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Author Topic: Who else should be banned?  (Read 6077 times)

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Offline Pax Vobis

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Re: Who else should be banned?
« Reply #45 on: August 20, 2018, 11:38:50 AM »
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    When I disappear, will there be a single Resistance writer producing articles on this forum?
    What is a "resistance writer"?
    Why would you not call them "catholic" writers?
    What topics differentiate a "resistance" writer vs a catholic writer?
    Isn't the resistance supposed to help people keep the faith, love God and save their souls?
    Isn't the catholic faith supposed to do the same?
    What differentiates the resistance from other catholic groups?
    Do such differences need to be MAGNIFIED, to continue conflict, or should they be MINIMIZED, to promote peace?
    Labels, sects, and fighting tribes serve no purpose to God, only satan. 


    Offline Meg

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #46 on: August 20, 2018, 11:41:05 AM »
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  • At least Angelqueen had the BLEEP! rule.

    You're right. I had forgotten about that. And that forum still had a LOT of traffic, despite the ban on sedevacantism. That is, until the forum owner did that expose on Malachi Martin. The forum lost a lot of members over that. I still miss that forum. 

    But maybe it had a lot of traffic because there were many SSPX-friendly people who posted there.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #47 on: August 20, 2018, 11:47:26 AM »
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  • You're right. I had forgotten about that. And that forum still had a LOT of traffic, despite the ban on sedevacantism. That is, until the forum owner did that expose on Malachi Martin. The forum lost a lot of members over that.

    But maybe it had a lot of traffic because there were many SSPX-friendly people who posted there.

    Angelqueen was very much an SSPX forum. Just imagine if the SSPX hadn't fallen how many more members CI would have if I didn't have to ban all those who fiercely bashed the Resistance.

    And the SSPX was the 800 lb. gorilla in the Trad world. If Traditional Catholicism were Retail Merchandising, the SSPX would be Amazon.com, Wal-Mart, and Target combined. And probably a few others. The other 20% of the market would be divided up among all the other groups. There's a reason why Rome is trying to absorb the SSPX.

    And that's another reason why the fall of the SSPX is such a big deal. Most Catholics in the USA (which is all I have any knowledge of; I'll admit that) can drive to an SSPX chapel within 2 hours or so. There are exceptions, like certain states in the Deep South, but you get the idea. But once you eliminate the SSPX as an option (and certainly the Indult wouldn't be an option either, if you're crossing off the SSPX) you're talking THE VAST MAJORITY not being close to a place for Mass. There simply aren't many Resistance, independent, or sedevacantist chapels. Probably 1/5 as many as the SSPX has in this country. It depends on where you live -- some geographic locations have Trad Mass options coming out their ears. Others have next to nothing.

    Sean Johnson bringing up AQ is funny though -- that whole "Bleep" thing was ridiculous. In America at least, Sedevacantism is a thing, known by all, and you're not going to squash it by not mentioning its name.  People will look at the actions of a Pope Francis and many will consider the position WITH or WITHOUT a ban on it.

    You can't treat the whole body of American Traditional Catholics like I would treat my children under 10 (more or less complete sheltering). Young children, yes. You shelter them from opposing viewpoints and opinions until they learn their Faith -- until they learn what truth is, and until they are familiar with our family's position on the Crisis. But grown adults living on their own? That's ridiculous. They can make their own prudential decision about how to deal with the Crisis in the Church.

    And I know what some are going to say (or think): "The Church used to have the Index of Forbidden Books -- the Church is all about censorship of dangerous errors which could damage our Faith"

    I would respond: "Ok, then show me where the Catholic Church clearly condemns sedevacantism, and THEN I will consider it a dogmatic error, and require all members to be free from that error."

    But you can't. Sedevacantism is a disputed point, a debated point of theology arising from the unprecedented Crisis in the Church. No Pope or Council has ruled on this issue, so it's open season, fair game.
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    Offline Meg

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #48 on: August 20, 2018, 12:06:26 PM »
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  • Angelqueen was very much an SSPX forum. Just imagine if the SSPX hadn't fallen how many more members CI would have if I didn't have to ban all those who fiercely bashed the Resistance.

