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Author Topic: Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer  (Read 3259 times)

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Offline SeanGovan

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  • Concerning Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer and Fr. David Hewko
    4 March 2017

    I want to preface what I am about to state that I, Tony La Rosa, speak only for myself.

     

    The last Mass I attended with either Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer or Fr. David Hewko was with Fr. David Hewko on Sunday October 25, 2015 (Feast of Christ the King).  Shortly thereafter, the Our Lady of Good Success Mission (now defunct) separated itself from these two Fathers because of the Ambrose Moran issue.  On November 7, 2015, the Fathers issued a public statement in which they declared that their association with Ambrose Moran was severed.  However, no reasons were provided.  This public statement brought relief to many of the faithful, but not to me.  It was not sufficient for me that the association was severed; rather, I wanted the Fathers to make public the reasons for the sudden disassociation after they had promoted Ambrose Moran as a bishop who would possibly help with the Our Lady of Mount Carmel seminary.  Furthermore, I wanted the Fathers to acknowledge that Ambrose Moran was a fraud.  I had suspicions that the Fathers knew that Ambrose Moran was a fraud, but that they did not want to publicly admit it; they did not want to admit that they were fooled.  With these thoughts in my head, I collaborated with Fr. Juan Ortiz in helping him write his paper called “A Theological and Canonical Study on the Case of William Edward, a.k.a. Ambrose, Moran-Dolgorouky”, published on December 19, 2015.  This paper was a first step in a potential two-step process.  The purpose of this paper was to show the Fathers (and the world) that Ambrose Moran was indeed a fraud and also a schismatic.  There was hope that by presenting solid evidence the Fathers would be either awakened to the truth of Ambrose Moran or at least pressure them to come clean.  Unfortunately, what was hoped for was not achieved.  The second step was now activated; part 2 of 2 of the paper was written called “A Theological and Canonical Study on the Case of William Edward, a.k.a. Ambrose, Moran-Dolgorouky”, published on March 17, 2016.  The purpose of this second part was to convince the priests and faithful to stop associating and attending the Masses of the Fathers on account of their involvement with a schismatic, until they publicly repented.  Many people took heed of this and stopped doing so.  The Fathers, however, did not budge.

     

    After the publication of the second part, I continued listening to the Fathers’ sermons and conferences.  I thought to myself that if the Fathers were just trying to sweep Ambrose Moran under the rug because of embarrassment, then God would stop blessing their work.  Perhaps this would take the form of the Fathers getting caught up in some other serious scandal, moving away from the position of Archbishop Lefebvre on some essential matter, or even worse, adopting grave doctrinal errors.  Another thought that came into my mind (really since the November 7, 2015 public statement) is that perhaps the Fathers were waiting for a more opportune time to re-introduce Ambrose Moran back into the picture after the backlash had settled down.  However, to this very day, the Fathers continue to publicly stand by their position that Ambrose Moran is a true Catholic bishop, but there have been no sightings of Ambrose Moran near the Fathers for well over a year; they have kept true to their public statement of disassociation.  Furthermore, and more importantly, the Fathers continue to be valiant defenders of the Archbishop’s work despite the criticism and persecution they have faced from their confreres for opposing the three Resistance bishops in their sliding away, by commission and/or omission, from the Archbishop’s work.  The Fathers have faithfully defended the Archbishop’s work by, for example, publicly and forcefully opposing attendance at the New Mass, attendance at Sedevacantist and “non una cuм” Masses, and Bishop Williamson’s errors regarding attendance at these Masses.  Furthermore, the Fathers continue to reject Vatican II wholesale and continue to maintain the red light position, which is ever so vital to the true Resistance.  What then am I to make of all this?  I have come to the conclusion that the Fathers’ past involvement with Ambrose Moran has not been a debilitating obstacle preventing them from keeping alive the work of Archbishop Lefebvre.  I cannot answer for certain why despite the fact that the Fathers have not recanted their position regarding Ambrose Moran and have not made public reparation.  I can only tell you what I have seen with my own eyes and heard with my own ears over the past year, that is, that the Fathers have shown themselves to continue to be true spiritual sons of the Archbishop.  Therefore, as I myself am a staunch defender of the Archbishop, I have decided that I will return to attending the Masses of the Fathers, if they will have me.  I am making this public statement in justice and charity because I had previously publicly and privately tried to convince others to stay away from the Fathers’ Masses.  For those of you who didn’t listen and stuck with the Fathers, time has shown in my estimation that you were right and I was wrong.  For those of you that did listen, I apologize.  I can only tell you that I did what I thought was most prudent at the time.  Perhaps the reasons I have presented for returning to the Fathers are not sufficient for you.  I am sorry if this is the case, but in the end we each have to decide for ourselves in this time of confusion in which the Church authorities are not doing their job in weeding out the wolves from the sheep.  And the mess that exists in the Resistance is not making it any easier.  I can only ask you that if you truly consider yourself a faithful follower of the Archbishop, please pay close attention to who is most keeping his memory alive and well.

