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Author Topic: US SSPX Ordinations  (Read 4318 times)

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Offline Minnesota

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Re: US SSPX Ordinations
« Reply #30 on: June 24, 2023, 02:27:41 PM »
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  • Even then, when you have like 10 - 20 percent on average making it to ordination, one could claim that it's do to the "rigor" of the formation, but IMO there's long been something amiss at SSPX that way.  Many of those whom you could bet on making it through to ordination end up getting worked out.  I could go into theories at length about various reasons many promising young prospective priests got weeded out, but I'll just write briefly about the case of my younger brother Steve (God rest his soul).  He was in that class of '96 and was a very solid seminarian.  Although I was 5 years older, Steve was just 1 year behind me, since I had gone to Loyola University Chicago and gotten my degree in 3 years, whereas he entered right after High School.  We became Traditional Catholics during my first year at college.  In any case, Steve made it through 4 years, received all the Minor Orders, etc. and there were no issues.  During the Summer after his 4th year, he went on a retreat.  During the retreat, he mentioned to a spiritual director some issues he had with one Father Carlos Urrutigoity.  Steve felt that Urrutigoity was a Modernist, and he expressed some concerns along those lines to the spiritual director.  Although spiritual direction is secondarily covered by the seal of Confession, this director spilled the beans back to the seminary staff about what Steve had said about Father Urrutigoity.  Steve was right of course, and I had made similar complaints (openly) to Father Bourmaud (God rest his soul also) and others, and Father Bourmaud actually backed me up.  In any case, as a result of Steve's complaints, he was consigned to a year at St. Mary's, and he had such a terrible experience there, and also felt like they were giving him the runaround and got the impression they'd never ordain him, but just use him to work at St. Mary's as long as they could get away with it ... and so he left, dejected.
    That's awful. If you're any indicator, he would've made an excellent priest.
    Christ is Risen! He is risen indeed

    Offline ElwinRansom1970

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #31 on: June 24, 2023, 09:27:34 PM »
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  • Of the 4, of course, one was the infamous Eric Ensey.  I don't think Ensey was part of the original 1989 entering class, but transferred in somehow (not sure of where he came from).
    Ensey did his formation at Ecône. I first met him there when I attended the 1994 ordinations at the Seminaire Internationale St. Pie X at which he was ordained to the diaconate.
    "I distrust every idea that does not seem obsolete and grotesque to my contemporaries."
    Nicolás Gómez Dávila


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #32 on: June 25, 2023, 11:08:12 AM »
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  • Ensey did his formation at Ecône. I first met him there when I attended the 1994 ordinations at the Seminaire Internationale St. Pie X at which he was ordained to the diaconate.

    Hmmm.  OK.  I knew that he appeared there at some point, I think in 1992 or 1993.  It's highly unusual for someone to start out at Econe and then move out to a different seminary.  It's almost always the other way around, where someone would start in some other seminary, and then move to Econe in their 4th or 5th year.

    I started in the Fall of 1989 and went through early 1991 before leaving on account of SVism.  Then I came back during the Fall of 1992 and Ensey had appeared there as part of that class ... though I had slid back a couple years myself due to the time I was gone.

    Offline ElwinRansom1970

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #33 on: June 25, 2023, 12:27:20 PM »
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  • Hmmm.  OK.  I knew that he appeared there at some point, I think in 1992 or 1993.  It's highly unusual for someone to start out at Econe and then move out to a different seminary.  It's almost always the other way around, where someone would start in some other seminary, and then move to Econe in their 4th or 5th year.

    I started in the Fall of 1989 and went through early 1991 before leaving on account of SVism.  Then I came back during the Fall of 1992 and Ensey had appeared there as part of that class ... though I had slid back a couple years myself due to the time I was gone.
    Yes, the order of formation sites is very peculiar with Ensey.

    I am very grateful to Ensey however for helping me to negotiate what can be the overwhelming idiosyncrasies of Ecône for the few days that I was there.
    "I distrust every idea that does not seem obsolete and grotesque to my contemporaries."
    Nicolás Gómez Dávila

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #34 on: June 25, 2023, 02:50:18 PM »
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  • Yes, the order of formation sites is very peculiar with Ensey.

    I am very grateful to Ensey however for helping me to negotiate what can be the overwhelming idiosyncrasies of Ecône for the few days that I was there.

    I can only imagine.  One of the more amusing stories from STAS was that there was something in the seminary rule about taking a shower once per week, and then also potentially if you were perspiring from some heavy activity.  Most of us considered it a great mortification to take a shower once a week.  After about several weeks, however, Bishop Williamson got wind of this and announced during his afternoon spiritual conference that people misunderstood this rule and that it was for the French, that "You have to understand the French."  It meant that seminarians had to shower AT LEAST once per week (and then as needed).  Nobody in the US could understand why there had to be a rule to that effect, so we all interpreted it in the reverse, that we should NOT shower MORE than once per week.  After the conference and after dinner, the showers were running pretty much non-stop until Compline.