    And the SSPX was the 800 lb. gorilla in the Trad world. If Traditional Catholicism were Retail Merchandising, the SSPX would be Amazon.com, Wal-Mart, and Target combined. And probably a few others. The other 20% of the market would be divided up among all the other groups. There's a reason why Rome is trying to absorb the SSPX.

    And that's another reason why the fall of the SSPX is such a big deal. Most Catholics in the USA (which is all I have any knowledge of; I'll admit that) can drive to an SSPX chapel within 2 hours or so. There are exceptions, like certain states in the Deep South, but you get the idea. But once you eliminate the SSPX as an option (and certainly the Indult wouldn't be an option either, if you're crossing off the SSPX) you're talking THE VAST MAJORITY not being close to a place for Mass. There simply aren't many Resistance, independent, or sedevacantist chapels. Probably 1/5 as many as the SSPX has in this country. It depends on where you live -- some geographic locations have Trad Mass options coming out their ears. Others have next to nothing.

    Sean Johnson bringing up AQ is funny though -- that whole "Bleep" thing was ridiculous. In America at least, Sedevacantism is a thing, known by all, and you're not going to squash it by not mentioning its name.  People will look at the actions of a Pope Francis and many will consider the position WITH or WITHOUT a ban on it.

    You can't treat the whole body of American Traditional Catholics like I would treat my children under 10 (more or less complete sheltering). Young children, yes. You shelter them from opposing viewpoints and opinions until they learn their Faith -- until they learn what truth is, and until they are familiar with our family's position on the Crisis. But grown adults living on their own? That's ridiculous. They can make their own prudential decision about how to deal with the Crisis in the Church.

    And I know what some are going to say (or think): "The Church used to have the Index of Forbidden Books -- the Church is all about censorship of dangerous errors which could damage our Faith"

    I would respond: "Ok, then show me where the Catholic Church clearly condemns sedevacantism, and THEN I will consider it a dogmatic error, and require all members to be free from that error."

    But you can't. Sedevacantism is a disputed point, a debated point of theology arising from the unprecedented Crisis in the Church. No Pope or Council has ruled on this issue, so it's open season, fair game.

    Okay, I see what you're saying. But you mention above that...."They can make their own prudential decision about how to deal with the Crisis in the Church."

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you believe that sedevacantism is a viable and prudential option to take. But I don't think that's how the Resistance bishops think about the matter. Maybe I'm wrong about that. But even Fr. Chazal, who is quite understanding about why Catholics sometimes choose the sedevacantism route, has himself said that it should be discussed in order to show how it (sedevacantism) is wrong. And some of us do try to do that. But at some point we have to draw the line.

    How much time should we spend with arguing/debating sedevacantism when we could be doing something more useful? And what about the division it causes?
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #49 on: August 20, 2018, 12:16:48 PM »
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  • But once you eliminate the SSPX as an option (and certainly the Indult wouldn't be an option either, if you're crossing off the SSPX) you're talking THE VAST MAJORITY not being close to a place for Mass. There simply aren't many Resistance, independent, or sedevacantist chapels.

    I live within one hour of ALL the following ...

    SSPX chapel (Sunday Mass + some Saturdays and Holy Days), one hour away (Cleveland)

    a second SSPX chapel (Sunday Mass + some Saturdays and Holy Days), fifty minutes away (Girard, OH ... towards Youngstown)

    Independent SSPX-aligned (Sunday Mass + Daily Mass), ten minutes away (Akron, OH)

    CMRI, fifteen minutes away (Akron, OH)

    SSPV, one hour away (Parma, OH)

    not to mention 2 Ukrainian Rite churches, 4 Ruthenian (Byzantine) Rite churches, 1 Melchite Rite church, 3 Maronite Rite churches, and 1 Romanian Byzantine.

