I want to know people's stance on the Indult/Motu mass.  Once the sspx makes their deal, that's what they'll be - another indult group.  

I side with Stubborn.  And the insult, comes under dioceses which serves State and Gov't, not God.

As much as I hesitate to stay home alone on Sunday (for I believe that is VERY dangerous), Indult Masses are also extremely problematic.

Besides the fact that they are compromised, and pretend Vatican II and the Conciliar Church "isn't that bad", which leads people into a sleepy, relaxed false sense of security about the raging war that we're actually in...

Most Indult/Motu Masses are said in SHARED FACILITIES where the Novus Ordo Mass is also said edit: and "Communion in the Hand" is practiced.

Do you believe the Novus Ordo Mass can be valid? Yes or No.

Yes? Then you might be stepping on Sacred Particles while attending your proper Tridentine Mass with Communion on the tongue. The Novus Ordo uses Communion in the Hand EXCLUSIVELY and it's a fact that particles are lost when Communion is distributed in this manner. So unless the "cleaning crew" has cleaned the church before your Tridentine Mass, you might be stepping on Our Lord.

No? Then you have to worry about the priest distributing Novus Ordo "cookies" reserved in the tabernacle during (what is supposed to be) Communion of the Faithful.

For these reasons, I believe it is imperative for ALL Catholic Faithful to RED LIGHT all Tridentine Masses held in a shared facility (Novus Ordo also said there, with CitH practiced). Even if that means you have no other place to attend Mass. Find a better place to live, even in a different state, and move there.

But receiving bread in lieu of Communion isn't an option, and stepping on Our Lord from the last Novus Ordo Mass isn't an option.


P.S. I'm not a theologian, but I do know that:
A) many, many learned Trads have their doubts about the New Rite of Ordination and/or the New Rite of Consecration.
B) Traditionally (pardon the pun), it is commonplace to conditionally ordain priests (as necessary) when they are going to be saying Mass for groups in the Traditional movement.
C) I can't argue with their reasoning: Better to be safe than sorry. And you can't play games when you're talking about validity of a priest. Want to assist at the Holy Sacrifice of Mass? Want to receive Our Lord? Want your (perhaps mortal) sins forgiven? He better be a priest or you're OUT OF LUCK on all counts.

Virtually no "indult" priests are ordained (in the old Rite) by bishops who were consecrated in the old Rite.

This isn't as clear-cut as the problem I described above, but that doesn't mean it's trivial or a non-issue.

I can't vote on the poll but I'll tell you what I think.

I will not attend the indult but not because I am "opposed to it".  I am not opposed to the "pope" "allowing" people to attend the Mass.  It is not the Mass that I am opposed to.  The problem is that the people offering it are formally in communion with heretics.  Additionally, most (nearing all) of those priests reading that Mass are not true priests since they were ordained by bishops who were, themselves, consecrated in the new rite or by bishops consecrated in the new rite and are therefore false priests with no more power to off the Holy Sacrifice than an Anglican priest.

The law authorizing the indult still indicates that to accept the indult, one must necessarily accept the Novus Ordo and the entire Conciliar false church along with all its false teachings.

Quote from: Matthew

The Novus Ordo uses Communion in the Hand EXCLUSIVELY. . .

I'm not sure that I am accurately comprehending the context of your use of the word "exclusively" here.  In most Novus Ordos "masses" each individual receiving communion in the hand is overwhelming--perhaps 100% in some--85+/-% is probably more typical of what I observed for 40 years.  One very conservative NO parish where I was the old priest (and successor prietenders) heavily encouraged communion on the tongue but did not refuse communion in the hand.  In that parish, communion on the tongue seemed to be 65+/-%.

I was referring to what is typically done in 2016.

The early years of the Novus Ordo would have more older, conservative, validly ordained priests who understand what Holy Communion is.

But as time goes on, that number becomes fewer and fewer.

