3. The current teaching of the Church is that it cannot reject Heliocentrism and cannot refused to give permission to publish material favorable to Heliocentrism, the decree of 1822 by Pope Pius VII.  You do NOT go by this, therefore you have LIED again. 
 
I look forward to your next "blah, blah, blah", repetition of all the lies you keep publishing.

I have just recorded the decrees of 1820 and 1822, you say I lied about. Since when did allowing book teaching a 'modern version of heliocentrism' become a Church teaching? Here again are the parts of these decrees that are materially heretical:

1. BOOKS in which he espouses the common opinion of the astronomers of our time regarding the Earth’s daily and yearly motions,

2. His Holiness has decreed that no obstacles exist for those who sustain Copernicus’ affirmation regarding the Earth’s movement in the manner in which it is affirmed today, even by Catholic authors (BOOKS)

3.to publish works (BOOKS) which treat of the mobility of the Earth and of the immobility of the sun, according to the common opinion of modern astronomers,

It is not a Church teaching, it was an invention by popes to appease the word of philosophers and astronomers and authors. If you do not know the difference between Church teaching, erroneous utterences and decrees about books, and utterences made at Vatican II like Gaudium et Spes, then don't go preaching to others until you do. 

6. The evidence is NOT in favor of Geocentrism.  The evidence shows that the Earth is orbiting the Sun.  The evidence is called, Stellar Paralax.  There is another problem for Geocentrism.  The galaxy of Andromeda would have to be traveling in orbit around the Earth at a speed of 6,000,000 TIMES THE SPEED OF LIGHT.  Neptune would have to be going faster than the speed of light.  
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I look forward to your next "blah, blah, blah", repetition of all the lies you keep publishing.

It may be a problem for you Apollo, but not for God. My Catholic faith teaches me God can will anything, even turning all the stars around the earth every 24 hours. Now call this "blah, blah, blah" a lie as much as you like, but it is my Catholic Faith.

1. The Catholic Church does not contradict itself. But one has to know the difference between the 'Catholic Church' and the utterences and behaviour of men. When a Pope defines a matter of faith or morals, he speaks for the Catholic Church. That was the 1616 decree of Pope Paul V. Vatican Council I set out the conditions for infallibility for this 1616 decree:

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1. NOT TRUE. Pope Pius V's decree was an OPINION.  He never signed the docuмent and he never sent out letters to all the bishops of the world,
which is required when an infallible dogma is declared.  
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If he had made an infallible decree, then the religion vs science debate would have been won by science in 1822, and even more so today.
Look up "Stellar Parallax".  
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Geocentrism is NOT a matter of Faith. 

4. They believe in telescopes, a serious problem for Geocentrism.  The ASTRONOMY class has nothing to do with Darwin and his "evolution".  It's more about what can be observed with telescopes.  Ever heard of Stellar Paralax.  It cannot be observed without
telescopes.  It can be observed with good telescopes, which actually disproves Geocentrism.  Sorry.
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5. It's not about Evolution nor Modernism.  It's about looking through telescopes.  No faith required.
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6. The evidence is NOT in favor of Geocentrism.  The evidence shows that the Earth is orbiting the Sun.  The evidence is called, Stellar Paralax.  There is another problem for Geocentrism.  The galaxy of Andromeda would have to be traveling in orbit around the Earth at a speed of 6,000,000 TIMES THE SPEED OF LIGHT.  Neptune would have to be going faster than the speed of light.  

Wow, with all due respect your post is like comedy 101.  Looks like you would get an A+ in an astrophysics class taught by Fr. Paul Robinson down in the seminary in Australia if he actually taught such a class.  Here, however, it's quite a different matter.

Telescopes a serious problem for Geocentrism!  Now, that's a truly incredible statement to make.  I'm sorry to inform you that contrary to what Fr. Robinson still publicly holds -- even till this day as far as I know -- (see pp. 279-282 of Fr. Robinson's book The Realist Guide to Religion and Science) stellar parallax absolutely does not carry the day for heliocentrism, much less disprove geocentrism.   As a matter of fact science can not prove or disprove geocentrism at least with any absolute certainty.  What it can do is provide evidence pointing in the direction of one or the other.  Contrary to popular opinion (shaped largely by modern atheist Big Bang scientists), the objective evidence points heavily in favor of geocentrism.

As for stellar parallax -- well it's quite simple: there is a complete and unequivocal  geometric equivalence of stellar parallax.  This is a well established fact which the scientific community grudgingly, but openly admits.  Perhaps, you can help the good Padre Robinson to come up to speed on this.

As for your objection to geocentrism on the ground of things traveling around the Earth at speeds faster than the speed of light, this simply shows your apparent ignorance of the nature of aether.  You should also realize that only the 1905 Special Theory of Relativity (not Einstein's subsequent 1916 General Theory) disallows an object to exceed the speed of light.  Since the Special Theory does not incorporate gravity, it is only applicable in very few cases, since most if not all of the universe ins under the control of gravity.