    That's because Cleveland-Akron was historically one of THE biggest hotspots for immigration into the country by a huge variety of Eastern European groups ... Polish, Hungarians, Croatians, Slovaks, Ukrainians, Russians, Lebanese.

    Now, TWO hours South of where I'm at I have many more options in the Columbus area


    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #50 on: August 20, 2018, 12:18:41 PM »
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    Fr Chazal...has himself said that it should be discussed in order to show how it (sedevacantism) is wrong.
    No, that's incorrect.  Fr Chazal is opposed to DOGMATIC sedevacantism.  He's open to a rational discussion of the issue and admits that certain points are valid.

    Offline Meg

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #51 on: August 20, 2018, 12:21:06 PM »
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  • No, that's incorrect.  Fr Chazal is opposed to DOGMATIC sedevacantism.  He's open to a rational discussion of the issue and admits that certain points are valid.

    Fr. Chazal did not qualify his statement by using the term "dogmatic" when he said that. He just used the term "sedevacantism."
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #52 on: August 20, 2018, 12:43:26 PM »
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  • Meg,
    Here is the first sentence on the back of Fr Chazal's new book.  Yes, he's against dogmatic sedevacantism and he used that word specifically.

    Contra Cekadam by Fr. Chazal is a new treatise against Sedevacantism (the belief that "the Chair is empty" or that we have no Pope), particularly the dogmatic and extreme variety of sedevacantism promoted by the sedevacantist priest Fr. Anthony Cekada.


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #53 on: August 20, 2018, 12:46:40 PM »
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  • Once upon a time, Sean Johnson started a catholic forum, but once he banned everyone that disagreed with him, he was left with only himself, so he changed the name of the site to a blog.  Then he could only read what he wrote. And he lived happily ever after.  The end.
    .
    This thread ought to be re-named: the decline and fall of an internet nobody who thought it was all about him.
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

    Offline Meg

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #54 on: August 20, 2018, 12:47:22 PM »
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  • Meg,
    Here is the first sentence on the back of Fr Chazal's new book.  Yes, he's against dogmatic sedevacantism and he used that word specifically.

    Contra Cekadam by Fr. Chazal is a new treatise against Sedevacantism (the belief that "the Chair is empty" or that we have no Pope), particularly the dogmatic and extreme variety of sedevacantism promoted by the sedevacantist priest Fr. Anthony Cekada.

    As a sedewhatever, you of course have to fight for your cause of....sedewhateverism. Quite frankly, I'm tired of it. 

    Sean Johnson is right, at least regarding the sedevacantists. 
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #55 on: August 20, 2018, 01:15:19 PM »
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  • Sean Johnson is right, at least regarding the sedevacantists.

    And he puts "flatheads" (his term) like yourself in the same category.


    Offline Meg

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #56 on: August 20, 2018, 01:17:19 PM »
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  • And he puts "flatheads" (his term) like yourself in the same category.

    I expect to be called names by sedewhatevers. Not a big deal. I realize that you sedewhatevers have to stick together.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #57 on: August 20, 2018, 01:23:36 PM »
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  • That's not the same as not fearing the ban button. Apparently you don't fear the ban button only because you think I'm stuck with you for political reasons. Because you're a big deal, irreplaceable, etc. Hahahaha
    Should he fear the ban button? Is there even a possibility that he could get banned?  So far I see no evidence of that.
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #58 on: August 20, 2018, 01:26:19 PM »
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  • Should he fear the ban button? Is there even a possibility that he could get banned?  So far I see no evidence of that.

    If you had any sense, you would threaten a joint-sede/Feeneyite boycott.

    That would do the trick.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Who else should be banned?
    « Reply #59 on: August 20, 2018, 02:06:48 PM »
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  • Should he fear the ban button? Is there even a possibility that he could get banned?  So far I see no evidence of that.

    Ah, if nothing else, he's good for entertainment value ... even if it's annoying entertainment.