proud as to twist definitions to suit themselves.  

Exactly how is Our Lady and her message destroyed?
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 20, 2017, 12:37:50 PM
Think of this: in the globe deception, the devil took the model of the entirety of Creation and REDUCED it to indicate only the earth itself - an earth model that LEAVES out the Firmament and the Heavens.
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As the seer for the apparition was no doubt, in 1830, educated from birth with the globe model to mean only the earth, do you really think Our Lady would have stopped to explain that this was not really true? No, I don't think she would. Wouldn't that confuse the seer? Instead, Our Lady told her the TRUTH - this represents the whole world, ALL OF CREATION, which Our Lady would fully understand from her perch in Heaven above, and St. Catherine would understand only in her limited human way, subject to the false globe earth teaching of her day.
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The only one twisting words is Myrna twisting the Bible to reject the Truth.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 20, 2017, 01:44:31 PM
Exactly how is Our Lady and her message destroyed?
  The flatFantasy folks want to twist her words.
BTW Meg, quite by accident I found what you requested yesterday; today while reading the story of the Miraculous Medal
The story in French.

Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 20, 2017, 01:49:08 PM
 The flatFantasy folks want to twist her words.
BTW Meg, quite by accident I found what you requested yesterday; today while reading the story of the Miraculous Medal
The story in French.

That not a real response. I asked you how Our Lady and Her message have been destroyed, which you have accused flat-earthers of doing. Please provide a REAL response. Not a fake one. 
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 20, 2017, 01:55:44 PM


PIUS VII

:sleep:
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 02:26:47 PM
PIUS VII

:sleep:
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Hey you!  WAKE UP!!   :jester:
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I'm leaning toward BIPOLAR.
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On the contrary, you're already there.   ;D  
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 02:30:11 PM
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Pope Pius XII referred to the earth as "the globe" many times. Maybe flat-earthers should denounce him as a "fake CGI" pope too.  :laugh2:
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Ladislaus on October 20, 2017, 02:32:13 PM
The Blessed Mother of God when She detailed the way she wanted the Miraculous medal designed.
She held in Her hand a globe and used the word globe.  

Sorry, but this is the LEAST compelling piece of "evidence".  As I said, I am currently not flat earth.  This globe is symbolic, in a work of art, and can mean any number of things.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 20, 2017, 02:37:59 PM
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Pope Pius XII referred to the earth as "the globe" many times. Maybe flat-earthers should denounce him as a "fake CGI" pope too.  :laugh2:
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So Pius Xll bought into the globe earth nonsense. He's wasn't the only one.

What I find interesting is that while Pope Pius Xll canonized St. Catherine Laboure, he did not use the words of Our Lady (to St. Catherine Laboure) to proclaim that the earth is a globe.

If Our Lady's message to St. Catherine Laboure was meant to include a definition of how the earth is shaped, well, I can't find anywhere that Pope Pius Xll thought that he had reason to define the shape of the earth, from what Our Lady said to St. Catherine Laboure.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Ladislaus on October 20, 2017, 02:38:10 PM
To me the strongest piece of evidence is the temperature variations and the seasons being consistent with specific tilts of the earth towards the sun.  I also do not understand how flat earth theory is consistent with sun-rise and sun-set being at different times in different parts of the world in a pattern & movement that's consistent with the earth being a globe and the sun revolving around it (yes, I'm a geocentrist).
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 03:02:56 PM
So Pius Xll bought into the globe earth nonsense. He's wasn't the only one.

What I find interesting is that while Pope Pius Xll canonized St. Catherine Laboure, he did not use the words of Our Lady (to St. Catherine Laboure) to proclaim that the earth is a globe.

