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Author Topic: The Recusant:  (Read 19652 times)

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The Recusant:
« Reply #50 on: April 10, 2014, 02:23:08 PM »
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From p.42:


France: In an official announcement which appeared on
the SSPX French district website, http://LaPorteLatine.org ,
Fr. de Caqueray has announced that this summer he will
be replaced as District Superior of France by none other
than...

...Fr. Christian “The
-
Jews
-
did
-
not
-
commit
-
Deicide” Bouchacourt, the current district
superior of South America!
Where Fr. de Caqueray will be moved to remains unclear.  



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Let's see:  South Africa is already newly occupied by Fr. Scott.
Asia is a possibility seeing how Fr. Couture has run rampant there,
breaking, entering and pillaging. But he would have to face Fr. Chazal.
Those two might team up or something. Perhaps India, well, no,
he'd suppress the Flying Squirrel -- can't have that.  
Japan and Korea aren't big enough.  And Australia would be at
risk with the cozy rel's with Bishop Peter J. Elliot and +F.  
Don't want to rock the boat.  Hmm....... Les'see here......
Out of France and into Russia?  Naaah -- too close.  
How about Madagascar or East Timor?  Diego Garcia?  (Too small,
and besides, Phillip Wood and all aren't Trads.)  
I've got it:  Oceania!  That would be New Zealand, Fiji, Hawaii,
Easter and Pitcairn Is.  The commute should keep him busy.

I.e., his new assignment isn't being mentioned because the options
are getting really slim lately.  He'd be leaving France because
France is getting out of hand.  Can't have that!  Put a real Lib in there,
like that guy who's chummy with the Yids.  Anything!  This is an
emergency!  We'll worry about where to send him later.  Maybe
someone on a blog somewhere will come up with a good idea.


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The Recusant:
« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2014, 03:04:38 AM »
Quote from: [url=http://www.cathinfo.com/catholic.php?a=topic&t=31000&min=25#p2
TheRecusant[/url]]
What a lot of fuss.

Sean Johnson, I apologise that we are a little late getting the March/April issue out. It is late because we're not Angelus Press, we don't charge people, we don't make lots of money (we don't make any money!), I don't draw a nice handsome editors salary (in fact I don't get any salary, not a single penny), and in the meantime real life occasionally gets in the way. It's free because it's a work offered to Almighty God, not a business.

I'll take this thread as a compliment, however. It's nice to have one's efforts appreciated now and then.

And now, if you don't mind, I haven't really time for much more discussion, interesting though it no doubt would be.



Since Ed. takes this thread as a compliment, and that is certainly my motive in all my perhaps questionable energy that seems to have been recognized by almost Nobody else,  :tinfoil: ...

I have another observation to make regarding one item in Issue #15.  And I know, I know, there will be someone (or perhaps Nobody  :judge: ) who doesn't appreciate this.



From p.42:


Drop in SSPX vocations?  Winona (USA) - only ten new entrants received the cassock at the SSPX’s US seminary this year, the lowest number of new entrants into Winona for as long as anyone can remember - as far back as at least the mid-1980s! If this is the start of a new downward trend in SSPX vocations, it will be just in time for the completion of the new $50million (or was it $80million?) mega-seminary currently under construction in Virginia...



I have some inside information in regards to this.  There is a REASON that enrollments are DOWN, and it has nothing to do with the number of VOCATIONS.  

The reason that there are fewer seminarians at Winona this year is the following:  when young men from far and wide arrive who are NOT from SSPX schools and/or parishes, but rather are from independent chapels or homeshcooled Catholic families, the other students are encouraged by the professors (Fr. Themann is not exempt from among them) to, as it were, use these somehow 'less fortunate' applicants as  :boxer: punching bags.  :argue:  


By repeatedly treating them as lower-class material and 'damaged goods', their enthusiasm is depleted, and their zeal is taxed, to the point where they literally come away saying the following.

And no, I am not "making this up."

They say, in many cases (although not all), "If it comes down to a choice between the SSPX seminary or else no ordination, I'd prefer the latter."  

How does this fare for having new priests in formation?  The one thing that is difficult to measure is, how do the professors assess the individual candidates' proclivity toward the prospect of making a 'deal' with modernist Rome?

(Perhaps you prefer "accord" or "normalization" or "practical agreement.")

I have a very hard time expecting that they do NOT sit each seminarian down, perhaps even from time to time, and ask a series of questions, the point of which is to assess his opinion on the prospect of such "accord" or "practical agreement" sometime in the future, and that they may look very carefully at the candidate's IMMEDIATE REACTION to the idea.  

Alternatively, they might rely on some prior recommendation from a youth group, such as the summer program at any of the retreat centers, for reports from the rectors there, regarding whether a particular seminarian showed any signs of 'resistance' to the PRINCIPLE of some future 'accord with Rome'.

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The Recusant:
« Reply #52 on: April 11, 2014, 04:52:57 AM »
Quote from: Neil Obstat
.

From p.34:


There had been no English language website of the Franciscan Third Order in the USA, although there was one run by a tertiary in Canada, an enterprising gentleman who was already known to be on the side of the Resistance.  Earlier in 2012, this website
had been praised by Fr. Emily as containing much valuable information and he recommended Franciscan tertiaries to visit it and make use of it.  

In December 2012, however, Fr. Emily suddenly changed his tune.  He wrote warning Third Order Franciscans to have nothing to do with the same website he had been recommending only a couple of months previously.

Why the sudden change?  Had the website been altered in any way?  Not at all.  All that had happened was that it had come to Fr. Emily’s attention that the man who had created the website, the TOSF Prefect in Toronto, Canada, supported the resistance.

Although, as Fr. Emily was forced to admit, the website was “not [being used] to attack Bishop Fellay or our Society” (i.e. it contained no information about the Resistance and was not partisan in any way), and that on the contrary, it did contain a lot of very good and useful things, yet the fact that it was run by a man who disagreed with the new line of Menzingen was enough to justify using his position of trust to attack its owner who dared to disagree with the party line.

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At this point, I'd like to recall that at the time, in December of 2012, Fr. Emily was running a retreat at Los Gatos, in which he promoted the book of Blessed Anne de Guigné, and the reason he did so, was to encourage the retreatants to contemplate the heroic virtue of this little French girl who had IMMEDIATELY assented to God's will, the moment she had realized that it was truly God's will.  

As admirable as this lesson is, in retrospect, what he was asking of the retreatants was to imitate Bl. Anne by never questioning the dictates of Menzingen.  His message was, that unquestioning obedience is so pleasing to God, that it outweighs all other concerns.  (He did not use those words, but this was without question the message that he endeavored to impress upon the retreatants.)

But, one might ask, what about one's concern for the Faith?

As I recall, no one asked him that question.  


.



There is more on this (from p.36-7):  




The Resistance: “People of Such Bad Faith!”

It is when we get to Fr. Emily’s most recent Third Order newsletter, however, that a real can of worms opens up. He dedicates this newsletter to the topic of - you’ve guessed it! - the Resistance! And more specifically, to telling his readers what a thoroughly bad lot we all are, not least the aforementioned Canadian gentleman, whom (for the unpardonable crime of sending around a two-line long email to some fellow Third Order members) he does not shrink from attacking by name!

“Of course, Mr. La Rosa continues to spread his venom of division among our members, like the enemy who sowed cockle in the fields of the Lord ... He goes so far as to ask for prayers that our dear Capuchin Fathers may join the Resistance...  These words of Mr La Rosa clearly reveal his spirit of dividing the family of our Third Order.  His spirit of division is obviously opposed to the spirit of St. Francis which is a spirit of peace, charity and union among brothers.”  (TOSF newsletter No 9, Feb. 2014)

Need we comment on this?  Besides the embarrassingly condescending tone and the simplistic ‘See Spot Run’ arguments, which appear to assume that his readers have all the maturity and wisdom of a six-year-old child (“Look at him! He’s causing division! He says bad things! He’s bad! St. Francis wouldn’t like him!”), please bear the above-quoted extract in mind when you read what else he says in the same letter, and see if you can spot the gigantic dose of hypocrisy!  



The embarrassingly condescending tone
and the simplistic ‘See Spot Run’ arguments,
which appear to assume that his readers
have all the maturity and wisdom of a six-year-old child
(“Look at him! He’s causing division!
He says bad things! He’s bad!
St. Francis wouldn’t like him!”)





After he has finished talking about one (named) individual spreading “venom” and being like the “enemy who sowed cockle,” Fr. Emily moves on to talking about the Resistance as a whole.

“The Resistance,” complains Fr. Emily, is:  “...pitifully launching deplorable, personal attacks against our Superiors and our Society ...we do not want to judge their intentions ... people of such bad faith!” (Ibid.)

As someone else recently remarked:  obviously it is hypothetically possible for someone to spread false information innocently.  But no one can innocently be in bad faith!  Thus, Fr. Emily himself here judges not only our actions but also our persons.  And as Fr. Emily himself says, in the same letter:

“As long as we see our opponents [making] personal attacks... our choice between the two parties is simple.” (Ibid.)

Like his Superiors, Fr. Emily is very quick to accuse his opponents of making ‘personal attacks’. Yet when one compares any number of articles by the Resistance about the neo-SSPX with articles by the neo-SSPX about the Resistance, the one thing that stands out a mile is precisely that our side does not make gratuitous personal attacks, whereas they do!