I haven't heard of any Novus Ordo parishes offering communion on the tongue. Most of them don't even tolerate it. Even in "average" or conservative parishes, everyone receives in the hand and many from an "extraordinary" lay minister.

Quote from: Matthew

I haven't heard of any Novus Ordo parishes offering communion on the tongue. Most of them don't even tolerate it. Even in "average" or conservative parishes, everyone receives in the hand and many from an "extraordinary" lay minister.

I grew up in the Novus Ordo and after I started to become Catholic again, but before I was truly traditional I spent a year or so in the Novus Ordo. True, most people receive in the hand, but there are always those that are more devout and receive on the tongue. I was one of these who received on the tongue and I was never denied communion on the tongue and told to receive in the hand. Also there are almost always extraordinary ministers who give out communion but most of those who are more devout go to the priest himself to receive because they do not like receiving the sacrament from lay women.

This precisely describes by experience up through 2011/2012.

Quote from: OHCA

Quote from: Matto

Quote from: Matthew

I haven't heard of any Novus Ordo parishes offering communion on the tongue. Most of them don't even tolerate it. Even in "average" or conservative parishes, everyone receives in the hand and many from an "extraordinary" lay minister.

I grew up in the Novus Ordo and after I started to become Catholic again, but before I was truly traditional I spent a year or so in the Novus Ordo. True, most people receive in the hand, but there are always those that are more devout and receive on the tongue. I was one of these who received on the tongue and I was never denied communion on the tongue and told to receive in the hand. Also there are almost always extraordinary ministers who give out communion but most of those who are more devout go to the priest himself to receive because they do not like receiving the sacrament from lay women.

This precisely describes by experience up through 2011/2012.

You are both missing the point.

Please note: if even A FEW parishioners receive in the hand, then COMMUNION IN THE HAND IS PRACTICED at that parish, and Sacred Particles will be present on the floor, to be literally trodden upon by men.

That was my point.

How many parishes DOWNRIGHT REFUSE to distribute communion in the hand, if someone puts out their hand and wishes to receive in that manner? Approximately zero.

I rest my case.

This clarifies your context of "exclusively" and is consistent with my miserable sojourn in conciliardom.  I never attended an NO "mass" where communion in the hand was not allowed, and typically that was the overwhelming practice.

Quote from: OHCA

Quote from: Matto

Quote from: Matthew

I haven't heard of any Novus Ordo parishes offering communion on the tongue. Most of them don't even tolerate it. Even in "average" or conservative parishes, everyone receives in the hand and many from an "extraordinary" lay minister.

I grew up in the Novus Ordo and after I started to become Catholic again, but before I was truly traditional I spent a year or so in the Novus Ordo. True, most people receive in the hand, but there are always those that are more devout and receive on the tongue. I was one of these who received on the tongue and I was never denied communion on the tongue and told to receive in the hand. Also there are almost always extraordinary ministers who give out communion but most of those who are more devout go to the priest himself to receive because they do not like receiving the sacrament from lay women.

This precisely describes by experience up through 2011/2012.

You are both missing the point.

Please note: if even A FEW parishioners receive in the hand, then COMMUNION IN THE HAND IS PRACTICED at that parish, and Sacred Particles will be present on the floor, to be literally trodden upon by men.

That was my point.

How many parishes DOWNRIGHT REFUSE to distribute communion in the hand, if someone puts out their hand and wishes to receive in that manner? Approximately zero.

I rest my case.

If there are some magical parishes that forbid communion in the hand, then obviously my "Red Light" on Indult Masses at shared facilities obviously does not apply! That would be a rare exception.

Remember, the exception PROVES the rule.

You said something that was not true according to my experience in the Novus Ordo. All I was doing was correcting your error. You were mistaken when you said that communion on the tongue was not tolerated in most Novus Ordo parishes. In all of the many Novus Ordo parishes I have attended in my time in the Novus Ordo, they tolerated communion on the tongue. It is also not true that in the more conservative parishes "everyone" receives in the hand. Many of the conservatives receive on the tongue and not in the hand.