Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: What is SSPX Resistance?  (Read 6377 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline hollingsworth

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2842
  • Reputation: +2932/-517
  • Gender: Male
Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
« Reply #30 on: April 05, 2023, 08:45:36 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0

  • Quote
    The Resistance is resisting the non-resistance of the SSPX against the Conciliar Church.
    It is?  Furnish a few quotes from Resistance bishops to this effect.  I have not heard +W or anyone else associated with the Resistance resisting the non-resistance of sspx.  As stated earlier, +W stated categorically that sspx has  done a good work in the past, and are doing it presently.

    Offline Nadir

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 11934
    • Reputation: +7293/-500
    • Gender: Female
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #31 on: April 14, 2023, 11:42:39 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • What is the SSPX resistance? I'm new in regard to this but I've heard the term 'resistance' come up several times and am unsure on the actual details.

    Can someone give me a rundown or is there another thread that explains this that I can read up on? Thanks.
    Anthony, I just read on another thread that you are Australian and that you attend SSPX chapel. The resistance priest here in Oz is Fr Edward MacDonald and his base is in Brisbane. I haven’t met him, but am in email contact. I am sure it would be worthwhile to make contact. he would gladly add you to his list. Are you near Brisbane?
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    +RIP 2024


    Offline AnthonyPadua

    • Supporter
    • ****
    • Posts: 2433
    • Reputation: +1258/-253
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #32 on: April 15, 2023, 02:34:40 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Anthony, I just read on another thread that you are Australian and that you attend SSPX chapel. The resistance priest here in Oz is Fr Edward MacDonald and his base is in Brisbane. I haven’t met him, but am in email contact. I am sure it would be worthwhile to make contact. he would gladly add you to his list. Are you near Brisbane?
    I am not in Brisbane, though thanks for the info. There aren't much options for traditional (ordained) mass/sacraments in this country so I am glad and thankful (to God) that I have at least one option I can go to.

    If you wouldn't mind, could you private message me his contact details?

    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 9438
    • Reputation: +9241/-925
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #33 on: April 15, 2023, 10:14:33 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • And yet, these men (including the largest Trad organization ever, the SSPX) have done more good for the Catholic Church and for souls in a few hours' time than you will accomplish in your lifetime. So there's that.

    It's easy to talk smack. At least when priests/bishops duke it out in public you have two men who have given their lives for Christ disagreeing about a disputed matter. It really slays me, though, when armchair theologian laymen presume to judge men who have given their *all* for the cause of Jesus Christ and the salvation of souls.

    I'm sorry, but even if you were a member of a Third Order you'd still fall far short of the complete donation of self that being a priest entails.

    These priests have voted with their LIVES. In the game of life, they went ALL-IN. Let's at least acknowledge that fact. Could they be wrong, and you right, about this one issue? Maybe. But they earned the right to choose which Missale to use, which organization/bishop should be trusted, etc.

    These priests need more guts to go out in public for 2 hours (dressed in full clerical garb as they are) than most of us are required to have over a months' time. These men witness to the Faith 24/7. And not just in nice conservative or Catholic parts of the country. Places like New York. And in all times, too, such as the early 2000's when the "clerical abuse scandals" were front-and-center in the media cycle.

    So you'll excuse me for trusting these bishops and priests, whose biographies read like the lives of saintly missionary priests of old, rather than the opinion of some rando on an Internet forum.
    So in the 1962 Holy Week, do you genuflect for the conversion of the jews, like the rest of the SSPX?  :popcorn:


    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 9438
    • Reputation: +9241/-925
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #34 on: April 15, 2023, 10:17:35 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Yes, it's bad.
    Why?  Because it represents Bugnini's masonic prototype for de-sacralizing the Tridentine Mass by butchering the liturgy of the Church's most Holy Week.  What was left of the traditional Church did not resist it.
    Which contributed to the eventual substitution of the Tridentine Mass with the Novus ordo missae.
    The 1962 Missal represents part of newChurch's "slow-boil" conspiracy, as endorsed by the jєω-pope, Paul VI.
    Therefore, +ABL, the neo-SSPX and the "resistance" Bishop Williamson were, and remain wrong in embracing and promoting the 1962 Missal.


    This is hysterical baloney!!

    Baloney?  Are you saying Bugnini was not involved in the Holy Week changes?
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi


    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 9438
    • Reputation: +9241/-925
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #35 on: April 15, 2023, 10:39:40 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • It is?  Furnish a few quotes from Resistance bishops to this effect.  I have not heard +W or anyone else associated with the Resistance resisting the non-resistance of sspx.  As stated earlier, +W stated categorically that sspx has  done a good work in the past, and are doing it presently.

    At the time of his expulsion, +W said he couldn't organize a 2nd SSPX, because he didn't have the authority. And even and if he tried to, the jews would infiltrate it.:laugh1:   In 2012, he effectively threw the towel-in on an active, functional SSPX Resistance.

    HE's "Resistance" didn't form an organization to aggressively recruit and educate seminarians, to assist and reassign defecting neo-SSPX priests or to assist priests at independent chapels.  The SSPX ate these vulnerable chapels for lunch.

