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Author Topic: The secret consecration of Bishops  (Read 6524 times)

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Offline Incredulous

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The secret consecration of Bishops
« on: January 14, 2024, 03:32:31 AM »
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  • In 2012, during the struggle to preserve Catholic tradition during the Church's consiliar captivity, one decentralized, group of Bishops and loosely affiliated Priests known as the SSPX Resistance was born.  

    Including Bp. Williamson, I believe the Resistance now has six Bishops. 
    Of Bp. Williamson's more recent apostolic consecrations, two were performed secretly.  
    And then we recently learned though social media, that Bp. Williamson has secretly consecrated Archbishop Vigano.  

    In the following Q&A interview, at 22:19 Bp. Sanborn raises concerns about the propriety of secret consecrations.



    And according to the 1917 Canon Law, Session XXIV (below) there are, "scrutinies, informations, attestations, and proofs required of the person to be promoted" and that the consecration be announced in the form of a public docuмent.


    ON REFORMATION

    DECREE
    The same sacred and holy Synod, prosecuting the subject of Reformation, ordains that the things following be established in the present Session.

    CHAPTER I.

    The manner of proceeding to the creation of Bishops and Cardinals.

    If, as regards all manner of degrees in the Church, a provident and enlightened care is to be taken, that in the house of the Lord there be nothing disorderly, nothing unseemly; much more ought we to strive that no error be committed in the election of him who is constituted above all those degrees. For the state and order of the whole household of the Lord will totter, if what is required in the body be not found in the head. For which cause, although the holy Synod has elsewhere usefully ordained certain things touching those who are to be promoted to cathedral and superior churches, yet doth it account this office to be of such a nature, as that were it to be pondered upon in proportion to its greatness, there would never seem to have been caution enough taken. Wherefore It ordains, that, as soon as a church shall become vacant, processions, and prayers shall be made in public and private; and such shall be enjoined, by the Chapter, throughout the city and diocese; that thereby both clergy and people may be enabled to obtain from God a good pastor.

    And as regards all and each of those who have, in any way, any right from the Apostolic See, or who otherwise have a part, in the promotion of those to be set over the churches; the holy Synod,-without making any change herein, from a consideration of the circuмstances of the present time,-exhorts and admonishes them, that they above all things bear in mind that they cannot do anything more conducive to the glory of God, and the salvation of the people, than to study to promote good pastors, and such as are capable of governing a church; and that they sin mortally, becoming partakers in others' sins, unless they carefully endeavour that those be promoted whom they themselves judge the most worthy of, and useful to, the church, not guided by entreaties, or human affection, or the solicitations of pretenders, but by what the merits of the individuals require at their hands; and seeing that they be persons whom they know to have been born in lawful wedlock, and who, by their life, learning, and in all other qualifications, are such as are required by the sacred canons, and by the decrees of this Synod of Trent.

    And forasmuch as, by reason of the diversity of nations, peoples, and customs, a uniform system cannot be followed everywhere, in receiving the grave and competent testimony of good and learned men on the subject of the aforesaid qualifications, the holy Synod ordains, that, in a provincial Synod, to be held by the metropolitan, there shall be prescribed for each place and province a proper form of examination, scrutiny, or information, such as shall seem to be most useful and suitable for the said places, which form is to be submitted to the approval of the most holy Roman Pontiff; yet so, however, that, after that this examination, or scrutiny, as regards the persons to be promoted, shall have been completed, it shall, after being reduced into the form of a public docuмent, be necessarily transmitted, as soon as possible, with all the attestations and with the profession of faith made by the individual to be promoted, to the most holy Roman Pontiff, in order that the said Sovereign Pontiff, having a full knowledge of the whole matter and of the persons, may, for the advantage of the Lord's flock, in a most useful manner provide those churches therewith, if they shall have been found, by the examination or scrutiny, suitable persons.

