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Author Topic: Serious question about flat earth  (Read 2899 times)

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Offline AMDG forever

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Serious question about flat earth
« on: April 04, 2025, 06:09:59 AM »
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  • I have a serious question for the flat earth believing people. How does a compass work on a flat earth? Using a compass, Europe is almost due east from New York. On a flat earth map it’s almost due north from New York. Can a flat earth person explain this apparent contradiction?


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #1 on: April 04, 2025, 06:59:15 AM »
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  • There's no issus with that.  As long as the source of magnetic attraction is in the north (which on a Flat Map is simply in the center), it works exactly the same way.  Even on a globe, you're curving around the North Pole, so it's really the same difference.

    What's more at issue is the Southern Hermisphere, where on a globe compasses shouldn't really work, since they have to be held flat to work correctly even in the North, so how do they work in the South?


    Offline Godefroy

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #2 on: April 04, 2025, 07:42:24 AM »
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  • There's no issus with that.  As long as the source of magnetic attraction is in the north (which on a Flat Map is simply in the center), it works exactly the same way.  Even on a globe, you're curving around the North Pole, so it's really the same difference.

    What's more at issue is the Southern Hermisphere, where on a globe compasses shouldn't really work, since they have to be held flat to work correctly even in the North, so how do they work in the South?
    That's a question I often ask people. If you take a small globe and replace the north pole with a small magnet, how will the compass work in the southern hemisphere?

    Offline AMDG forever

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #3 on: April 04, 2025, 07:54:31 PM »
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  • There's no issus with that.  As long as the source of magnetic attraction is in the north (which on a Flat Map is simply in the center), it works exactly the same way.  Even on a globe, you're curving around the North Pole, so it's really the same difference.

    What's more at issue is the Southern Hermisphere, where on a globe compasses shouldn't really work, since they have to be held flat to work correctly even in the North, so how do they work in the South?

    OK, I can see how it would be close in the northern hemisphere, but it seems completely distorted in the southern hemisphere. 

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #4 on: April 04, 2025, 08:57:20 PM »
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  • OK, I can see how it would be close in the northern hemisphere, but it seems completely distorted in the southern hemisphere.

    So the fact that a compass works in the Southern "Hemisphere" actual militates against a globe when it should not in theory.  What's "distorted" is the fact that compasses work at all in the South.  That's perfectly consistent with a Flat Earth and inconsisten with a globe.


    Offline SimpleMan

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #5 on: April 04, 2025, 09:10:02 PM »
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  • So the fact that a compass works in the Southern "Hemisphere" actual militates against a globe when it should not in theory.  What's "distorted" is the fact that compasses work at all in the South.  That's perfectly consistent with a Flat Earth and inconsisten with a globe.

    I wondered about this myself, but following the conventional concept of there being a northern magnetic pole, the compass will still point north, it'll just be harder to do.

    All by itself, this neither proves nor disproves either GE or FE.

    Offline St Giles

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #6 on: April 05, 2025, 11:07:11 PM »
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  • Magnetic fields are 3D and 360 degrees, and follow curves, so the field lines should follow the curve of the earth (north to south). The south pole should behave just like the north except for being the opposite polarity.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #7 on: April 05, 2025, 11:54:23 PM »
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  • Magnetic fields are 3D and 360 degrees, and follow curves, so the field lines should follow the curve of the earth (north to south). The south pole should behave just like the north except for being the opposite polarity.