    Offline SimpleMan

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #35 on: June 25, 2023, 04:42:04 PM »
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  • I can only imagine.  One of the more amusing stories from STAS was that there was something in the seminary rule about taking a shower once per week, and then also potentially if you were perspiring from some heavy activity.  Most of us considered it a great mortification to take a shower once a week.  After about several weeks, however, Bishop Williamson got wind of this and announced during his afternoon spiritual conference that people misunderstood this rule and that it was for the French, that "You have to understand the French."  It meant that seminarians had to shower AT LEAST once per week (and then as needed).  Nobody in the US could understand why there had to be a rule to that effect, so we all interpreted it in the reverse, that we should NOT shower MORE than once per week.  After the conference and after dinner, the showers were running pretty much non-stop until Compline.

    I actually heard this as well, from a former STAS seminarian.  Evidently he misunderstood Bishop Williamson too.  He thought it sounded pretty crazy.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #36 on: June 25, 2023, 06:37:24 PM »
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  • I actually heard this as well, from a former STAS seminarian.  Evidently he misunderstood Bishop Williamson too.  He thought it sounded pretty crazy.

    Well, it wasn't Bishop Williamson who was misunderstood.  +Williamson was actually clarifying something in the Rule of the Seminary that was being misunderstood.

    Offline ElwinRansom1970

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #37 on: June 25, 2023, 08:07:59 PM »
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  • I can only imagine.  One of the more amusing stories from STAS was that there was something in the seminary rule about taking a shower once per week, and then also potentially if you were perspiring from some heavy activity.  Most of us considered it a great mortification to take a shower once a week.  After about several weeks, however, Bishop Williamson got wind of this and announced during his afternoon spiritual conference that people misunderstood this rule and that it was for the French, that "You have to understand the French."  It meant that seminarians had to shower AT LEAST once per week (and then as needed).  Nobody in the US could understand why there had to be a rule to that effect, so we all interpreted it in the reverse, that we should NOT shower MORE than once per week.  After the conference and after dinner, the showers were running pretty much non-stop until Compline.
    I still tell people about this!

    Ecône smelled...real bad!
    "I distrust every idea that does not seem obsolete and grotesque to my contemporaries."
    Nicolás Gómez Dávila


    Offline SimpleMan

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #38 on: June 25, 2023, 11:10:25 PM »
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  • I can only imagine.  One of the more amusing stories from STAS was that there was something in the seminary rule about taking a shower once per week, and then also potentially if you were perspiring from some heavy activity.  Most of us considered it a great mortification to take a shower once a week.  After about several weeks, however, Bishop Williamson got wind of this...

    Unintentional pun here?

    Offline Francisco

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #39 on: June 30, 2023, 12:57:24 AM »
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  • The retreats for the priestly ordinations this year and the diaconal ones of last year were both preached by the black wonder boy of the SSPX, the Rev. Xavier of India, who despite being a priest for barely 10 years holds the SSPX Golden Pass - to do pretty much what he pleases and seems to be answerable only to Menzingen (Or perhaps it's the other way around!).

    Offline Francisco

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #40 on: June 30, 2023, 01:00:59 AM »
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  •  I wonder about the quality of the formation, not the quantity.
    I'll tell you for free. Since the departure of Bishop Williamson as Rector, worldly priests, eminently suitable for the Novus Ordo.


    Offline trento

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #41 on: June 30, 2023, 01:51:42 AM »
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  • I'll tell you for free. Since the departure of Bishop Williamson as Rector, worldly priests, eminently suitable for the Novus Ordo.
    This is an exaggeration. There have been problematic priests even during Bishop Williamson's time as rector.

    Offline ElwinRansom1970

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #42 on: June 30, 2023, 05:59:29 AM »
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  • This is an exaggeration. There have been problematic priests even during Bishop Williamson's time as rector.
    Carlos Urrutigoity
    "I distrust every idea that does not seem obsolete and grotesque to my contemporaries."
    Nicolás Gómez Dávila

    Offline Croagh Patrick

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    Re: US SSPX Ordinations
    « Reply #43 on: June 30, 2023, 08:06:15 AM »
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  • If you go to this 22 year-old issue of Verbum (ie., the seminary’s newspaper), and scroll down to the article on the “Turkey Bowl,” I’m in a few pics there.

    https://stas.org/sites/sspx/files/v084_win2002.pdf

    Ahh, to be young again…
    I see my brother there also Sean!