Why would we seek to attack persons;  in what way would that further our cause?

We are not concerned with the person, but with words, ideas, actions, teachings, doctrine.  

If Fr. Emily had not decided to talk such a lot of nonsense and to tar us all with such an unworthy brush, had he not provided us all with such a very clear example of the way in which the Menzingen Propaganda Machine works, it is very unlikely that he would have found his name gracing the pages of this newsletter!

It is not so much him as his crusade against the Resistance that is at issue. The reader can re-read this article and look for any ’personal attack’ against him which is not in reality a disputing of his specific words which he has written and published.

In a similar vein, readers of The Recusant will recall occasions (Burghclere, to name the last such) where Bp. Fellay himself has complained about being misquoted, misrepresented, or ‘personally attacked’, but he never gives his audience the benefit of even one example.  Here, Fr. Emily likewise gives not one single example of a “deplorable” personal attack, except in the sense that his whole letter is one big example of it, albeit not in the sense he intended it!


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The Recusant:
« Reply #53 on: April 11, 2014, 05:17:34 AM »
The multi-million dollar brand cannot be wasted on any seminary candidate! It is like geting into Oxbridge where either (big) money talks, one emerges from establishment families or one assembles copious references from 'respected' contemporary academics with whom one tries to ingratiate. Otherwise, smart candidates think of some very obsure subject to study where there is still some funding available and few takers.

The new Virginian curriculum will be very Rome-friendly. Any spirit of resistance or sign of sedevacantism will be a black mark, even being too concerned with the ideas of ABL instead of the spirit of Joseph Ratzinger. Students must be smart if they want a good career ahead of them; they have to study the trend. They will be drawn from the more progressive parishes and schools within the SSPX world and will have already conformed to the right model.  

The Recusant:
« Reply #54 on: April 11, 2014, 06:21:03 PM »
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I just spent an hour typing a reply to this and my system glitched and deleted the whole thing.  I did not keep a copy this time (usually I do).  So maybe I'll replay again later, and maybe I won't.



Quote from: Nobody
Quote from: Neil Obstat
.
Dear Nobody,  

You are making no sense here.

Quote from: Nobody
Neil Obstat,

Why are you treating SeanJohnson like that ?


Like what?

Quote
You sound so hot headed and full of bitter zeal.


I'm sorry I must have missed that.  Can you provide one example, or two?

Quote
And you  are wrong too. On this thread, you made at least one false accusation against SeanJohnson


So I'm wrong, am I?  I made two typos and I corrected them.  Are you referring to something else?  If so, it would be informative for you to identify it so I can have some clue what in the world you're talking about.  

Quote
and your posts came across as very proud and insulting.


And yours don't?  You're proudly insulting me with no evidence, and what, that's okay?

Quote
I don't care on which side of the fence you are,


What "fence" are you dreaming up now?  Does it have a name?

Quote
but I wish you were not part of the Resistance. I'd be ashamed of associating with you.


What is the Resistance, anyway?  Do you have a definition?  Are you telling me I should not be Catholic, or, are you saying I should not use any logic, to be more like you, for example?

Quote
Did you notice that SeanJohnson did NOT return the insults and bitterness ?


Do you need a list of those as well?

Quote
If you have not charity, you have NOTHING !

I come here to stay informed and occasionally engage in a respectful and objective discussion, not to be witness to someone ranting and raving about trivialities !


Gosh, I wish I could understand what you're specifically accusing me of.  

Should I make a list?  Because I doubt you could make one.  

He repeatedly questioned that there would be any more issues, and demanded someone to prove him wrong.  That's like saying, can you prove you have stopped beating you wife?  Or can you prove that they will not build a bridge over this river? Now that we have confirmation that the new Issue #15 is in process, and SeanJohnson was wrong, and I was right, you're defending his insolence and suspicions?  And that's what you think means charity?

I called him on it and he went nuts.  Is that my fault?  We even had a post from another member testifying to the copies being in process, but he wouldn't believe that -- not convincing enough for him.  So what's the big deal?  

What false accusation did I make, anyway?  Can you name it, or are you just happy with blanket statements like that?  

What bitterness are you referring to?  Is fact and logic foreign to your thinking?  

Sometimes logic can seem rough, but that's usually when you're on the erroneous side of the dividing line.  It seems to me you're pretty confused as to what charity means.  


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Dear Neil Obstat, here we go :

You've accused SeanJohnson of '..presuming..', '..lying..', '..half-cocked with a hot head and a short fuse..', '..you don't trust me..', '..non-thinking drivel from a mind full of mush..', '..reading the same fiction in the afternoon that +Fellay is..', ..but then you'd have to t-h-i-n-k..', '..making a spectacle of himself by proving how big his mouth is..', '..pathetic Johnson-person suffers from a malady..', nit picking on 'publication vs edition', 'anywhere on the internet'.. Is that enough proof for you that your posts sound uncharitable, hot headed and bitter ?

Regarding your false accusation : you said SeanJohnson in his OP was presuming that there would be no more issues of the Recusant. The only thing I read in that OP was a question, not a presumption.

Can you now list the insults that SeanJohnson threw at you in this thread, and which according to you justify an 'eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth' ?

Can you also tell me which part of my first post you found insulting, or illogic ?

It takes more to be Catholic than getting facts right, you also have to act in all patience and charity.

I have been looking forward myself to the next edition (or publication/issue/..) of the Recusant, and I have wondered myself whether there would be another one. Is that a crime ? That was the OP of SeanJohnson. You could have just replied like this :

Quote

I have seen the hard copy, hopefully the electronic copy will be put up soon.





Quote from: Nobody
Quote from: Neil Obstat
.
Dear Nobody,  

You are making no sense here.

Quote from: Nobody
Neil Obstat,

Why are you treating SeanJohnson like that ?


Like what?

Quote
You sound so hot headed and full of bitter zeal.


I'm sorry I must have missed that.  Can you provide one example, or two?

Quote
And you  are wrong too. On this thread, you made at least one false accusation against SeanJohnson


So I'm wrong, am I?  I made two typos and I corrected them.  Are you referring to something else?  If so, it would be informative for you to identify it so I can have some clue what in the world you're talking about.  

Quote
and your posts came across as very proud and insulting.


And yours don't?  You're proudly insulting me with no evidence, and what, that's okay?

Quote
I don't care on which side of the fence you are,


What "fence" are you dreaming up now?  Does it have a name?

Quote
but I wish you were not part of the Resistance. I'd be ashamed of associating with you.


What is the Resistance, anyway?  Do you have a definition?  Are you telling me I should not be Catholic, or, are you saying I should not use any logic, to be more like you, for example?

Quote
Did you notice that SeanJohnson did NOT return the insults and bitterness ?


Do you need a list of those as well?

Quote
If you have not charity, you have NOTHING !

I come here to stay informed and occasionally engage in a respectful and objective discussion, not to be witness to someone ranting and raving about trivialities !


Gosh, I wish I could understand what you're specifically accusing me of.  

Should I make a list?  Because I doubt you could make one.  

He repeatedly questioned that there would be any more issues, and demanded someone to prove him wrong.  That's like saying, can you prove you have stopped beating you wife?  Or can you prove that they will not build a bridge over this river? Now that we have confirmation that the new Issue #15 is in process, and SeanJohnson was wrong, and I was right, you're defending his insolence and suspicions?  And that's what you think means charity?

I called him on it and he went nuts.  Is that my fault?  We even had a post from another member testifying to the copies being in process, but he wouldn't believe that -- not convincing enough for him.  So what's the big deal?  

What false accusation did I make, anyway?  Can you name it, or are you just happy with blanket statements like that?  

What bitterness are you referring to?  Is fact and logic foreign to your thinking?  

Sometimes logic can seem rough, but that's usually when you're on the erroneous side of the dividing line.  It seems to me you're pretty confused as to what charity means.  


.


Dear Neil Obstat, here we go :

You've accused SeanJohnson of '..presuming..', '..lying..', '..half-cocked with a hot head and a short fuse..', '..you don't trust me..', '..non-thinking drivel from a mind full of mush..', '..reading the same fiction in the afternoon that +Fellay is..', ..but then you'd have to t-h-i-n-k..', '..making a spectacle of himself by proving how big his mouth is..', '..pathetic Johnson-person suffers from a malady..', nit picking on 'publication vs edition', 'anywhere on the internet'.. Is that enough proof for you that your posts sound uncharitable, hot headed and bitter ?

Regarding your false accusation : you said SeanJohnson in his OP was presuming that there would be no more issues of the Recusant. The only thing I read in that OP was a question, not a presumption.

Can you now list the insults that SeanJohnson threw at you in this thread, and which according to you justify an 'eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth' ?

Can you also tell me which part of my first post you found insulting, or illogic ?

It takes more to be Catholic than getting facts right, you also have to act in all patience and charity.

I have been looking forward myself to the next edition (or publication/issue/..) of the Recusant, and I have wondered myself whether there would be another one. Is that a crime ? That was the OP of SeanJohnson. You could have just replied like this :

Quote

I have seen the hard copy, hopefully the electronic copy will be put up soon.