    With HE's Resistance, we get his EC's and few ordained men per year.
    That's all Bishop Williamson represents, a passive resistance. 

    But as Orestes said, the Traditional Catholic resistance doesn't depend on titular SSPX Resistance leader to survive.
    It is organic and has been carrying on since before +ABL.
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline TheRealMcCoy

    • Supporter
    • ***
    • Posts: 1437
    • Reputation: +1076/-227
    • Gender: Female
    • The Thread Killer
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #36 on: April 15, 2023, 10:46:44 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • So in the 1962 Holy Week, do you genuflect for the conversion of the Jєωs, like the rest of the SSPX?  :popcorn:




    Isn't it awkward to go to an SSPX chapel on Good Friday and not genuflect for the conversion of the Joos? 

    Offline Nadir

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 11934
    • Reputation: +7293/-500
    • Gender: Female
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #37 on: April 15, 2023, 10:58:19 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Isn't it awkward to go to an SSPX chapel on Good Friday and not genuflect for the conversion of the Joos?
    You can’t be serious! Wasn’t it awkward for Our Lord Jesus to hang on the Cross while the spectators mocked and jeered?
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    +RIP 2024


    Offline SeanJohnson

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15060
    • Reputation: +10006/-3163
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #38 on: April 16, 2023, 05:44:56 AM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Isn't it awkward to go to an SSPX chapel on Good Friday and not genuflect for the conversion of the Joos?

    Sure, it’s a little awkward, being the only guy in the chapel with the courage not to genuflect, but you get used to it (the obvious solution/preference is to watch the traditional Holy Week Good Friday online where everyone remains standing). 

    But it shouldn’t be forgotten that the rubrics don’t pertain to the faithful; technically, you can take whatever posture you want, whenever you want.

    Remaining standing later disposed me to chuck the experimental transitional abrogated Bugnini rites altogether, and also disposed me to resist our priest’s changes to the postures of the faithful during sung Mass when they came a few years later (standing when the priest ascends the altar; standing when he is incensed; standing through the Sanctus; standing through the Agnus Dei; etc).  Now I’m one of only 3-4 people of 550 who have retained the postures we used for the first 40 years of our chapel.

    Add to that the congregational singing (ie., the new postures were to encourage this), dialogue Masses, and schola flapping in the center aisle, and the changes brought in by our Class of 2009 priests (we’ve had 3 of LeRoux’s initial class in the last 10 years) really add up.

    You lose what you don’t fight to retain.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Marulus Fidelis

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 750
    • Reputation: +403/-122
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #39 on: April 16, 2023, 07:32:40 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Sure, it’s a little awkward, being the only guy in the chapel with the courage not to genuflect, but you get used to it (the obvious solution/preference is to watch the traditional Holy Week Good Friday online where everyone remains standing). 

    But it shouldn’t be forgotten that the rubrics don’t pertain to the faithful; technically, you can take whatever posture you want, whenever you want.

    Remaining standing later disposed me to chuck the experimental transitional abrogated Bugnini rites altogether, and also disposed me to resist our priest’s changes to the postures of the faithful during sung Mass when they came a few years later (standing when the priest ascends the altar; standing when he is incensed; standing through the Sanctus; standing through the Agnus Dei; etc).  Now I’m one of only 3-4 people of 550 who have retained the postures we used for the first 40 years of our chapel.

    Add to that the congregational singing (ie., the new postures were to encourage this), dialogue Masses, and schola flapping in the center aisle, and the changes brought in by our Class of 2009 priests (we’ve had 3 of LeRoux’s initial class in the last 10 years) really add up.

    You lose what you don’t fight to retain.
    We at our chapel literally stand up only to immediately sit down at one point. We also stand for the Sanctus and Agnus and I always found that quite annoying.

    Interestingly enough, today the priest read the Gospel and Epistle in Latin for the first time! And he read them in our native tongue before the homily. I wonder what prompted the change and whether it will stick, I sure hope it does.

    Offline Matthew

    • Mod
    • *****
    • Posts: 32983
    • Reputation: +29303/-598
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #40 on: April 16, 2023, 07:38:04 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Interestingly enough, today the priest read the Gospel and Epistle in Latin for the first time! And he read them in our native tongue before the homily. I wonder what prompted the change and whether it will stick, I sure hope it does.

    What?

    The priest always reads the Gospel and Epistle in Latin. Sedevacantist, pre-1955, 1962, Indult, you name it. 

    And then it will be read to the people in English before the sermon/homily, at least on Sundays. It depends on the priest. That part is optional.

    The only priests who DON'T read these in Latin are the Novus Ordo priests.
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    My accounts (Paypal, Venmo) have been (((shut down))) PM me for how to donate and keep the forum going.


    Offline SeanJohnson

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15060
    • Reputation: +10006/-3163
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #41 on: April 16, 2023, 07:42:30 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • What?

    The priest always reads the Gospel and Epistle in Latin. Sedevacantist, pre-1955, 1962, Indult, you name it.

    And then it will be read to the people in English before the sermon/homily, at least on Sundays. It depends on the priest. That part is optional.