If Our Lady's message to St. Catherine Laboure was meant to include a definition of how the earth is shaped, well, I can't find anywhere that Pope Pius Xll thought that he had reason to define the shape of the earth, from what Our Lady said to St. Catherine Laboure.
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Why would Pope Pius XII have to rely on what Our Lady said to define the shape of the globe of the earth? 
Or why would he even want to define the shape of the earth's globe in the first place? 
What makes you think it's the pope's job to define the shape of the earth? 
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Do you expect the pope to proclaim the astronomical coordinates of the moon on the first day of each month?
Does the pope pronounce definitively on the half-life of plutonium 238?
Has the pope ever defined the specific gravity of potassium?
Do you know what would happen if the pope were to attempt to find out what the specific gravity of potassium is?
How about the world market value of gold -- does the pope proclaim what today's gold price is on the open market?
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Pope Pius XII didn't need to consult the words of Our Lady to Catherine Laboure in order to define the Assumption.
Why would he have to rely on what Our Lady said to define the shape of the earth's globe? 
Or why would he even want to define the shape of the earth in the first place? 
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 20, 2017, 03:14:59 PM
That not a real response. I asked you how Our Lady and Her message have been destroyed, which you have accused flat-earthers of doing. Please provide a REAL response. Not a fake one.
When one changes definitions they destroy the objective sense of the language.
  
I will try to explain in detail, in other words, a REAL response. 
 
This is the main reason why the Catholic church made Latin the official language since it was a dead language meaning words no longer change their meanings over centuries. Avoiding mistakes! 
  
However along came the wolves in sheep's clothing and suppressed the Latin language making it easier to destroy the true meaning and going so far to even change the meaning of words.  As the elderly died off, the youth just began to accept the new way of thinking because their vernacular language said so.  Also, doublespeak became the avenue of creating "whatever" to suit the different cultures.  Doublespeak means deliberately euphemistic, ambiguous, or obscure language.
"the art of political doublespeak"
synonyms:equivocating, evasion, dodging, beating about the bush, pussyfooting (around); 

 
Now when YOU earlier in this thread and, rightly so YOU requested to see the Blessed Mother's use of Her words in the French language, in order for you to see clearly the word she used, and it was GLOBE.
  
Furthermore, since your ilk feels he must make up some excuse for the word Blessed Mother spoke be it ball or globe, the changing or adding his idea of, well She must have meant to say "Globe of Creation".  As if that alone means anything in his favor.  If one searches for the world "Globe of Creation" you will come up with images of a globe as Our Lady requested in Her design of which she stands on a globe with dimension, not a flat circle. 
 
I feel sure that God allowed St. Catherin's body to be incorrupt to prove that the vision she saw, was, in fact, true and from His Mother, the Mother of God.

As you can see when this debate is argued with the science of it, it means one thing to one person and another to another, but to a Catholic, the message of Our Lady should be all one needs, unless they are Catholic in name only and the Blessed Mother, Her description is faulty since it doesn't conform to their way of looking at things. 

The science of this debate although interesting for many but it is subjective many parts of it are since the debate continues day after day.  Since this is a Catholic forum I find it strange that Her words are not sufficient for others.  
 
Hope that helps!  
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 20, 2017, 03:20:13 PM
Sorry, but this is the LEAST compelling piece of "evidence".  As I said, I am currently not flat earth.  This globe is symbolic, in a work of art, and can mean any number of things.
I agree that the main reason for the apparition was not to define the shape of the earth, but to design the Miraculous Medal, however never the less, the Blessed Mother appeared holding a globe and mentioned a globe, therefore, we Catholic should recognize the earth is a globe.  Period!
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 03:21:52 PM
To me the strongest piece of evidence is the temperature variations and the seasons being consistent with specific tilts of the earth towards the sun.  I also do not understand how flat earth theory is consistent with sun-rise and sun-set being at different times in different parts of the world in a pattern & movement that's consistent with the earth being a globe and the sun revolving around it (yes, I'm a geocentrist).
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Flat-earthers have a lot of disagreement over how to account for time zones based on their silly flat-earthism model.
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Some say that the sun curiously shines with greater range toward the north and south poles.
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Others say that light travels further toward the north and the south, but deny there is any such thing as a south pole.
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It is impossible to make a working model of a "flat" earth which exhibits the magnetic field observable on planet earth.
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However, when a model globe earth is magnetized it works exactly the same way magnetic fields found on the real earth work in fact.
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Yet others argue that "light doesn't travel forever" and therefore it falls short along the equator, but they can't seem to explain why.
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There is no agreement among them to explain why the limits of each natural time zone is a meridian line instead of a parallel line.
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Nor can they give any reasonable use of the word "parallel" for lines that are in their view imaginary concentric circles.
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They cannot predict the time of sunrise using their model unless they abandon it and use a globe earth model, instead.
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They cannot predict a solar eclipse or a lunar eclipse either, unless they leave their silly nonsense flat-earthism behind.
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In fact, all their retarded flatness model is good for is posting its stupid CGI picture on the Internet for retarded readers to enjoy.
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Oh, by the way, they use CGI all the time while they accuse others of being untruthful for using CGI. 
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Theirs is a one-way street, IOW do what I say, not what I do.
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Meg on October 20, 2017, 03:27:14 PM
When one changes definitions they destroy the objective sense of the language.
  