    And all the scrutinies, informations, attestations, and proofs of whatsoever kind, and by whomsoever made, even though in the Roman court, touching the qualifications of the person to be promoted, shall be carefully examined by a cardinal-who shall report thereon to the consistory-aided therein by three other cardinals; and the said report shall be authenticated by the signature of the cardinal who drew up the report, and of the three other cardinals; and therein each of the four cardinals shall make affirmation that, after giving exact attention thereto, he has found the persons to be promoted, endowed with the qualifications required by law, and by this holy Synod, and that, at the peril of his eternal salvation, he doth certainly think them fit to be placed over the churches: in such wise that, after the report has been made in one consistory, the sentence shall be deferred until another consistory, in order that the said inquiry may be more maturely looked into in the mean time,-unless the most blessed Pontiff shall judge it expedient to act otherwise.

    And the Synod ordains, that all and singular the particulars which have been elsewhere ordained, in the same Synod, touching the life, age, learning, and the other qualifications of those who are to be appointed bishops, the same are also to be required in the creation of cardinals-even though they be deacons -of the holy Roman Church; whom the most holy Roman Pontiff shall, as far as it can be conveniently done, select out of all the nations of Christendom, as he shall find persons suitable.

    Finally, the same holy Synod, moved by the so many most grievous afflictions of the Church, cannot avoid recording, that nothing is more necessary for the Church of God than that the most blessed Roman Pontiff apply especially here that solicitude, which, by the duty of his office, he owes to the Universal Church,-that he take unto himself, to wit as cardinals, persons the most select only, and that he appoint over each church, above all things, good and fit pastors; and this the more, for that our Lord Jesus Christ will require at his hands the blood of those sheep of Christ which shall perish through the evil government of pastors who are negligent, and forgetful of their office.



    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #1 on: January 14, 2024, 08:38:35 AM »
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  • So we can agree that Bp. Sanborn is in conflict with Bp. Williamson?

    I guess that each of us Trads has to "choose" which bishop we think will better lead us during this Crisis, which bishop's ministrations will more likely lead us to heaven.

    I choose Bp. Williamson. You can choose whoever you wish. And of course, we each will reap the consequences of our decision. We (alone) are responsible for the decisions we make, the trust we grant, and the opinions we give ear to. Even if we are misled through someone's malice, we are partly to blame because we chose to follow them, against the criticism and warnings of dissenting voices. And whichever priest or bishop you follow, there ARE dissenting voices.

    Interestingly, I contacted *both* of them when I was looking to pursue a vocation to the priesthood. My independent priest gave me 3 options for "formal training" for a priestly vocation: SSPX seminary, Bp. Sanborn's seminary, and the traditional monks in Cullman, AL. And of course he would also be willing to train (and ordain) me himself.

    I wasn't an "SSPXer", much less a "company man" since I never attended the SSPX. I had just read about +Lefebvre and fully supported his work. There was simply not an SSPX chapel near my hometown, while we had a great independent chapel, which I grew up in.

    I remember receiving Bp. Sanborn's 3-ring binder with all the intellectual-sounding classes and descriptions. But I didn't do anything with it, because FIRST I received a voice message on my answering machine from Bp. Williamson, inviting me to visit his seminary.

    I did visit it, I thought the atmosphere was peaceful and I could envision myself there. Bp. Williamson asked if I wanted to enter in the Fall (which was about 1 to 1.5 months away) and I accepted.

    The binder showed up about a week later. I gave it to my priest, telling him I already decided to enter the SSPX seminary.

    And in hindsight, I believe the way things turned out was God taking care of me.

    By the way, during that "Who do the Sedes got?" thread, I recall +Thuc being put forth as a candidate. I think there was another bishop as well. But I don't think +Sanborn got any votes. He has none of the marks of Providence or sanctity that +ABL had. If you want to follow +Sanborn, be my guest. It's a free country. But don't blame me for making a better decision.

    The only thing that stands out about +Sanborn (my first, and current, impression of the man) is his IQ or intellectualism. But if the primary criteria for "who to follow" is IQ, then we all better get our butts out of Tradition and Catholicism. I'm sure most high-IQ men of our day, and certainly the highest IQs of our day, are following the religion(s) of molecules-to-man Evolution and Science (of "Trust the Science!" fame).