It is most difficult to debate with people who do not seem to be able to understand the history of that infamous U-turn, people who add insults to their posts, and in normal circuмstances should not deserve replies to such posts. But many others are reading these posts and for them it is always worth answering confusing posts as above.

The 1616 decree is a matter of Faith. This was held by all, especially Pope Urban VII who had it recorded in the 1633 trial of Galileo. No pope in history has ever said, inferred or suggested it was not a matter of faith. Such was their concern in 1820 that it was a matter of faith they actuially had to invent a heliocentrism they said was NOT the heliocentrism of 1616. Why do this if it was not of faith? Just read the decrees of 1820

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Cassini, you forgot to dump the whole Catholic Encyclopedia into your last reply.  Can you please do that for me
in your next reply.  
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Geocentrism is not a matter of FAITH.  It's NOT.  It's really really NOT.  
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It's a theory.  THEORY, THEORY, THEORY.  
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The Bible offers absolutely no proof of it.  The Sun come up and goes down. WOW.
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I'm really tired of trying to convince you.  You go ahead and believe in Geocentrism.
And on your judgement day, you can tell God that you believed in Geocentrism.  
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The Catholic Church made a U-TURN in 1820  ??
I guess Jesus Christ is a liar when he said, "I will be with you all days ...".
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You, yourself, decide what is heresy and what is not ? When are you going to hold
a Council of the Church and declare with all the Cardinals that Pope Pius VII was a
heretic.  
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Extreme sedevacantist.  That's what you are.

Hello all,

This topic (about the Kolbe Center Seminar) is a duplicate and in the wrong category, please go here: https://www.cathinfo.com/fighting-errors-in-the-modern-world/any-interest-out-there-for-a-confrence-by-kolbe-center-for-creation/

I believe the debate is also more appropriate in another category.

NOTE: the seminar is not about the errors of Fr. Robinson, or about Kolbe Center vs. the SSPX. However, if Fr. Robinson or anyone else holds onto any errors that will be brought up during the seminar, then yes those errors will be discussed.

Title: “Creation, Evolution and the Crisis of Faith”

Theme: The Traditional Catholic Doctrine of Creation and the Judgment of Philosophy and Natural Science on the Theory of Evolution

A Seminar Sponsored by the Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation

Presenter:  Hugh Owen, Director of the Kolbe Center, Dr. Thomas Seiler, Ph.D. in physics and Pamela Aker, Biologist

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1. NOT TRUE. Pope Pius V's decree was an OPINION.  He never signed the docuмent and he never sent out letters to all the bishops of the world,
which is required when an infallible dogma is declared.  
.
If he had made an infallible decree, then the religion vs science debate would have been won by science in 1822, and even more so today.
Look up "Stellar Parallax".  
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Geocentrism is NOT a matter of Faith.

To be honest Apollo, I cannot blame you for thinking that. You are a victim of that betrayal of 1820-1835 as were millions of Catholics since then and simply cannot believe Catholicism was cheated out of that biblical geocentric dogma. But nowadays,when one lives at a time when ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ cardinals and bishops run the Church today, protected by a pope who also tries to get around Catholic dogmas, we can all see God allows such things to happen. 

Now all the questions you ask and all the statements you make have been made by hundreds of others for the last 200 years. It is obvious that you are not open to truth but as I said before I am answering so others who may think in like manner will see the truth.

There are Church docuмents now available that show us the truth. You say Pope Pius V but you meant Paul V, decreed an OPINION whatever you meant by that. It was of course an opinion, the pope's opinion that agreed with his Holy Office that heliocentrism was formal heresy because it contradicted the revelation of Scripture so he decreed it formal heresy by way of the Holy Office. This is what popes do and did since getting the keys from Jesus.

As for him not signing it, well we know no pope signed or had to sign these Holy Office decrees. The Holy Office was set up to decided on matters of serious heresy and the pope was made prefect of it. In other words no decision came from this Office unless the pope said so. Thus no docuмent was signed by a pope or needed to be signed by a pope.

Who told you no 'letters' were sent to Bishops of the Catholic world telling them of the 1616 decree? What the heck do you think the Index was for? On March 5th 1616, the decree that banned books advocating a herliocentric universe was put on the Index that every churchman was aware of. 


on 2nd July 1633, after Galileo's trial, when Pope Urban VIII confirmed the 1616 dercree was absolute, non reformable, and Galileo was found guilty of suspicion of heresy, again under orders of the Pope, the condemnation was made universal, not just confined to Galileo alone as some apologists would argue. Copies of the sentence and his abjuration were sent to all vicar nuncios and inquisitors who made them known to professors of philosophy and theology throughout the Catholic world.

Now if you think the Church did all this with a false decree, now thatb you are told the truth, you are no Catholic.