     

    Finally, to Fr. Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko, I am sorry for the grief I have caused you.  I hope you will forgive me.  I will make reparation by promoting your work on the Ecclesia Militans website.
    Adversus hostem Fidei aeterna auctoritas esto! To the enemies of the Faith no quarter!

    If they refuse to be converted by the Heart of the Immaculate, then in the end they shall be


    Offline SeanGovan

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #1 on: March 05, 2017, 02:16:42 PM »
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  • He posted this on his website yesterday, March 4th. The very next post was from today, announcing Father Pfeiffer's next Mass in Ontario.
    Adversus hostem Fidei aeterna auctoritas esto! To the enemies of the Faith no quarter!

    If they refuse to be converted by the Heart of the Immaculate, then in the end they shall be


    Offline Matthew

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #2 on: March 05, 2017, 02:46:45 PM »
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  • Absolutely. Pathetic.

    A man with no principles is a pathetic sight to behold.

    Here is the real question: What does he make of the very serious other criticisms of Fr. Pfeiffer, elucidated by none other than Fr. Voigt and Fr. Chazal?

    Those priests don't go off on tangents. They stick to the worst, clear-cut problems with Fr. Pfeiffer and his organization. I tend to agree with them: Let's forego the speculation, the many unproven "possible" or "probable" problems, and the numerous side issues and minor faults, and stick with publicizing the CORE ISSUES that are undeniable.

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Open-Letter-from-Fr-Voigt-about-Boston-KY-mess

    http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php/Fr-Chazal-what-went-wrong-with-Fr-Pfeiffer

    Pablo is still there, and in a position of power no less. Fr. Pfeiffer is still ambitious and power-hungry. He has slandered Fr. Voigt, Bishop Williamson, Fr. Zendejas, and many other GOOD, HOLY, FAITHFUL PRIESTS. Fr. Pfeiffer is undisciplined, plus he is belligerent toward all 3 Resistance bishops, so his "seminary" is a joke.

    And the Ambrose debacle is still a huge issue. Fr. Pfeiffer never came clean about that. You can't PUBLICLY promote someone for months and then QUIETLY break off ties. If you truly discovered something bad (which you didn't know about before) you are obligated IN JUSTICE AND CHARITY, for the good of souls, to make a PUBLIC statement to that effect.

    The very fact that so many on CathInfo speculated that "perhaps Ambrose will be brought out again later" proves just how inconclusive Fr. Pfeiffer's "dismissal"  statement was. Fr. Pfeiffer very much left things open for a sequel. He didn't burn any bridges with Ambrose Moran. He didn't offer the first criticism of Ambrose Moran, much less any damning facts or evidence against him.

    Their reasons for breaking off with Ambrose must be as decisive and public as their constant promotion of him was for the previous 6 months!
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    Offline Matthew

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #3 on: March 05, 2017, 03:01:26 PM »
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  • Seriously. I want everyone here to stop and think about this for just ONE MINUTE, if you would be so kind.

    How many priests, during the past 5 years, have offered to work with Fr. Pfeiffer? Not very many.

    But Fr. Voigt moved to Boston, KY and worked with Fr. Pfeiffer for many months. He tried his best to "deal with" Pablo, and help out at the Seminary. He helped with the missions (Mass circuits) and everything.

    Fr. Chazal was also an early ally. When so many in the SSPX were calling Fr. Pfeiffer countless names, Fr. Chazal stood by Fr. Pfeiffer in the early Resistance.

    The words of these two priests should weigh VERY HEAVILY in any consideration of who is "in the right".

    It's easy to criticize someone. Talk and criticism are cheap. But when you were CLOSE to the individual in question, your criticism should be taken much more seriously.

    Many people might criticize a defendant in the courtroom, during a murder case. But what happens when the defendant's mother takes the stand, and says that he always was extremely violent, he killed neighbors' pets as a child, attacked his father many times during his teen years, tried to kill 3 different people in the past, etc. What jury wouldn't convict the man?

    See, Fr. Pfeiffer has trained people to accept a flippant dismissal of anyone and everyone. When they disagree with him, that's it. You're a bad guy. Doesn't matter how long or how well you supported me before, that's all gone.