    The only priests who DON'T read these in Latin are the Novus Ordo priests.

    I’m guessing he is in France, where, in certain areas of the country, surprisingly (or perhaps not), the SSPX has only read the gospel and epistle -at the altar- in the vernacular…for decades.

    The French latched onto the modernist liturgical movement early on, and hence their clinging to practices like this (or dialogue Masses, or the Pian Holy Week, or flappers, congregational singing, etc) pass as “traditional,” on the basis of their preconciliar or pre-Novus Ordo origin.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Matthew

    • Mod
    • *****
    • Posts: 32983
    • Reputation: +29303/-598
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #42 on: April 16, 2023, 08:18:54 AM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!0

  • The French latched onto the modernist liturgical movement early on, and hence their clinging to practices like this (or dialogue Masses, or the Pian Holy Week, or flappers, congregational singing, etc) pass as “traditional,” on the basis of their preconciliar or pre-Novus Ordo origin.

    If the whole congregation of the Faithful adding melody to their centuries-old Latin prayers in worship of the True God is Modernist, then BRING ON THE MODERNISM. THE MORE THE BETTER!

    "He who sings prays twice".
    Want to say "thank you"? 
    You can send me a gift from my Amazon wishlist!
    https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

    My accounts (Paypal, Venmo) have been (((shut down))) PM me for how to donate and keep the forum going.

    Offline Kazimierz

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 7697
    • Reputation: +3926/-89
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #43 on: April 16, 2023, 12:29:17 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Having studied the Catholic Mass and having been subjected to the study of the conciliar Luther Mass of Pius VI, and this is what feels like an I’ve age ago, what the 62 Missal - with the Second Confiteor - would’ve a stArting point for a greater restoration. Alas with neoSSPX I cannot see them doing the pre1955 Holy Week, as one example. They are too far gone for that. 
    Our mission chapel gets indulterers from the Fssp time and again because Mass is not offered Sunday here. Dialogue Mass-ism has made some inroads, and hoi poloi singing is encouraged, at least for English hymns. I pray I have done my best with Latin hymns at the offertory and Communion, keeping in mind silence must outweigh constant music, even if it is good; Mozart, Byrd, Elgar, Bruckner, Schubert, Gonoud and the like. 

    It is those who join in to chant/sing who have not practiced or do so unexpectedly, they are a concern. The schola does not sing much as we have but a few High sung Masses a year. Numbers are too few. The regular choir is two people, ole Kaz the Polish bass bear, and a young lady of Polish ethnicity who has a beautiful soprano voice. 

    As for postures, I have difficulty kneeling because of the tight squeeze of the pews. If I go down I will remain down. genuflections are replaced with deep reverent bows. Being a very large and tall Kaz Polish pickle restricts movement in the pew.:smirk:
    Thankfully I occupy the last pew on the right hand side and adopt furthest to the right so I am not obstructing anyone. Thus no kneeling for dem bad ole perfidious jujubes at Good Friday, even though the Missal used sticks with the pre1955 oration. Haven’t figured that out yet.

    At least there is no flapping……
    Da pacem Domine in diebus nostris
    Qui non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi  tu Deus noster

    Offline Incredulous

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 9438
    • Reputation: +9241/-925
    • Gender: Male
    Re: What is SSPX Resistance?
    « Reply #44 on: April 16, 2023, 12:40:22 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Having studied the Catholic Mass and having been subjected to the study of the conciliar Luther Mass of Pius VI, and this is what feels like an I’ve age ago, what the 62 Missal - with the Second Confiteor - would’ve a stArting point for a greater restoration. Alas with neoSSPX I cannot see them doing the pre1955 Holy Week, as one example. They are too far gone for that.
    Our mission chapel gets indulterers from the Fssp time and again because Mass is not offered Sunday here. Dialogue Mass-ism has made some inroads, and hoi poloi singing is encouraged, at least for English hymns. I pray I have done my best with Latin hymns at the offertory and Communion, keeping in mind silence must outweigh constant music, even if it is good; Mozart, Byrd, Elgar, Bruckner, Schubert, Gonoud and the like.

    It is those who join in to chant/sing who have not practiced or do so unexpectedly, they are a concern. The schola does not sing much as we have but a few High sung Masses a year. Numbers are too few. The regular choir is two people, ole Kaz the Polish bass bear, and a young lady of Polish ethnicity who has a beautiful soprano voice.

    As for postures, I have difficulty kneeling because of the tight squeeze of the pews. If I go down I will remain down. genuflections are replaced with deep reverent bows. Being a very large and tall Kaz Polish pickle restricts movement in the pew.:smirk:
    Thankfully I occupy the last pew on the right hand side and adopt furthest to the right so I am not obstructing anyone. Thus no kneeling for dem bad ole perfidious jujubes at Good Friday, even though the Missal used sticks with the pre1955 oration. Haven’t figured that out yet.

    At least there is no flapping……

    Kaz,
    Suggest you continue to stay kneeling,
    but when it's time to genuflect for those who mocked Our Lord with genuflections, just put do a facepalm :facepalm:  
    The meaning will be the same as if you did
    n't genuflect.

    :laugh1:
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi