Quote from: PereJoseph

It's more worthy of consideration than some rah-rah US nativist nonsense.  Either the US is a melting pot or it's a country for and by Anglo-Germanic people exclusively.

It's for the people who live here and who constitute the core ethnicity to determine who comes here.  That's a universal principle of self-determination.

Core ethnicity, eh ?  Which one is that ?  Where is the list of "universal principles" ?  Now you are beginning to sound like Woodrow Wilson.

This is just another dumb comment.  Either it's this or that?  Who said?

Logical consistency said.

It's the legitimate right of the people who have lived here, whose ancestors built the country to decide what they want and to act within their rights and power to that end.

Then I guess the Mexicans get to decide what language is spoken and the parasitic Anglophone United Statesians don't, since the Mexicans are the only thing close to the core ethnicity in Southern California and they built it, whereas the Yankees have contributed very little to the land and have actually, more or less, destroyed it.  Unless you think that a people need not have any bond whatsoever with the land they are living on, and that they can treat it as hostile and ruin it as much as they want and still claim it as their own, even if they are interlopers on it themselves, I don't see how you can really say that the English-speakers "built Southern California."  It looks more like rude exploitation to me.  Besides, the English-speakers are not a single ethnicity and therefore lose on that front.  And for the record, I dissent from your use of "rights" language and your implication that there are universal human rights of any kind.

We all know what your response is going to that is going to be: everyone but Americans have rights.

Outside of their narrow strip of land, United-Statesians are part of an imperial venture.  In a struggle for solidification of a conquest, nobody gets to complain when their victims don't surrender.  That's how the game works.  Sorry if you were expecting the rules to apply to one side but not the other.  The US gained most of its current claimed land through aggression and invasive settlement; they therefore have no moral power to complain when others do the same back to them.  As for the Mexicans in California -- they're not even pursuing invasive settlement aggressively, they're simply re-settling in the lands of their ancestors, which currently are occupied by an imperial régime and its migrant industrial and agricultural workers and/or colonists.  They are committing no crime by not wishing to join the régime that invaded and partaking in the mentality and camaraderie and culture of the colonists.

Very well, you ally yourself with the naked aggression of foreigners who have absolutely no respect for this country or its national sovereignty.

I ally myself with order and law being brought to North America; you are right, I do have no respect for the mythos of the United States and its propaganda narratives.  I respect it as being given legitimate authority in the places where it has been given authority, but I also think that God gave it this as a harsh punishment of the human race.  The Anglo-American Establishment of the past two hundred years has been the scourge of Christendom, the purifying fire of servitude and destruction. Being from one of the pre-imperial autochthonous peoples myself, I have nothing but sympathy for the Mexicans and encourage them to not let their children learn English if they can tough it out.

In that sense you're right in lock-step with the Jews.

I am on the side of Christendom and against the destruction of morals, the spread of dissorder and falsehood, and the ruination of God's creation.  The United States and its associated English-speaking bureaucrats and colonists are a force for the destruction of morality, the destruction of order, the spread of falsehood, the spread of the love of riches, and the devastation of God's creation.  So, you tell me who advances the Jews' agenda better.  As far as what the Jews themselves think, it seems like very few of them would not count the US as their greatest ally and weapon.

Of course, the bottom line is that you don't recognize anything American as having legitimacy...

What does that term mean if you really analyze it -- "American" ?  It seems to have about as much accuracy and meaning as "civilisation," that is to say, it is a corruption of language.  I don't share the ideology of those who use either word in the way you and Man of the West do, so you will have to be more precise.  If you think that I am going to cowtow to English nationalist myths, or English ideology, or the Enlightenment, or the public school propaganda of the US government, then you should think again.

...that is simply hatred of America and a disregard for its rights, which is the default mode of PC leftists and those on the right who think it gives them some sort of credibility to bash America

Well, I can assure you that I am not intellectually indebted in any way to political correctness.  Likewise, I don't need to use and do not use political correctness to help my case.