I will try to explain in detail, in other words, a REAL response.
 
This is the main reason why the Catholic church made Latin the official language since it was a dead language meaning words no longer change their meanings over centuries. Avoiding mistakes!
  
However along came the wolves in sheep's clothing and suppressed the Latin language making it easier to destroy the true meaning and going so far to even change the meaning of words.  As the elderly died off, the youth just began to accept the new way of thinking because their vernacular language said so.  Also, doublespeak became the avenue of creating "whatever" to suit the different cultures.  Doublespeak means deliberately euphemistic, ambiguous, or obscure language.
"the art of political doublespeak"
synonyms:equivocating, evasion, dodging, beating about the bush, pussyfooting (around);

 
Now when YOU earlier in this thread and, rightly so YOU requested to see the Blessed Mother's use of Her words in the French language, in order for you to see clearly the word she used, and it was GLOBE.
  
Furthermore, since your ilk feels he must make up some excuse for the word Blessed Mother spoke be it ball or globe, the changing or adding his idea of, well She must have meant to say "Globe of Creation".  As if that alone means anything in his favor.  If one searches for the world "Globe of Creation" you will come up with images of a globe as Our Lady requested in Her design of which she stands on a globe with dimension, not a flat circle.
 
I feel sure that God allowed St. Catherin's body to be incorrupt to prove that the vision she saw, was, in fact, true and from His Mother, the Mother of God.

As you can see when this debate is argued with the science of it, it means one thing to one person and another to another, but to a Catholic, the message of Our Lady should be all one needs, unless they are Catholic in name only and the Blessed Mother, Her description is faulty since it doesn't conform to their way of looking at things.

The science of this debate although interesting for many but it is subjective many parts of it are since the debate continues day after day.  Since this is a Catholic forum I find it strange that Her words are not sufficient for others.  
 
Hope that helps!  


So....you believe that Our Lady's message was to tell the world that the shape of the earth is a globe. Would that be right?

And since we flat-earthers don't believe that her message was to tell the world that the earth is a globe, then we are destroying Our Lady and Her message. Would that be correct? Is this what you are in effect saying?
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 04:02:54 PM
(http://www.lastampa.it/rf/image_lowres/Pub/p4/2017/05/12/VaticanInsider/Foto/RitagliWeb/pio2-kKYD-U11002742445817MVG-1024x576%40LaStampa.it.jpg)
Pope Pius XII writing about the "globe." 
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(http://www.lastampa.it/r/Pub/p4/2017/05/12/VaticanInsider/Foto/Appunto%20Pio%20XII.jpg)
The image of his handwritten description of the "globe."
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 20, 2017, 04:50:27 PM

So....you believe that Our Lady's message was to tell the world that the shape of the earth is a globe. Would that be right?

And since we flat-earthers don't believe that her message was to tell the world that the earth is a globe, then we are destroying Our Lady and Her message. Would that be correct? Is this what you are in effect saying?
I refer you to my note just above this one #42, notice the word "not".