    Magnetic fields, and radio waves for that matter have lots of PI in their calculations. Any magnet gives off a magnetic field which is spherical. There are lots of spheres in the natural world. But that has NOTHING AT ALL to do with the shape of the earth that exists beneath them.
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    Offline St Giles

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #8 on: April 06, 2025, 04:01:15 PM »
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  • My point being that a compass should work just fine anywhere on a globe, assuming a perfectly uniform field (not even the sun has that), unlike how all the posts above were making it sound nonsensical. I think it could also work on a flat earth, if FE was possible.
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    Offline Tradman

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #9 on: April 06, 2025, 05:07:57 PM »
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  • I'm not certain how a compass would be able to work on a globe because it necessarily must be kept level in order to point north. If you're on the side of the globe at the equator, the needle might point upward parallel to the north, but it would not point north. North is a 45 degree angle from that position at the equator. Moving along the curve of the globe north to south or east to west or any combination of movement whatsoever would cast the needle intended to point north, locking it into place and negating any directional result. This explanation might not be understandable to some people but it is impossible for an instrument that works on the level to work with a curved surface. 

    Offline St Giles

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #10 on: April 06, 2025, 06:22:27 PM »
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  • I'm not certain how a compass would be able to work on a globe because it necessarily must be kept level in order to point north. If you're on the side of the globe at the equator, the needle might point upward parallel to the north, but it would not point north. North is a 45 degree angle from that position at the equator.
    Yes, you are right. The compass needle would be parallel and level with the magnetic field lines which curve similarly to the ground as on a globe earth. The needle would be parallel to earth's axis, 45degrees to north at the equator, but pointing in the direction you would walk on a flat earth to reach north. Gravity, which pulls toward the center of a globe earth, keeps you on the ground, and keeps the compass needle centered flat on it's balance needle when held parallel to the ground at whatever location you are measuring from on a globe. It works and makes sense, but is much easier to demonstrate with a whiteboard or animation.


     Moving along the curve of the globe north to south or east to west or any combination of movement whatsoever would cast the needle intended to point north, locking it into place and negating any directional result. This explanation might not be understandable to some people but it is impossible for an instrument that works on the level to work with a curved surface.
    By design, a compass needle is self leveling even if the body of the compass is not perfectly level.

    Also, as far as I know, compasses work just fine on the side of hills too, and all sorts of rough terrain.


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    Offline Tradman

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #11 on: April 06, 2025, 06:36:09 PM »
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  • Yes, you are right. The compass needle would be parallel and level with the magnetic field lines which curve similarly to the ground as on a globe earth. The needle would be parallel to earth's axis, 45degrees to north at the equator, but pointing in the direction you would walk on a flat earth to reach north. Gravity, which pulls toward the center of a globe earth, keeps you on the ground, and keeps the compass needle centered flat on it's balance needle when held parallel to the ground at whatever location you are measuring from on a globe. It works and makes sense, but is much easier to demonstrate with a whiteboard or animation.

    By design, a compass needle is self leveling even if the body of the compass is not perfectly level.

    Also, as far as I know, compasses work just fine on the side of hills too, and all sorts of rough terrain.

    Ok, but then why do compasses seize when tipped? The focus area between two points has to be the "level" so that the compass can determine direction and any other direction that is "not level" means the compass will seize.  Gravity has no effect on a compass.

    Offline St Giles

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    Re: Serious question about flat earth
    « Reply #12 on: April 06, 2025, 10:37:01 PM »
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  • Depending on the design, a compass may be held as much as around 20 degrees out of level without seizing. The compass is absolutely affected by gravity. Gravity is why it can seize, and if you let go, it falls. The indicator, whether a two ended point or a disk with degree marks and an arrow, rests on a sharp pin. Gravity is needed for the indicator to rest centered on that pin. The pin is a low friction means of holding the indicator in place, so it can react to the very weak magnetic field of the earth. Without the pin, the indicator would rest on the housing with too much friction to move. The indicator is designed to be bottom heavy and balanced such that it always stays level even if the housing is not held perfectly level. Tip it much to far, and yes it binds up and doesn't move. Cheap water filed compasses can get an air bubble that pushes on the disk tilting it and causing it to seize.
    "Be you therefore perfect, as also your heavenly Father is perfect."
    "Seek first the kingdom of Heaven..."
    "Every idle word that men shall speak, they shall render an account for it in the day of judgment"