The 'Anglo' ( of which there really is No Such Thing) populations of the world( regardless of their physical location) are no different than the pagan v2 anti-church worshipping Mexicans of today. America belongs to neither of them.

nadieimportante said:
I was there with those "bad accent" English sermons, I said they were unintelligble.  If they are unintelligible, they can't be understood, just the same as Spanish to you. There is no difference unintelligible is unintelligble.  

tele reponded: That's a ridiculous statement.  You have zero credibility in saying that. Some priests need to speak better English, but by and large they can be understood.  Saying Australian priests can't be understood - I don't buy it.  Also, it's the responsiblity of older folks to get hearing aids.  

nadie responds:
I speak two languages. I made a living working with overseas clients, and traveling all over the world. If I say I find it excruciating to listen to a "bad accent in English" sermon, I think I know what I am saying.  Saying I have zero credibility for saying that, just highlights to me that you are a young hothead, with zero experience in life. You should really learn to control your childish outbursts.


nadie said: They do hear the sermon in English, so what are you complaining about? The sermon is done in English every Sunday, and then one one Sunday it is ALSO done in Spanish.


tele responds: Another ridiculous statement, saying that every Sunday excludes 25% of Sundays.

Nadie responds: - Your math is wrong. It shows me that you did not understand what I've said 5 or more times.

According to how it was explained, the parishioners received the sermon in English every Sunday, that's 100% sermons in English HEARD. Then in addition, on one Sunday, the sermon which was read in English, was repeated, but in Spanish for those that do not understand English. Do you understand now?


tele wrote:
I don't object to foreigners expecting me to speak their language in their lands.  It really is common sense.  People who cannot adapt to living here can remain in their ethnic communities and ethnic churches.

Nadie respond: Wow, what an childish comment. They're SSPXers, they're lucky if they have AN SSPX MASS within 500 miles. Have you ever been to a foreign country and had to speak the language? If they treated you the same way that you speak here, you'd be crying in the streets.

nadie wrote:
Take educated Americans and move them to Poland and not one will learn Polish. Comparitively speaking it is amazing how an illiterate in Spanish, Mexican peon, can come to the USA and learn English, which they ultimately do.  


tele responds: Polish is a very difficult language.  

Nadie asks: and English is not? You should really stick to a subject that you know something about. You are a very difficult person, set in your ways.
Even though you are like 32, "eres un viejo de calzoncillos largo" ( you are an old man set in his ways, that still wears long john underwear). You need to find yourself a nice Spanish beauty to soften your sharp edges.

I speak two languages. I made a living working with overseas clients, and traveling all over the world. If I say I find it excruciating to listen to a "bad accent in English" sermon, I think I know what I am saying.  Saying I have zero credibility for saying that, just highlights to me that you are a young hothead, with zero experience in life. You should really learn to control your childish outbursts.

No Nadie, you just have no credibility in saying that a bad accent English sermon is equivalent to a foreign language sermon.  The fact that you resort to attacking me personally just shows that you know what you're saying is ridiculous.  Well sticking out your chest doesn't make your being ridiculous any less ridiculous.  And are you suggesting that the English sermons at this particular parish were not comprehensible compared to the Spanish?  You see you're just talking irrelevant hot air.

Nadie responds: - Your math is wrong. It shows me that you did not understand what I've said 5 or more times.

LOL.  Okay.  Let me guess, you sell people things saying they will have something "every month" then later you concede "except for three times a year" and then you get indignant when they suggest you're not being straight.  I suppose with enough chutzpah that technique works.

According to how it was explained,

No, that's not how it was explained.

There are so many wasp-influenced/ neo-cons in the SSPX (US), at least where I live, it gets annoying. Fr. Hawker (of the Arcadia Priory) set up a once-a-month Spanish sermon to meet the needs of the Mexican and other Latino Catholics in the Colton, CA chapel (St. Joesph and IHM Chapel). During his sermon, a large majority of the (anglos) 'influential' families got up and left in disgust. This is why my family left our local SSPX chapels.

the parishioners received the sermon in English every Sunday, that's 100% sermons in English HEARD.