Just in case you can't find it, I snipped it for you:  click the image below to enlarge it  


Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 20, 2017, 04:51:24 PM
To me the strongest piece of evidence is the temperature variations and the seasons being consistent with specific tilts of the earth towards the sun.  I also do not understand how flat earth theory is consistent with sun-rise and sun-set being at different times in different parts of the world in a pattern & movement that's consistent with the earth being a globe and the sun revolving around it (yes, I'm a geocentrist).
Earth does not tilt. It cannot, for it is stationary.
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The "tilt" or change in angle of the sun's rays is due to it's location over the earth at different seasons. The angles are different when the sun is further away (winter) or closer (summer). Law of perspective.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 05:20:37 PM
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Pope Pius XII on the globe of earth:
"Today, there is not perhaps a problem, which may interest and occupy so much, the most eminent researchers of the modern world – physicists, chemists, astronomers, biologists and physiologists – and even the modern lovers of natural philosophy, as much as the subject of the laws which govern the order and action of matter, and of phenomena operating in our globe and in the universe. Indeed, fundamental questions are dealt with, whose solution is no less decisive for the object and aim of every natural science, as important also for the metaphysical comprehension, rooted in objective reality."
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: noOneImportant on October 20, 2017, 05:32:58 PM
To me the most compelling piece of evidence is that I work on the computers that help airplanes fly. Anybody here flown in a commercial jet? If the world were flat, you'd be dead, because none of it would work. Cheers.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 05:58:03 PM
So Pius Xll bought into the globe earth nonsense. He's wasn't the only one.

What I find interesting is that while Pope Pius Xll canonized St. Catherine Laboure, he did not use the words of Our Lady (to St. Catherine Laboure) to proclaim that the earth is a globe.

If Our Lady's message to St. Catherine Laboure was meant to include a definition of how the earth is shaped, well, I can't find anywhere that Pope Pius Xll thought that he had reason to define the shape of the earth, from what Our Lady said to St. Catherine Laboure.
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Since when does the Pope have to wait for a message from the Blessed Virgin before announcing a definition?
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So let's get this straight. When Pius XII "bought into the globe earth nonsense" he also bought into the Catherine Laboure nonsense too? Or what?
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Were Our Lady's words to St. Catherine endowed with the note of infallibility regardless of what the Pope had said or done? What if the Immaculate Conception had not been defined yet in 1858, would Our Lady still have said, "I am the Immaculate Conception" to Bernadette Soubirous? When, pray tell, has Our Lady ever given a message to anyone, public or private, that has provided any kind of theological or universal definition?
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 20, 2017, 05:58:14 PM
To me the most compelling piece of evidence is that I work on the computers that help airplanes fly. Anybody here flown in a commercial jet? If the world were flat, you'd be dead, because none of it would work. Cheers.
(https://i.imgur.com/3nlDhCY.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/OW8MjO8.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/SPy3Ych.png)
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: noOneImportant on October 20, 2017, 06:10:23 PM
We'll add momentum and relative motion right below perspective on the list of basic physical concepts TiE doesn't understand.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 06:23:05 PM
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Pius XII on the law of nature and the globe on which we tread:
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The law of nature participating in the eternal law of God 
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But law means order; and universal law means order in great things as well as small. It is an order deriving immediately from the intimate tendencies innate in natural things; an order that nothing can create by itself or give of itself to itself, as no being can give itself to itself; an order that signifies the Order of Reason in a Spirit which has created the universe and on which ‘depend Heaven and the whole of nature’; 4 an order which those tendencies and energies received as they came into being and through which both collaborate for a well-ordered world. This marvellous assemblage of natural laws, which the human spirit, with tireless observation and accurate study, discovered, adding victories upon victories over the occult resistances of the forces of nature, what else is it but an image, through pale and imperfect, of the great idea and of the great divine design, which in the mind of God the Creator is conceived as a law of this universe since the days of His eternity? Then, in the inexhaustible thinking of His wisdom, He prepared the heavens and the earth, and then, creating the light on the abysses of chaos, cradle of the universe also created by Him, He gave a beginning to motion and to the flight of time and of centuries, and called into being, into life and activity, all things according to their species and their kind, to the most imponderable atom. How rightly every intellect which contemplates and penetrates the heavens and weighs the stars and earth should exclaim, turning to God: Omnia in mensura et numero et pondere disposuisti 5 (‘You have disposed everything in measure and number and weight’). Do you not feel, within your souls, that the firmament which enwraps us and the globe which we tread narrate together with your telescopes, with your microscopes, with your scales, with your rules, with your multiform devices, the glory of God, and reflect, as you look, a ray of that uncreated wisdom which attingit a fine usque ad finem fortiter, et disponit omnia suaviter?6 (‘Reaches mightily from one end of the earth to the other and disposes all things well’).
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 06:30:02 PM
We'll add momentum and relative motion right below perspective on the list of basic physical concepts TiE doesn't understand.
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Don't forget gravity, mass, energy, magnetic field, gravitational waves, proportional trigonometry, pseudorange and trilateration, spectrometry, specific gravity, atomic number and isotopes, radiography, global positioning systems and the satellites by which they operate, the speed of light, geodetic coordinates, and last but not least the location of the center of mass of the earth.
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Marlelar on October 20, 2017, 07:14:51 PM
Do flat-earthers think that men have gone to the moon and that we have rovers on Mars? Or do they think it is all a hoax?

Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 20, 2017, 07:33:35 PM
Do flat-earthers think that men have gone to the moon and that we have rovers on Mars? Or do they think it is all a hoax?
No, we have not been to the moon and there are no rovers on Mars.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 20, 2017, 07:45:14 PM
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Pius XII on the law of nature and the globe on which we tread:
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The law of nature participating in the eternal law of God
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But law means order; and universal law means order in great things as well as small. It is an order deriving immediately from the intimate tendencies innate in natural things; an order that nothing can create by itself or give of itself to itself, as no being can give itself to itself; an order that signifies the Order of Reason in a Spirit which has created the universe and on which ‘depend Heaven and the whole of nature’; 4 an order which those tendencies and energies received as they came into being and through which both collaborate for a well-ordered world. This marvellous assemblage of natural laws, which the human spirit, with tireless observation and accurate study, discovered, adding victories upon victories over the occult resistances of the forces of nature, what else is it but an image, through pale and imperfect, of the great idea and of the great divine design, which in the mind of God the Creator is conceived as a law of this universe since the days of His eternity? Then, in the inexhaustible thinking of His wisdom, He prepared the heavens and the earth, and then, creating the light on the abysses of chaos, cradle of the universe also created by Him, He gave a beginning to motion and to the flight of time and of centuries, and called into being, into life and activity, all things according to their species and their kind, to the most imponderable atom. How rightly every intellect which contemplates and penetrates the heavens and weighs the stars and earth should exclaim, turning to God: Omnia in mensura et numero et pondere disposuisti 5 (‘You have disposed everything in measure and number and weight’). Do you not feel, within your souls, that the firmament which enwraps us and the globe which we tread narrate together with your telescopes, with your microscopes, with your scales, with your rules, with your multiform devices, the glory of God, and reflect, as you look, a ray of that uncreated wisdom which attingit a fine usque ad finem fortiter, et disponit omnia suaviter?6 (‘Reaches mightily from one end of the earth to the other and disposes all things well’).
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By God's good grace it is good to be in good company with great Popes.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 07:53:32 PM


