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Author Topic: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede  (Read 6362 times)

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Offline AJNC

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The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
« on: March 29, 2017, 11:06:34 AM »
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  • I wonder what the SSPX will make of this version of the Third Secret. I am not sure if it has ever endorsed as genuine the "Third Secret" revealed by the Modernists in Rome in 2000. The Society has an official pilgrimage to Fatima this year and I have heard that all obstacles in its path were smoothened out for them by the topmost Roman "authority".

    http://traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/g32ht_Analyst.htm


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #1 on: March 29, 2017, 10:54:35 PM »
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  • I wonder what the SSPX will make of this version of the Third Secret. I am not sure if it has ever endorsed as genuine the "Third Secret" revealed by the Modernists in Rome in 2000. The Society has an official pilgrimage to Fatima this year and I have heard that all obstacles in its path were smoothened out for them by the topmost Roman "authority".

    http://traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/g32ht_Analyst.htm
    .
    I find it odd that the key aspect of the expected Third Secret, that it must be the very words of Our Lady beginning with "In Portugal the dogma of the faith will be preserved...," is not found in this proposed version, in fact, it begins with a narration from the author (supposedly Sr. Lucia):

    Quote
    Possible Third Secret 

    Tuy September 1, 1944 or April 1, 1944 

    JMJ 

    Now I am going to reveal the third fragment of the secret: This part is the apostasy in the Church! 

    Our Lady showed us the individual who I describe as the 'holy Father' in front of a multitude that was cheering him.
    For larger photo, click here
    Quote
    But there was a difference from a true Holy Father, his devilish gaze, this one had the gaze of evil. 

    Then, after some moments we saw the same Pope entering a Church, but this Church was the Church of hell; there is no way to describe the ugliness of that place. It looked like a gray cement fortress with broken angles and windows similar to eyes; in the roof of the building it had a beak. 

    Next, we raised our eyes to Our Lady who said to us: You saw the apostasy in the Church; this letter can be opened by the Holy Father, but it must be announced after Pius XII and before 1960. 

    In the kingdom of John Paul II the cornerstone of Peter's grave must be removed and transferred to Fatima. 

    Because the dogma of the faith is not conserved in Rome, its authority will be removed and delivered to Fatima. 

    The cathedral of Rome must be destroyed and a new one built in Fatima. 

    If 69 weeks after this order is announced, Rome continues its abomination, the city will be destroyed. 

    Our Lady told us that this is written, [in] Daniel 9:24-25 and Matthew 21:42-44." (thumbprint)
     
    Also, there is no reproduction here of the original Portuguese which would be helpful since John XXIII was unsure of one particular phrase when he asked for a Portuguese translator to help to make that colloquial "turn of phrase" more certain.  Which phrase was that, in the version above?
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.


    Offline mw2016

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #2 on: March 30, 2017, 03:25:45 PM »
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  • That's a brand new post by Dr. Horvat on March 27th. You should paste the entire thing here.

    Offline BumphreyHogart

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #3 on: March 30, 2017, 05:56:12 PM »
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  • I think it is quite clear it is sede merely from the historical facts. The fact that it was demanding to be opened after Pius XII and before Vatican II opened, is a pretty huge tip.

    But even more so from Lucy herself. She, at 10 years-old, actually viewed hell, yet when she had to write about the 3rd secret more than once, she said it was SO awful, she couldn't bear thinking about writing it down. We've had popes tortured and martyred before in history, which is hardly too difficult to take. It must be something unprecedented in history, and terrible for the Church.

    Don't we all know that among all those who dread Vatican II, there are those who DREAD sedevacantism as much as Lucy dreaded the 3rd secret. I find that parallel striking.

    "there can be no holiness where there is disagreement with the pope" - Pope St. Pius X

    Today, only Catholics holding the sedevacantist position are free from the anguish entailed by this truth.

    Offline compline

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #4 on: March 30, 2017, 05:58:34 PM »
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  • The fact that the letter so casually name-drops John Paul II is a huge red flag. Give me a break.


    Offline josefamenendez

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #5 on: March 30, 2017, 07:37:20 PM »
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  • Interesting......
    All I know is that 3 years ago I was walking down the aisle after Communion,and lifted my head and saw it- the picture of Bergoglio on the back wall of the Church!  I jumped- I was so taken aback- by his eyes. It was frightening! :o
    I'm glad I'm going somewhere now that doesn't have that scary picture.

    Online Nadir

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #6 on: March 30, 2017, 08:51:24 PM »
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  • That's a brand new post by Dr. Horvat on March 27th. You should paste the entire thing here.
    Our ‘Third Secret’ Was Written by Sr. Lucy, 
    Handwriting Expert Affirms
    Marian T. Horvat, Ph.D.
    TIA has received news from several readers about a recently published book by José María Zavala titled El Tercer Sécreto de Fátima (The Third Secret of Fatima). Since it was reported to have news about the Third Secret TIA published seven years ago on this site, I purchased the electronic version in Spanish and read it. 

    Most of the book rambles about, repeating the Socci theory of a supposed “4th Secret” (never very convincing to me) and the quite credible theme Fatima readers are familiar with: The bogus Third Secret with "a bishop in white" that Cardinals Sodano and Ratzinger released in 2000 was to hide the real Secret and, as then-Card. Ratzinger firmly stated, to close the history of the Fatima revelations and end any further speculations.


    Zavala's book has one important fact to add to the Fatima discussion: confirmation of the handwriting of this 3rd Secret
    [color][size][font]
    But the speculations continued. Many Fatima experts and devotees – like us – have refused to accept this farce. Why? Because the Vatican-revealed secret included nothing about an apostasy in the Church that was reported by credible sources to be in the message: e.g. Cardinal Oddi, who said it regards “a revolution in the Church;” Cardinal Ciappi, who said it spoke of an apostasy that begins "at the top," JPII, who stated in Fulda in 1980 that it involved a catastrophe where millions would die, Fr. Malachi Martin, who said it was something that would frighten people and fill the confessionals, and even Card. Ratzinger, who in 1984 affirmed the secret was a prophecy and spoke of the dangers threatening the faith. 

    Further, the lengthy story released by Sodano and Ratzinger contradicts the words of Cardinal Ottaviani, Bishop Venancio, Canon Barthas and others who clearly stated that the Third Secret was written by Sr. Lucy on a single piece of paper, with about 25 lines of text. 

    Finally, the Vatican-released Secret had nothing to do with Portugal conserving the dogma of the faith, the final words of the Second Secret, to which Sister Lucy added "etc.," indicating more words of Our Lady about Portugal would follow in the Third Secret. 

    The new data of significance in Zavala's book is an analysis by a well-known and highly regarded Spanish graphologist – handwriting analyst – Begoña Slocker de Arce (here), whose long list of credentials are impressive. She compared the possible undisclosed one-page Third Secret – published by Tradition in Action on our Fatima Issues page on April 27, 2010 – with Sister Lucy's handwritten First and Second Secrets (written by her definitively on August 31, 1941). 

    After a detailed analysis and study of the two handwritings, the expert concluded in her report that "the 3rd docuмent" – the Secret TIA published – had been drafted "by the same hand" as the first two docuмents known to be definitively written by Sr. Lucy of Fatima

    A careful scientific analysis and serious testimony 

    Just as each one has a particular way of walking, gesturing, laughing, walking, etc. so also the handwriting has a peculiar series of tendencies and features that differentiate it from others, Begoña Slocker explains. Writings can vary in many ways throughout one's life, she tells us, but there are innate "type gestures," intrinsic peculiarities and graphic personalizations that do not change over time. And these characteristics give the author unique marks that can always identify him. 

    For example, in the superimpositions of letters she made below from the questionable Third Secret Letter and the unquestionable letters written by Sr. Lucy in the First and Second secrets, she found small differences of vibration natural to spontaneous writing. Nonetheless, the linked letters characteristics, hand raises for punctuation, t-bars and other features distinguishable to the trained eye clearly demonstrate, in her view, a single, unique style.


    [/font][/size][/color]
    [color][size][font]


    After providing more samples of the techniques applied in the study, the graphologist concludes: 

    "In view of the above findings, it can be determined that, after a thorough analysis, there are qualitative and quantitative elements that the docuмent in question, referred to here as the Unrevealed Third Part of the Secret of Fatima, was made by the same hand as that of the unquestioned docuмents corresponding to the First and Second Parts of the Secret of Fatima, written in fact by Sr. Lucia dos Santo in her Third Memoir of August 31, 1941. 

    "This opinion has been made as objectively as possible, taking into consideration both what can favor and cause injury to any parties involved and with my full realization of the penal sanctions that could be incurred if I disregard my duty as an expert. 

    "This I testify according to my full knowledge and understanding in Madrid, on the 8th day of December in the year 2016, 

    "[Signed] Begoña Slocker de Arce" 

    New Interest in the Third Secret posted by TIA 

    This evidence of a respected graphologist should raise new interest in the possible Third Secret posted on our website seven years ago. I recall very well when TIA first received the anonymous e-mail from a reader in Portugal. I sent it on to our website editor Atila Guimarães, who is always very suspicious, expecting him to reject it. 

    To my surprise, he expressed keen interest in it. In his opinion, it could very well be the real secret, since there was an appearance of authenticity in it: Its content certainly spoke of a tremendous apostasy inside the Church – in fact this is the opening statement. Its simplicity of form corresponded to that of the other two messages of Our Lady to three peasant children. The size of the docuмent also matches perfectly - 25 lines, the thumbprint adding a note of authenticity. 

    It was worthwhile to present it to our audience, he decided. From the beginning he suggested that a handwriting comparison be made by an expert. You can read our careful translation of the letter and his commentaries here in our original posting. For our readers' convenience, I also transcribe it below in blue: 

    Possible Third Secret 

    Tuy September 1, 1944 or April 1, 1944 

    JMJ 

    Now I am going to reveal the third fragment of the secret: This part is the apostasy in the Church! 

    Our Lady showed us the individual who I describe as the 'holy Father' in front of a multitude that was cheering him.


    [/font][/size][/color]
    For larger photo, click here
    [color][size][font]
    But there was a difference from a true Holy Father, his devilish gaze, this one had the gaze of evil. 

    Then, after some moments we saw the same Pope entering a Church, but this Church was the Church of hell; there is no way to describe the ugliness of that place. It looked like a gray cement fortress with broken angles and windows similar to eyes; in the roof of the building it had a beak. 

    Next, we raised our eyes to Our Lady who said to us: You saw the apostasy in the Church; this letter can be opened by the Holy Father, but it must be announced after Pius XII and before 1960. 

    In the kingdom of John Paul II the cornerstone of Peter's grave must be removed and transferred to Fatima. 

    Because the dogma of the faith is not conserved in Rome, its authority will be removed and delivered to Fatima. 

    The cathedral of Rome must be destroyed and a new one built in Fatima. 

    If 69 weeks after this order is announced, Rome continues its abomination, the city will be destroyed. 

    Our Lady told us that this is written, [in] Daniel 9:24-25 and Matthew 21:42-44." (thumbprint)
     

    Discussion & doubts 

    Posting the letter opened a discussion with readers, who jumped in it to give their opinions and pose their doubts (you can read the postings here). 

    All the readers agreed that the one we published was certainly more authentic than the one released by the Vatican in 2000. To the objections, Mr. Guimarães gave responses. Many of these questions are addressed by Mr. Zavala, often with arguments quite similar to the ones we posted (he does not quote his sources, I noted with disappointment). 

    During this discussion, Mr. Guimarães posted reasons to support the released text; he addressed doubts such as how Our Lady could name John Paul II long before his papacy (she also named Pius XII before his election), and why Sister Lucy would have written Juan Pablo (Spanish) instead of João Paulo (Portuguese) 

    TIA also posted a photo-collage of the evil gaze of then-pontiff Benedict XVI. It would not be difficult to make an equally horrid photomontage of Francis' gaze (see here for gazes of Paul VI, Benedict and Francis, among others). We also showed pictures of Novus Ordo churches that match the description of the 'Church of hell' reported in the letter, and confirmed that John Paul II had indeed placed the mentioned cornerstone at the new Church at Fatima.


    [/font][/size][/color]
    Evil gazes of post-Conciliar popes
    [color][size][font]
    Mr. Guimarães even extensively addressed the question of possible falsified data in the letter, which could have been made with the precise intent to discredit its authenticity and, thus, bury the authentic message definitively. 

    But, it appears this funeral has not taken place yet. With this strong new forensic evidence by Begoña Slocker de Arce, who testifies that her conclusion was not influenced by any interested party and stakes her high reputation on the objectivity of the results, it seems that the question should be re-opened. 

    In this 100th anniversary of the apparitions of Fatima, it is both interesting and opportune that an official testimony of the authenticity of the handwriting should come to light. 

    With the recent earthquakes shaking even Rome, one wonders if Our Lady will no longer be able to hold back the hand of her Son, so offended by sins and apostasy, and the Eternal City, which survived many earthly empires, will disappear in a heavenly punishment for the apostasy of the Conciliar Church. 

    And, then, what will come? A new Rome in Fatima? Certainly, it is an interesting hypothesis.[/font][/size][/color]
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    Offline Jovita

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #7 on: March 30, 2017, 11:02:13 PM »
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  • Interesting......
    All I know is that 3 years ago I was walking down the aisle after Communion,and lifted my head and saw it- the picture of Bergoglio on the back wall of the Church!  I jumped- I was so taken aback- by his eyes. It was frightening! :o
    I'm glad I'm going somewhere now that doesn't have that scary picture.


    Online Nadir

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #8 on: March 31, 2017, 03:26:35 AM »
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  • We always heard that the secret was to be released before 1960 but I had no idea it was to be published after the death of Pius XII. That is a very short and specific time frame of just 14 months.

    So Our Lady not only named the two popes but she knew when Pius XII would die. Of course she had inside information!

    I am not planning to take any more trips to Rome!

    May Her Immaculate Heart triumph!
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    Offline AJNC

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #9 on: March 31, 2017, 07:55:14 AM »
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  • This article, previously posted on Cathinfo, also fits well in this thread:

    http://traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/g23ht_Interview.html



    Sister Lucy’s Last Public Interview - 1957

     Fr. Augustin Fuentes

     
    Quote
    A reader recently noted that the interview Sister Lucy gave to Fr. Augustin Fuentes in 1957, is always partially reported, and asked TIA if we could post the full text. To assist in this request we are now posting the most complete text available of the 1957 interview with our own translation from the original Spanish. Fr. Augustín Fuentes was the Mexican priest named vice-postulator of the cause of beatification for Francisco and Jacinta. In that interview Sr. Lucy said that Our Lady told her: “The last means that God will give to the world for its salvation are the Holy Rosary and My Immaculate Heart.”

     This important conversation of December 26, 1957 was the last public interview of Sr. Lucy. After it, permission was refused for any other interviews and she was effectively silenced and completely hidden away for the next several decades.

     Another very jovial Sr. Lucy appeared 10 years later in 1967 during Paul VI’s visit to Fatima. This Sr. Lucy, square-faced, cheerful and robust – incredibly different from the oval faced, sad and pale Sr. Lucy who spoke to Fr. Fuentes - was seen more regularly starting in 1982, after John Paul II’s visit to Fatima. [See our Two Sister Lucys' analysis]

     These are the authentic words of her 1957 conversation with Fr. Fuentes, which came from the records of the official archivist of Fatima, Fr. Joaquín María Alonso, CMF. Fr. Alonso spoke with Sr. Lucy and publicly testified that her statements to Fr. Fuentes in 1957 were genuine and true.

     This text is from his book, La verdad sobre el Secreto de Fátima, Fátima sin mitos [The Truth about the Secret of Fatima without Myths ]. The text has the approval and imprimatur of Archbishop Sánchez of Santa Cruz, Mexico.

     What follows is the literal translation of Fr. Fuentes' text reporting what he heard "from the lips of" the seer of Fatima.    TIA





    Interview of December 26, 1957

     Speaking to the sisters of Motherhouse of the Missionaries of the Sacred Heart in Mexico on May 22, 1958, Fr. Fuentes said, “I want to tell you the last conversation I had with her [Sister Lucy], which was on December 26 of last year. It was in the convent, where I found her very sad, pale and drawn.”




    A very grave Sister Lucia in 1957
    He then proceeded to read Sister’s Lucy’s words to him at the December 26, 1957, interview:

     “Father, the Blessed Virgin is very sad because no one has paid attention to her Message, neither the good nor the bad. The good, because they continue on the road of goodness, but without paying mind to this Message. The bad, because of their sins, do not see God’s chastisement already falling on them presently; they also continue on their path of badness, ignoring the Message. But, Father, you must believe me that God is going to punish the world and chastise it in a tremendous way.

     “The chastisement from Heaven is imminent. The year 1960 is on us, and then what will happen? It will be very sad for everyone, and far from a happy thing if the world does not pray and do penance before then. I cannot give more details, because it is still a secret. By the will of the Blessed Virgin, only the Holy Father and the Bishop of Fatima can know the secret. Both have chosen, however, not to open it in order not to be influenced by it. (1)

     “This is the third part of the Message of Our Lady, which still remains secret until 1960. Tell them, Father, that the Blessed Virgin said repeatedly – to my cousins Francisco and Jacinta as well as to me – that many nations would disappear from the face of the earth, that Russia would be the instrument of chastisement from Heaven for the whole world if the conversion of that poor Nation is not obtained beforehand. …”

     A decisive battle with the Devil

     Sr. Lucy also told me:




    Fr. Augustin Fuentes
    “Father, the Devil is fighting a decisive battle against the Virgin and, as you know, what most offends God and what will gain him the greatest number of souls in the shortest time is to gain the souls consecrated to God. For this also leaves unprotected the field of the laity and the Devil can more easily seize them.

     ”Also, Father, tell them that my cousins Francisco and Jacinta made sacrifices because they always saw the Blessed Virgin was very sad in all her apparitions. She never smiled at us. This anguish that we saw in her, caused by offenses to God and the chastisements that threaten sinners, penetrated our souls. And being children, we did not know what measures to devise except to pray and make sacrifices. …”

     We cannot wait for Rome to speak

     Referring to the vision of Hell that Our Lady showed her and Jacinta and Francisco, she said:

     “For this reason, Father, it is my mission not just to tell about the material punishments that will certainly come over the earth if the world does not pray and do penance. No, my mission is to tell everyone the imminent danger we are in of losing our souls for all eternity if we remain fixed in sin.

     “Father, we should not wait for a call to the world from Rome on the part of the Holy Father to do penance. Nor should we wait for a call for penance to come from the Bishops in our Dioceses, nor from our Religious Congregations. No, Our Lord has often used these means, and the world has not paid heed. So, now each one of us must begin to reform himself spiritually. Each one has to save not only his own soul, but also all the souls that God has placed on his pathway.

     Two last remedies to save the world

     “Father, the Blessed Virgin did not tell me that we are in the last times of the world, but I understood this for three reasons:

     “The first is because she told me that the Devil is engaging in a battle with the Virgin, a decisive battle. It is a final battle where one party will be victorious and the other will suffer defeat. So, from now on, we are either with God or we are with the Devil; there is no middle ground.

     “The second reason is because she told me, as well as my cousins, that God is giving two last remedies to the world: the Holy Rosary and devotion to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. And, being the last remedies, that is to say, they are the final ones, means that there will be no others.




    'Our Lady never smiled. She was always very sad'
    “And the third, because in the plans of the Divine Providence, when God is going to chastise the world He always first exhausts all other remedies. When He sees that the world pays no attention whatsoever, then, as we say in our imperfect way of talking, with a certain fear He presents us the last means of salvation, His Blessed Mother.

     If we despise and reject this last means, Heaven will no longer pardon us, because we will have committed a sin that the Gospel calls a sin against the Holy Spirit. This sin consists in openly rejecting – with full knowledge and will – the salvation that is put in our hands.

     “Also, since Our Lord is a very good Son, He will not permit that we offend and despise His Blessed Mother. We have as obvious testimony the history of different centuries where Our Lord has shown us with terrible examples how He has always defended the honor of His Blessed Mother.

     “Prayer and sacrifice are the two means to save the world. As for the Holy Rosary, Father, in these last times in which we are living, the Blessed Virgin has given a new efficacy to the praying of the Holy Rosary. This in such a way that there is no problem that cannot be resolved by praying the Rosary, no matter how difficult it is - be it temporal or above all spiritual - in the spiritual life of each of us or the lives of our families, be they our families in the world or Religious Communities, or even in the lives of peoples and nations.

     “I repeat, there is no problem, as difficult as it may be, that we cannot resolve at this time by praying the Holy Rosary. With the Holy Rosary we will save ourselves, sanctify ourselves, console Our Lord and obtain the salvation of many souls.

     “Then, there is devotion to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, our Most Holy Mother, holding her as the seat of mercy, goodness and pardon and the sure door to enter Heaven. This is the first part of the Message referring to Our Lady of Fatima, and the second part, which is briefer but no less important, refers to the Holy Father.”

    Quote
    1. In 1943, the Bishop of Fatima José Correia da Silva authorized Sister Lucia to write down the Third Secret during her bout with pleurisy, which threatened her life. On June 17, 1944, this docuмent was officially placed in his hands. When Sister Lucia gave the letter to Bishop da Silva, she told him that he could read it, but he refused. Instead, he ordered the sealed docuмent to be kept in the safe of the Episcopal Curia. Pope Pius XII also chose not to read the message, and left it in the care of Bishop da Silva until 1957, when the sealed envelope was sent to Rome at his request.


    Offline RomanCatholic1953

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #10 on: March 31, 2017, 11:07:37 PM »
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  • The Virgin Mary’s Predictions of the Fall
    of the Post-Conciliar Church
    This development was predicted by the Blessed Virgin in her apparition at La Salette in 1846: “Rome will lose the Faith….and become the seat of antichrist” [quoted in Rama Coomaraswamy, The Destruction of the Christian Tradition, World Wisdom, 2006, xiv]. The Third Secret of Fatima also apparently alluded to the apostasy of the Western Church. Father Joaquin Alonso, the official expert on the Fatima Message and author of the 24-volume Fatima Texts and Critical Studies (who had many interviews with Sister Lucia, the longest-surviving of the recipients of the Message from the Blessed Virgin), said this in 1981:
    It is therefore completely probable that the text [of the Third Secret] makes concrete references to the crisis of faith within the Church and to the negligence of the pastors themselves [and the] internal struggles in the very bosom of the Church and of grave pastoral negligence by the upper hierarchy. . . . If “in Portugal the dogma of the Faith will always be preserved”….it can be clearly deduced from this that in other parts of the Church these dogmas are going to become obscure or even lost altogether [Quoted in Frère Michel de la Sainte Trinité, The Whole Truth About Fatima, Volume III: The Third Secret, (Immaculate Heart Publications, Buffalo, New York, 1990) 704.]
    In the year 2000 the Third Secret was apparently published by Pope John Paul II, 40 years after the date set for its revelation by the Blessed Virgin; it predicts the persecution of the Papacy and many new martyrs. Some, however, believe this Secret to be spurious (though the prophesy of “many new martyrs” is certainly being fulfilled), or at least incomplete— particularly in view of the fact that, after 1960, a woman was presented to the faithful as Sister Lucia who, unless the photographs of her available on the web have been doctored (which is not impossible), bore only a passing resemblance to the real Lucia; a comparison of photographs (note particularly the line of the jaw) certainly suggests that the later Lucia was a different woman. This is an example of the work of the Fox. And in view of the pre-eminent place held by St. Lucy in the Divine Comedy—St. Lucy whose name means “light,” whose intercession cures blindness, and on whose feast day, December 13, I was born—we can almost see in this counterfeit “Lucy” an intent in some quarters to suppress the degree and quality of Wisdom expressed in Dante’s great work (even as the Roman Catholic Church shows signs of renewed interest in Dante), and to veil the light it throws upon the dark destiny of the greater part of the Church Militant—or, as we must perhaps now call it, the Church Compliant.

    For complete text see: Dante Prophecy of the Fall of the Post Conciliar Church in the Politics and World
    Leaders section.


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #11 on: April 01, 2017, 08:49:49 PM »
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  • Some, however, believe this Secret to be spurious (though the prophesy of “many new martyrs” is certainly being fulfilled), or at least incomplete— particularly in view of the fact that, after 1960, a woman was presented to the faithful as Sister Lucia who, unless the photographs of her available on the web have been doctored (which is not impossible), bore only a passing resemblance to the real Lucia; a comparison of photographs (note particularly the line of the jaw) certainly suggests that the later Lucia was a different woman. This is an example of the work of the Fox. 
    .
    This picture of Sister Lucia is authentic, to be sure:

    And here is a similar photo showing her teeth much more clearly:

    But the later photos of her, even though reprinted by Catholic Family News and other such reliable sources, have been rather less than believable:

    The eyes, eye brows, nose, chin, cheek bones, lips, mouth, shape of smile, teeth -- so many differences -- people simply do not change like that as they grow older. I've never been able to believe the Vatican line that this is the same person. 

    All I have to say is, TOO BAD WE DON'T HAVE DNA EVIDENCE.  

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    Offline mw2016

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #12 on: April 02, 2017, 12:17:42 AM »
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  • Our ‘Third Secret’ Was Written by Sr. Lucy, 
    [size={defaultattr}][font={defaultattr}]Possible Third Secret

    Tuy September 1, 1944 or April 1, 1944

    JMJ

    Now I am going to reveal the third fragment of the secret: This part is the apostasy in the Church!

    Our Lady showed us the individual who I describe as the 'holy Father' in front of a multitude that was cheering him.


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    For larger photo, click here
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    But there was a difference from a true Holy Father, his devilish gaze, this one had the gaze of evil.

    Then, after some moments we saw the same Pope entering a Church, but this Church was the Church of hell; there is no way to describe the ugliness of that place. It looked like a gray cement fortress with broken angles and windows similar to eyes; in the roof of the building it had a beak.

    Next, we raised our eyes to Our Lady who said to us: You saw the apostasy in the Church; this letter can be opened by the Holy Father, but it must be announced after Pius XII and before 1960.

    In the kingdom of John Paul II the cornerstone of Peter's grave must be removed and transferred to Fatima.

    Because the dogma of the faith is not conserved in Rome, its authority will be removed and delivered to Fatima.

    The cathedral of Rome must be destroyed and a new one built in Fatima.

    If 69 weeks after this order is announced, Rome continues its abomination, the city will be destroyed.

    Our Lady told us that this is written, [in] Daniel 9:24-25 and Matthew 21:42-44." (thumbprint)

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    I'd say it's real because it has her thumbprint.

    Offline Sienna629

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #13 on: April 02, 2017, 09:40:12 PM »
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  • I'd say it's real because it has her thumbprint.

    I don't think it is the real Third Secret because it doesn't meet the criteria described by Father Malachi Martin when he said "the central element is awful", that it is terrifying and very blunt, to-the-point, with no adverbs or adjectives, and would have people lined up into the street for confession on Saturday night, etc. He said everyone would understand it.

    Further, it says nothing of the physical destruction hinted at by JPII at Fulda.

    It does not begin with the sentence we are familiar with about "The Dogma will always be preserved in Portugal, etc...." 

    There is nothing terrifying to the "average guy" about this letter, since the vast majority of Novus Ordites especially, have no idea what the word Apostasy means, let alone how to spell it. Most people will read that letter and say "There's nothing scary there. I don't see how it affects me." They do not see how Apostasy affects them because they do not know what it is. Further, they do not know that they have lost the Faith, as Father Martin explained.

    The recent interview with the visionary nun of Akita seems to reveal that the central element of the Third Secret is the fact that "almost everyone on Earth will be condemned to Hell." That is the result of Apostasy, and that is an "awful central element".

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    Re: The Third Secret Of Fatima Goes Sede
    « Reply #14 on: April 02, 2017, 10:40:34 PM »
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  • I don't think it is the real Third Secret because it doesn't meet the criteria described by Father Malachi Martin when he said "the central element is awful", that it is terrifying and very blunt, to-the-point, with no adverbs or adjectives, and would have people lined up into the street for confession on Saturday night, etc. He said everyone would understand it.

    Further, it says nothing of the physical destruction hinted at by JPII at Fulda.

    It does not begin with the sentence we are familiar with about "The Dogma will always be preserved in Portugal, etc...."

    There is nothing terrifying to the "average guy" about this letter, since the vast majority of Novus Ordites especially, have no idea what the word Apostasy means, let alone how to spell it. Most people will read that letter and say "There's nothing scary there. I don't see how it affects me." They do not see how Apostasy affects them because they do not know what it is. Further, they do not know that they have lost the Faith, as Father Martin explained.

    The recent interview with the visionary nun of Akita seems to reveal that the central element of the Third Secret is the fact that "almost everyone on Earth will be condemned to Hell." That is the result of Apostasy, and that is an "awful central element".
    .
    A letter could have her thumbprint and really be from Sr. Lucia and still not be the Third Secret we've been waiting for.

    This letter has no words of Our Lady, but the Third Secret should be ALL her words, since that is the context of the first line that should be there, and isn't in this one, "In Portugal, the dogma of the faith shall always be preserved." The "etc" was added by Sr. Lucia when she decided to revise her earlier version of the Second Secret in answer to all the many requests from people for her to divulge the Third.

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    Further, it says nothing of the physical destruction hinted at by JPII at Fulda.
    .
    Go back and look at what JPII actually said at Fulda, and think about it in context of the quote below.  For if the Third Secret contains words of Our Lady warning that most people today on earth will be condemned to hell, JPII knowing that could have been saying as much as he dared, attempting to put a phenomenologist twist on the message, because that's what he was -- a phenomenologist.  

    For him, hell is a reality in the mind and it amounts to what you WANT it to be, just like ocean waves destroying large portions of land all over the world would only be terrible to him in the minds of survivors who decide to THINK of it as being terrible. He was "hinting" because as a phenomenologist he was not capable of speaking clearly like Pope St. Pius X.

    ETA: JPII might have been thinking about a warning of Our Lady that says most people alive today will go to hell when he "hinted" at the possibility of ocean waters inundating lands. He would not have gotten away with saying the world will be flooded because even Protestants and Jєωs know that God promised that will never happen again.

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    The recent interview with the visionary nun of Akita seems to reveal that the central element of the Third Secret is the fact that "almost everyone on Earth will be condemned to Hell." That is the result of Apostasy, and that is an "awful central element".
    .
    Now that would be a shocking thing for many Catholics today to hear, Catholics who are steeped in the heresy of indifferentism coming down from the highest offices -- JPII with his 2 Assisi gatherings, Benedict XVI with his insanity-inducing "hermeneutic of continuity" and Francis with his hatred of everything in Tradition.

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