And yet you're still clinging to the argument that bad accent English is equivalent to Spanish, because it's apparent you were arguing the situation where Spanish is substituted for English.  You must be very practiced at the bait and switch.  Seems to be a common technique among certain "Catholics."  Indeed I can see the appeal of Feeneyism to certain Romance language speakers.

Then in addition, on one Sunday, the sermon which was read in English, was repeated, but in Spanish for those that do not understand English. Do you understand now?

Perhaps that was the case, but frankly I don't believe an SSPX chapel would have two half-hour sermons the same day.

Nadie respond: Wow, what an childish comment.

Not submitting to the demands of your ethnicity is not childish.

They're SSPXers, they're lucky if they have AN SSPX MASS within 500 miles. Have you ever been to a foreign country and had to speak the language? If they treated you the same way that you speak here, you'd be crying in the streets.

I have a feeling that the way you act is far more likely to leave people dying in the streets than the way act.  I would say that because if I go to Latin America I am far more likely to find people dying in the streets, whereas in this country, Latins know they can be taken care of by the beneficence of the American golden goose that is based on the productive capacity of Europeans.

Nadie asks: and English is not? You should really stick to a subject that you know something about.

Pfffft.  More huffing and puffing.  It's clear what sort of insulting arrogance and insolence is typical of your type of people.  Which is why their migration should be tightly controlled.

nadie said:
Then in addition, on one Sunday, the sermon which was read in English, was repeated, but in Spanish for those that do not understand English. Do you understand now?

Tele responded:
Perhaps that was the case, but frankly I don't believe an SSPX chapel would have two half-hour sermons the same day.

Nadie responds: sermons don't have to be 30 minutes. AND I've seen the sermons done in English and Spanish as I described, at the SSPX chapel in Miami, The Shrine of St. Philomena, that they took over after the death of Fr. Hopkins. And I'm told that Fr. Hopkins did the sermon in English, Haitian creole and Spanish, and he was an Englishmen!

When I saw it, a French priest did the sermon in English, and another French priest did the same sermon in Spanish. He translated from English directly as he did the sermon, quite a feat. Few peole could do that. He later did the burial service in Latin and explained translated some in English and Spanish. His Spanish was perfect and his English very good. So, that SSPX priest spoke three languages (at least) perfectly, and Latin of course. Very common for Europeans.


 

nadie said:
They're SSPXers, they're lucky if they have AN SSPX MASS within 500 miles. Have you ever been to a foreign country and had to speak the language? If they treated you the same way that you speak here, you'd be crying in the streets.


tele responded; I have a feeling that the way you act is far more likely to leave people dying in the streets than the way act.  I would say that because if I go to Latin America I am far more likely to find people dying in the streets,

nadie responds: What are you talking about by saying dying in the streets? I said crying in the streets.


tele wrote:
whereas in this country, Latins know they can be taken care of by the beneficence of the American golden goose that is based on the productive capacity of Europeans.  
It's clear what sort of insulting arrogance and insolence is typical of your type of people.  Which is why their migration should be tightly controlled.

nadie responds: Spaniards are not European to you? To you Latin Americans from Spain, Portugal, France, Italy and Germany are not Europeans? Argentina has a higher percentage of Europeans than the USA or Canada.
Do you just have a problem with those of Indian and African blood?

...first generation immigrant American citizen, educated here, that came from Latin America, or am I...

And are you a United States citizen legally entitled to stay here?

Nadie- we may not agree on ... the unmentionable issue.. but this is very good! Perhaps this explains the sentiment of Tele and Graham very well.....! In the end, it doesn't matter, they lose with attitudes like that.

Lose what?  What is there to lose really?  I wouldn't be the one walking out of Church in the middle of mass, but I wouldn't be the one no longer going to Church either.

There's a point where you have to stand your ground against people who are looking to take offense.