Do flat-earthers think that men have gone to the moon and that we have rovers on Mars? Or do they think it is all a hoax?
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Good question! Flat-earthers generally apply their de facto skepticism toward everything they can find to which it might seem to "stick." They don't think that mathematics is credible unless it can be used to argue in favor of their pet hypothesis (even if it is used incompletely or incorrectly). They usually deny the existence of satellites or space flight of any kind such as the International Space Station (ISS - which can be seen in orbit using simple land based portable telescopes when you know how to read the updated Ephemeris of the Station, or almanac, which is available for free online). 
(https://www.meted.ucar.edu/GIS/GNSS_positioning/media/graphics/ephemeris-broadcast-sample.jpg)
It's therefore not too hard to understand that they would likewise doubt the various missions to the moon, or to Mars, or probes sent beyond Mars like Pioneer or Galileo, etc. This is largely due to their mule-like dogmatism for the existence of their so-called solid firmament (which is not called by any such name in Scripture nor is it measurable, testable, verifiable or found by anyone, ever). Notice, they cannot prove their "firmament" exists as they think it does (solid, not a metaphor used to describe the atmosphere and region beyond it all the way to the nearest stars as the Bible footnotes describe it), nonetheless, they accuse anyone who disagrees with their flat-earthism of lying when they use information or data obtained by satellite or sophisticated equipment like radio telescopes or cameras on the ISS.
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Since so much questionable material has been identified regarding the lunar missions (such as some faked studio shots of the lunar landings) some who have no vested interest in flat-earthism (such as Matthew, the owner of this forum) have decided that perhaps the moon landings are not ALL of which we're being lied to about, and therefore hold open the possibility that perhaps the shape of the earth is up for grabs or whatever. 
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I find it odd that my many descriptions of the very simple steps anyone can take to personally verify the layout of the sun and moon relative to the earth which can be directly observed with our own eyes without fancy equipment is for whatever reason insufficient for these armchair doubting Thomases. 
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 20, 2017, 07:55:07 PM
No, we have not been to the moon and there are no rovers on Mars.
That is not true; Neil Obstat has been to the moon many times. :D
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 20, 2017, 08:05:00 PM
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Those are resistant doubting Thomases, but these are roasted redoubtable tomatillos:
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(https://s15-us2.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=https%3A%2F%2Fspoonwithme.files.wordpress.com%2F2011%2F09%2Froasted.jpg&sp=a3499b56b9ed3bf2e070e44d895e7bd6)
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The astute viewer might also notice a few jalapenos, habaneros, sliced onions and tomatoes in there as well. The 2 habaneros are the bright yellow/orange peppers. 2 is plenty!
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: ryanaugustine on October 21, 2017, 08:06:09 PM
Um, Gee, I don't know, maybe observable reality?  Against a fact there is no argument.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 21, 2017, 08:32:25 PM
Um, Gee, I don't know, maybe observable reality?  Against a fact there is no argument.
You forgot to mention that no one on Cathinfo.com or anywhere else on the earth has ever seen any curvature to the earth.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 23, 2017, 03:52:07 PM
Of course you would accuse me of doubting Our Lady. Sedevacantists are mean and spiteful that way, and can't seem to keep from saying things like that.  