    So yeah, I look for other things that just a high IQ when deciding which bishop is the one to support and travel with during this Crisis.
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    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #2 on: January 14, 2024, 10:33:01 AM »
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  • "proprietry"?  We're in a state of emergency in the Church, and the bishops being consecrated, just like the priests who are being ordained, are little more than emergency dispensers of the Sacraments.  We're not talking about Ordinaries here.  And who's going to "scrutinize" these bishops, we armchair theologians on CathInfo?  Or one Trad group is going to "scrutinize" the bishops of a rival Trad group?  Generally, the bishop determines and is in the best position to determine whether the candidate is suitable for being an emergency dispenser of Sacraments, the biggest question in that capacity being whether the one who's consecrated will start laying hands on any warm body for priestly ordination.

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #3 on: January 14, 2024, 10:39:16 AM »
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  • By the way, during that "Who do the Sedes got?" thread, I recall +Thuc being put forth as a candidate. I think there was another bishop as well. But I don't think +Sanborn got any votes. He has none of the marks of Providence or sanctity that +ABL had. If you want to follow +Sanborn, be my guest. It's a free country. But don't blame me for making a better decision.

    Apart from what I believe to be a completely subjective criterion above, you'll find that the greatest critics of the "secret" consecrations are various SVs who are nearly all served by priests who descend from the +Thuc line.  Who "scrutinized" or knew beforehand about the consecrations of +de Lauriers (form whom +Sanborn descends) and +Carmona / +Zamora?  Answer:  nobody.  These consecrations took place with only Drs. Hiller and Heller in attendance, in +Thuc's little apartment, and were not pre-announced for "scrutiny".  There's a lot of hypocrisy there.  Similarly, Bishop Kelly impugns the validity of the +Thuc consecrations partly on the grounds of their "secrecy" ... and then goes of and gets himself secretly consecrated by +Mendez (keeping it under wraps for a couple years until +Mendez had died).  It's just nonsensical politics from those who have an ax to grind against +Vigano and/or +Williamson.

    Conditional Sacraments have always generally been performed in relative obscurity and without much fanfare.

    Offline MiracleOfTheSun

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #4 on: January 14, 2024, 10:44:55 AM »
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  • I remember receiving Bp. Sanborn's 3-ring binder... But I didn't do anything with it, because FIRST I received a voice message on my answering machine...

    A very rigorous and in-depth examination there...


    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #5 on: January 14, 2024, 10:51:12 AM »
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  • Interestingly, Bishop Sanborn did not cast any aspersions on Bishop Williamson or Vigano when he responded to the email question (unless I missed it).

    Offline trento

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #6 on: January 14, 2024, 11:06:37 AM »
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  • "proprietry"?  We're in a state of emergency in the Church, and the bishops being consecrated, just like the priests who are being ordained, are little more than emergency dispensers of the Sacraments.  We're not talking about Ordinaries here.  And who's going to "scrutinize" these bishops, we armchair theologians on CathInfo?  Or one Trad group is going to "scrutinize" the bishops of a rival Trad group?  Generally, the bishop determines and is in the best position to determine whether the candidate is suitable for being an emergency dispenser of Sacraments, the biggest question in that capacity being whether the one who's consecrated will start laying hands on any warm body for priestly ordination.

    That remains to be seen.

    Offline Quo vadis Domine

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #7 on: January 14, 2024, 11:07:20 AM »
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  • I came across an interesting case in The Casuist several years ago involving a secret ordination and consecration. The main point of the article was to show how careful Holy Mother Church protects the seal of confession, but it also indirectly points out how Holy Orders are still valid even though done in secret and without witnesses.
    For what doth it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his own soul? Or what exchange shall a man give for his soul?


    Offline trento

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #8 on: January 14, 2024, 11:07:56 AM »
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  • Apart from what I believe to be a completely subjective criterion above, you'll find that the greatest critics of the "secret" consecrations are various SVs who are nearly all served by priests who descend from the +Thuc line.  Who "scrutinized" or knew beforehand about the consecrations of +de Lauriers (form whom +Sanborn descends) and +Carmona / +Zamora?  Answer:  nobody.  These consecrations took place with only Drs. Hiller and Heller in attendance, in +Thuc's little apartment, and were not pre-announced for "scrutiny".  There's a lot of hypocrisy there.  Similarly, Bishop Kelly impugns the validity of the +Thuc consecrations partly on the grounds of their "secrecy" ... and then goes of and gets himself secretly consecrated by +Mendez (keeping it under wraps for a couple years until +Mendez had died).  It's just nonsensical politics from those who have an ax to grind against +Vigano and/or +Williamson.

