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Author Topic: Experienced hams - earth is curved BUT BUT  (Read 135853 times)

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Offline Ladislaus

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Re: Experienced hams - earth is curved BUT BUT
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2025, 04:41:06 PM »
Or this ...

Quote
Microwaves travel solely by line-of-sight paths; unlike lower frequency radio waves, they do not travel as ground waves which follow the contour of the Earth, or reflect off the ionosphere (skywaves)

So there are these magical "ground waves" which [just so happen to] follow [and bend around] the contour of the Earth ... just amazing that the earth tries to darn hard to hide its curvature.

Then there was the microwave transmission across the Mediterranean, where the globers were in a frenzy since they couldn't explain that one away, so they were claiming that the company that conducted the test must have had 2,000 foot towers, cuz, well, we KNOW the earth is a globe.  I'm sure that if there were 2,000 foot towers on both sides, someone would have spotted them or they would have been logged somewhere in aviation guides.

They just throw stupidity out there like this, hoping that people won't stop for a second to consider that, 2,000 feet would be twice the height of a single one of the Twin Towers in NYC that fell on 9/11. Yes, I'm sure this company constructed these towers that were twice as tall as each Twin Tower, just to conduct an experiment about whether they could transmit high-def data over several hundred miles.

Re: Experienced hams - earth is curved BUT BUT
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2025, 07:49:11 PM »
My forte is TV DX, not ham radio (though I do hold a Technician license) or other types of audio reception.  I can tell you that the site rabbitears.info allows you to do a signal search based upon your location, and provides Longley-Rice "heat maps" as well, which take into account terrain, and are of course based upon a GE model.  Those maps tend to hold up when compared with actual reception of various stations at any given location.  The stations it predicts I will get are indeed receivable (I have a copse of pine trees to the north of my property, which makes reception in that direction more difficult, and which the heat maps don't take into account, but in all other directions it's smooth sailing), and the further out you get from the transmitter, terrain and elevation have their way with the signal.  If you can get out over a completely unobstructed area (such as a body of water), the heat maps predict a gradual diminution of signal as you get further away from the TX, then a sharp drop-off after about 100 miles tops.  It would be interesting to have some kind of boat, go out to the limit that the heat maps predict, and see if the signal does, indeed, completely vanish.  Now, as to whether this would prove FE or GE could depend on various factors, such as the downtilt of the signal (ordinary TV signals are not like microwaves, they fan out from the top of the TX and, so I have been told, are flattened out above the TX, as there is no point sending a signal straight up in the air).

Here is a sample map showing a station directly on the Florida coast (WJXT Jacksonville FL, RF channel 18, tower height 997 feet at 670 KW).  The "sharp drop-off" is at the outer edge of the salmon-colored band.  The PSIP information (i.e., the channel number you see on your TV set) is channel 4 (4-1, 4-2, and so on for the various subchannels), but that is not the actual RF channel, when the FCC forced all stations to switch over to digital, using different channel allocations in the vast majority of cases, they allowed the broadcasters to retain the same channel numbers on PSIP, for continuity of marketing.  WJXT has been channel 4 in Jacksonville forever, so even now that it is broadcast on RF channel 18, the viewer still sees channel 4 on the screen.  It's complicated.





Offline Matthew

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Re: Experienced hams - earth is curved BUT BUT
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2025, 11:46:09 PM »
To fully understand what's going on, you would need to understand:

1. the shape of the earth (flat), including the existence of a Firmament (which might very well bounce radio waves)
2. the existence of the Aether -- all ham band propagation properties/habits can be explained by the aether, which obviously changes in various ways during the day vs. night. The Sun might indeed be exciting the aether in some way, though it's not a NASA CGI flaming ball of hydrogen fusion.
3. There is much about the natural world we don't know, especially with 99.9% of the Scientific community -- those paid to do this work -- have been "out to lunch" for the past ??? years, chasing after nonsense after nonsense (globe earth, evolution, aliens, our "origins", etc.)

Also recall that the military has VHF or UHF systems (both of these frequency ranges are LINE-OF-SIGHT) which operate regularly, as in 99%+ uptime -- which can't be explained by all the exotic propagation methods known to Hams (knife edge, tropo, rain scatter, meteor scatter, etc.) Those phenomena DO exist and do explain PART of the whole picture, but they would NOT explain a system which requires 99%+ uptime. Tropo simply doesn't happen that often. It's supposed to be a relatively rare treat, like a day off work.

Offline Ladislaus

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Re: Experienced hams - earth is curved BUT BUT
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2025, 05:04:25 AM »
I would add to the list that one should be open to the possibility of a dome, allowing for signals to possibly reflect off of that depending on the scenario, and of course, more than just open to the possibility, since Sacred Scripture quite clearly describes a physical dome, so we as Catholics must believe it.

Even Dr. Sungenis departed from his original "firmament is space" hypothesis, realizing that it was inadequate, and moved first toward the Planck fabric explanation, which I think again he found inadequate (speaking to some intellectual honesty there on his part), since the Planck fabric could not have the properties attributed to the firmament (preventing water from inundating the earth during the Flood), and moved toward the Ice Firmament theory as described in his latest video series from Kolbe that appears to have had the plug pulled on it.  He was working on a series on "How God Created the World in Six Days", but it appears to have been cancelled after Day 2.  I do suspect that both Kolbe and he got so much heat about the giant space ice ball theory (from the same types that deride FE, ironically, and with whom he had joined forces against FE) that they pulled the plug.  I wrote to Kolbe asking them what happened, since I had purchased Day 1 and Day 2, with the hope that I could get the entire series.  I may request a refund to see if that will inspire them to tell me why they aborted the series.

Offline Matthew

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Re: Experienced hams - earth is curved BUT BUT
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2025, 09:35:19 AM »
Audio waves bounce off the firmament -- why not radio waves?

When you hear thunder, ask yourself: where is the echo coming from? If the sound were travelling away from you, it would not reach your ears. It would have to bounce OFF something and come back to your ears, to hear an echo.
And we've all heard thunderstorms where some thunder rumbles/noises are distinctly "echos" of an original thunderclap.
The ground would ABSORB any sound waves; and at any rate, my ears aren't in the ground here and there. Even if it bounced, it would go UP and my ears aren't up in the sky either. Once a sound wave heads skyward, isn't it lost into "outer space"? Unless there's a Firmament...

I've never lived in a mountainous area. Quite the contrary.

But yes, I forgot to mention the Firmament aspect. That's why Hams will sometimes send radio transmissions "long path" or around the "globe" to their destination. For example, Someone on the East Coast aiming an antenna EAST to reach California via "long path". On a FE model, this would bounce off the firmament.

Long story short, Firmament + Aether explains FAR more of the day-to-day experiences and reality of Ham Radio than the commonly accepted "globe" model.