Of course Our Lady didn't say anything about a "flat earth" to St. Catherine. We know that.
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Gosh. What a missed opportunity. Imagine that! Our Lady passed up the chance to give the Sacred Doctrine of the flat-earthers for all the world to become informed. Hmmm... 
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Maybe the reason Our Lady didn't say anything to St. Catherine about a "flat-earth" is because there isn't any.
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 23, 2017, 04:18:27 PM
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Gosh. What a missed opportunity. Imagine that! Our Lady passed up the chance to give the Sacred Doctrine of the flat-earthers for all the world to become informed. Hmmm...
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Maybe the reason Our Lady didn't say anything to St. Catherine about a "flat-earth" is because there isn't any.
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God created the flat earth. God has already informed us; you choose to listen to NASA instead.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Neil Obstat on October 23, 2017, 05:46:21 PM
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Our Lady didn't say anything to St. Catherine about a "flat-earth" is because there isn't any.
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: noOneImportant on October 23, 2017, 06:52:43 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwZXMVqbfGc
Classic example of asking a leading question, and then interpreting the response to mean whatever you want it to. 
The pilot's answer was that the plane flies with the nose tilted up 3 degrees. This is called the angle of attack, and is needed to generate lift (to keep the plane from just falling). If you don't tilt the nose up, the plane will descend, not fly level. Anyone who has studied flight dynamics (I have, have you?) can tell you this.
Also, as has been mentioned multiple times, you need to go study calculus and wrap your head around the concept of a tangent line. It's rather relevant.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: DZ PLEASE on October 23, 2017, 06:54:52 PM
Classic example of asking a leading question, and then interpreting the response to mean whatever you want it to.
The pilot's answer was that the plane flies with the nose tilted up 3 degrees. This is called the angle of attack, and is needed to generate lift (to keep the plane from just falling). If you don't tilt the nose up, the plane will descend, not fly level. Anyone who has studied flight dynamics (I have, have you?) can tell you this.
Also, as has been mentioned multiple times, you need to go study calculus and wrap your head around the concept of a tangent line. It's rather relevant.
"... relevant..." Huh huh, you're funny.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 23, 2017, 08:38:32 PM
To me the most compelling piece of evidence is that I work on the computers that help airplanes fly. Anybody here flown in a commercial jet? If the world were flat, you'd be dead, because none of it would work. Cheers.
I don't know HOW I missed this stupendously IGNORANT post!
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No, tard, flying is a MECHANICAL act, not a computerized one. WHAT AN IDIOT YOU ARE.
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Gee, sure is a good thing the Wright Brothers had their computers to help get the Kitty Hawk off the ground...oh, wait a minute!
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Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 23, 2017, 08:42:44 PM
I'm still trying to figure out how Pan Am and all the other airlines managed to navigate all around the world without any computers in the 1950's & 60's. Must have been so hard!
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: DZ PLEASE on October 23, 2017, 10:36:28 PM
I don't know HOW I missed this stupendously IGNORANT post!
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No, tard, flying is a MECHANICAL act, not a computerized one. WHAT AN IDIOT YOU ARE.
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Gee, sure is a good thing the Wright Brothers had their computers to help get the Kitty Hawk off the ground...oh, wait a minute!
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Wow you're dumb as dirt.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: noOneImportant on October 24, 2017, 01:14:42 AM
I don't know HOW I missed this stupendously IGNORANT post!
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No, tard, flying is a MECHANICAL act, not a computerized one. WHAT AN IDIOT YOU ARE.
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Gee, sure is a good thing the Wright Brothers had their computers to help get the Kitty Hawk off the ground...oh, wait a minute!
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No, no, you're right. Thousands of engineers are being paid hundreds of millions of dollars to design fake programs for fake computers to pretend the earth is round, and all of them are in on it. And none of them are talking. I can't believe I missed the obvious explanation for all of this...
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Truth is Eternal on October 24, 2017, 09:24:26 AM
No, no, you're right. Thousands of engineers are being paid hundreds of millions of dollars to design fake programs for fake computers to pretend the earth is round, and all of them are in on it. And none of them are talking. I can't believe I missed the obvious explanation for all of this...
You're also in on the deception. SHAME ON YOU! :really-mad2:
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: MyrnaM on October 24, 2017, 09:57:26 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwZXMVqbfGc
Don't blame him for not showing his face.  :facepalm:
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 24, 2017, 10:32:55 AM
No, no, you're right. Thousands of engineers are being paid hundreds of millions of dollars to design fake programs for fake computers to pretend the earth is round, and all of them are in on it. And none of them are talking. I can't believe I missed the obvious explanation for all of this...
I'm still waiting for you to explain how FLYING has now become a "computerized" act and that it is no longer a mechanical one. And how we will all DIE without your COMPUTER PROGRAMS.
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I'll wait...
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:sleep:
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The stupid, it burns!
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: Tradplorable on October 24, 2017, 10:34:09 AM
Wow you're dumb as dirt.
If you say so, but at least I don't require any medication to be a functional member of society.
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: DZ PLEASE on October 24, 2017, 01:30:27 PM
If you say so, but at least I don't require any medication to be a functional member of society.
Treez ur... wud?
Title: Re: What do Globe Earthers Believe is the Single Most Compelling Piece of Evidence..
Post by: DZ PLEASE on October 24, 2017, 03:19:01 PM
Wake up Myrna. If they tell the truth and they are found out, they lose their job. Deceiving people like yourself is very profitable to satan's elect.
Wonder what his cut is?