    But I have never been able to do that. Not even when Bishop Fellay (and his cronies) did the very same thing!
    They told me to dismiss any long-standing SSPX supporters as Resistance trash, sedevacantists, servants of the devil, etc. just because they spoke up about problems in Bishop Fellay's SSPX.

    But I don't buy that. Someone doesn't lead an admirable Catholic life apart from the World, donating time and money to the SSPX for 3 decades, and then one fine day in 2012 they decide to give up on God and Heaven -- where they've placed all their treasure to date -- and join an evil group of discontents "just because".

    I'm sorry, but that's just stupid. I know human nature better than that.

    But anyhow, Fr. Pfeiffer is trying to pull the same nonsense. He wants people to forget how Fr. Chazal and Fr. Voigt were basically the third and fourth priests to give Fr. Pfeiffer the time of day, while the other 520 SSPX priests (and everyone else) dismissed Fr. Pfeiffer and the Resistance outright. (Sure, a half dozen other SSPX/Independent priests agreed with and were "friendly" towards Fr. Pfeiffer, but did little in the practical realm to support him)

    But today, these two priests are promoted as Bad Guys by the Pfeiffer camp, because they're not 100% "with the program" which is whatever Fr. Pfeiffer wants to do.

    Again, I call BS. That is ridiculous.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #4 on: March 05, 2017, 03:26:56 PM »
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  • When you follow orders so blindly as to go after long time supporters just because they "got on the bad side" of your Dear Leader...

    If you are prepared to forget everything good they did for your Empire, as soon as your Dear Leader issues orders to throw them in the dungeon...

    then Congratulations! You're an expendable, third-rate stormtrooper or lackey of a tyrant, a villain.

    And your Dear Leader has more in common with a comic book villain than a Catholic priest.

    Capricious changes of mood are what you'd expect from an unstable dictator, or a power-mad, megalomaniacal villain -- not a Catholic priest.

    Might as well be a comic book villain, like the bad guy in Flash Gordon. You know, he was pretty clever and shrewd as well...
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    Offline cathman7

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #5 on: March 05, 2017, 04:26:13 PM »
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  • Who cares. Let's not give Tony La Rosa a captive audience. We don't need any more lay "theologians".

    Offline Matthew

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #6 on: March 05, 2017, 04:44:03 PM »
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  • Quote from: obscurus
    Who cares. Let's not give Tony La Rosa a captive audience. We don't need any more lay "theologians".


    I agree. That's why I sat on this "news" for a full day before someone else posted it. He's not that important; just a good example of a poor, deluded, desperate Pfeifferite.

    It would be great if Tony were one of last 3 or 4 disciples of Fr. Pfeiffer -- but, unfortunately, the number of blind and desperate Trads is much greater.

    I will say this: most people with a brain have already bailed from that sinking ship. At this point, we can pretty much give up hope for those who choose to remain. Anyone who can ignore SO MANY and SUCH GREAT scandals is pretty much hopeless.
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    Offline mw2016

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #7 on: March 05, 2017, 05:57:29 PM »
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  • Personally, I am tired of people (SSPX priests, laymen, or Resistance priests) telling me where to go to Mass.

    Everyone needs to make their own decisions for their own family - that is where the rubber meets the road.

    I am tired of people pontificating on this, and then you listen, and then get burned later by their failure.

    Everyone's got their own minds and can figure out how to best obtain the Sacraments for themselves.


    Offline AlligatorDicax

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #8 on: March 05, 2017, 06:30:44 PM »
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  • Quote from: SeanGovan (Mar 05, 2017, 3:14 pm)
    [Topic: Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer]

    Concerning Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer and Fr. David Hewko
    4 March 2017

    I want to preface what I am about to state that I, Tony La Rosa, speak only for myself.

    The last Mass I attended with either Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer or Fr. David Hewko was with Fr. David Hewko on Sunday October 25, 2015 (Feast of Christ the King).

    Excuuuse me!   Thanks for creating or perpetuating so much [expletives deleted] confusion!   For those readers among us who don't have access to the SSPX Resistance game-day program, how's 'bout answering some basic questions?

    · Is "SeanGovan" the same person as "Ecclesia Militans"?
    · Is "SeanGovan" the same person as "Tony La Rosa"?
    If neither is true, why is there no obvious textual separator provided for the benefit of readers who have have been provided with no basis for figuring out who wrote what?