    Conditional Sacraments have always generally been performed in relative obscurity and without much fanfare.

    I do agree with you here. Basically SVs and Resistance are birds of a feather that likes slinging mud at one another :laugh1:

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #9 on: January 14, 2024, 11:10:29 AM »
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  • Interestingly, Bishop Sanborn did not cast any aspersions on Bishop Williamson or Vigano when he responded to the email question (unless I missed it).

    Well, as I mentioned, conditional consecrations are in an entirely different category.  +Vigano was already a "bishop", and had been one for many years, and so no particular "scrutiny" would be required just to regularize a doubtful Sacrament.

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #10 on: January 14, 2024, 11:13:00 AM »
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  • I do agree with you here. Basically SVs and Resistance are birds of a feather that likes slinging mud at one another :laugh1:

    And the SSPX are exempt?  They sling mud at SVs and the Resistance, e.g. attacking the Resistance for consecrating bishops while +Lefebvre had done the same thing and they're likely gearing up to do the same themselves.


    Offline moneil

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #11 on: January 14, 2024, 11:14:37 AM »
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  • Quote
    And according to the 1917 Canon Law, Session XXIV (below) there are, "scrutinies, informations, attestations, and proofs required of the person to be promoted" and that the consecration be announced in the form of a public docuмent.
    Just as a point of information, the text below the above sentence comes from the 24th Session of the Council of Trent, not the 1917 Code of Canon Law.

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #12 on: January 14, 2024, 11:16:41 AM »
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  • Again, these are standards in place for normal times and normal situations.  Consecrations behind the Iron Curtain were ordered to be kept secret, and the candidates were chosen exclusively by the clandestine bishop(s) specifically given the mandate to do so ... such as the mandate Archbishop Thuc received.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #13 on: January 14, 2024, 11:37:03 AM »
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  • A very rigorous and in-depth examination there...

    I didn't phrase it very well.

    By the time I received the binder, some time had already passed since I agreed to enter the SSPX seminary, quit my job, etc. I don't remember how much time had passed; now that I think about it, it was probably closer to 3-4 weeks.

    So yeah, besides getting an overall vibe of the contents being very intellectual, ivory tower, proud, cold, etc. I didn't do much with it. 

    I didn't throw it in the trash or use it for toilet paper; I gave it to my priest/spiritual director, to do with as he pleased.  Maybe he knew another young man wanting to enter a seminary? After all, my priest was Independent, so he wasn't with any "group" or "side", and in fact recommended BOTH +Sanborn's and +Williamson's seminary to a prospective vocation (me), as well as a Trad group of monks in Alabama. He was completely neutral, classic "Traditional Catholic", and doing his job. I commend him for that. May he rest in peace.
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    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: The secret consecration of Bishops
    « Reply #14 on: January 14, 2024, 12:21:35 PM »
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  • I didn't throw it in the trash or use it for toilet paper; I gave it to my priest/spiritual director, to do with as he pleased.  Maybe he knew another young man wanting to enter a seminary? After all, my priest was Independent, so he wasn't with any "group" or "side", and in fact recommended BOTH +Sanborn's and +Williamson's seminary to a prospective vocation (me), as well as a Trad group of monks in Alabama. He was completely neutral, classic "Traditional Catholic", and doing his job. I commend him for that. May he rest in peace.

    Interesting.  Who was this Independent priest who was OK with either STAS or Bishop Sanborn's seminary?

    I'm guessing you're talking about Abbot Leonard (Giardina) in Alabama.  I spent a few days there myself, but just got a strange "off" vibe about it, where I didn't feel as though I would fit in there.  I couldn't put a finger on it, but my "spidey senses" suggested that something was not right there.  They eventually went Novus Ordo after Abbot Leonard died.