    · Is "SeanGovan" just a totally unrelated bystanding blabbermouth?
    · Did "SeanGovan" write everything in the original posting in this CathInfo topic?
    · Who is "Ecclesia Militans", and why should readers care?
    · So who is "Tony La Rosa", and why should readers care?

    Many readers have never been SSPX insiders, and thus not privy to whom in [expletives deleted] these names identify,  and why we should give a [expletives deleted]?

    Offline AlligatorDicax

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    Tony La Rosa (Ecclesia Militans) comes out in favor of Fr Pfeiffer
    « Reply #9 on: March 06, 2017, 09:11:03 PM »
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  • Perhaps I can leverage my complaint into some constructive critism.

    Quote from: AlligatorDicax  (Mar 05, 2017, 7:30 pm)
    Excuuuse me!   Thanks for creating or perpetuating so much [expletives deleted] confusion!  [At least for] those readers among us who [....] have never been SSPX insiders, and thus not privy to whom in [expletives deleted] these names identify,  and why we should give a [expletives deleted]?

    I'm guessing that practically all the regular C.I. readers among us realize that it's extremely important to traditionl Catholicism that the work of FSSPX as founded & developed by Abp. Lefebvre be faithfully continued, even if circuмstances regrettably require abandoning the institutional  FSSPX of  Bp. Fellay.

    Quote from: SeanGovan (Mar 05, 2017, 3:16 pm)
    He posted this on his website
    • [/color] yesterday, March 4th.
    "He" being the "Tony La Rosa" whose name on that Web site is indeed linked to the site's own page </author/ecclesia-militans/>.

    Upon further review, I suppose I should give "SeanGovan" some credit for a quick reply to himself that appears to be a belated attempt to compensate for an original posting that consisted entirely of an unsourced apparently-complete-copy of someone else's words that had been posted elsewhere (i.e., outside C.I.).

    That original posting was especially confusing when considering:
    · first-person singular pronouns in important sentences;
    · posting under an apparent personal name "SeanGovan" that was not the "Tony La Rosa" obviously meant by at least some of the first-person singular pronouns;
    · absence of any clearly presented quoting; and
    · 3-to-4-line gaps inserted between paragraphs, which an Internet-forum newbie might have somehow assumed would adequately delimit changes in authorship back-&-forth between "La Rosa" and "Govan"--whoever they are.

    C.I.'s highly worthwhile quoting feature (i.e., "[quote] .... [/quote]") just ain't that hard to use properly [×], e.g.:

    Quote
    Concerning Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer and Fr. David Hewko
    4 March 2017

    I want to preface what I am about to state that I, Tony La Rosa, speak only for myself.
    [....]
    Finally, to Fr. Pfeiffer and Fr. Hewko, I am sorry for the grief I have caused you.  I hope you will forgive me.   I will make reparation by promoting your work on the Ecclesia Militans website.
    • [/color]
    Something like the clearly delimited quoting immediately above, plus some brief text above or below the quote identifying its source, e.g., "Tony La Rosa via ecclesiamilitans"
    • [/color], would've avoided creating frustrating confusion among some C.I. readers.  Especially those among us who are trying to keep up with doings in the FSSPX Resistance, but without making nearly a life's work of memorizing all the actors, their nom(s?) de plume, their Web addresses, and their personal & ecclesiastical histories, e.g.: "Tony La Rosa" and "Ecclesia Militans"
    • .
    Quote from: SeanGovan (Mar 05, 2017, 3:16 pm)
    The very next post was from today, announcing Father Pfeiffer's next Mass in Ontario.

    Aha!   In the Canadian province named Ontario (its most populous, eh?).

    It was not at all obvious to me whether "Govan" offered his original posting as defiant admiration, or as a target for criticism & ridicule.  So I couldn't rule out its possible explanation as an odd exercise in sock-puppetry.

    -------
    Note @: The most obvious naïve domain name, except for it being a ".com".  I suppose that'll have to suffice for C.I. readers, because I fear that C.I. is configured to block|delete the exact Web address if I type it.  Owner-moderator Matthew posted 4 replies among the first 7 postings in the topic, so if he wanted to provide the offending site's Web address (e.g., so other readers could judge for themselves the original and verify the accuracy & completeness of its quoting by SeanGovan), he certainly had enough opportunities to do so.

    Note ×: Explaining how to use the C.I. quoting feature, which is simplified by a pale-gray simulated "[ Quote ]" button that works on mouse-or-pointer-selected text, even on the "Creating Topic" page, is waaay outside the scope of this reply.

    Note #: A name that I continue to confuse with that of a guy who's geographically much closer, and was banned from C.I. last year.  But that's best left for its own topic at some other time.