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Author Topic: The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013  (Read 3182 times)

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Offline Ecclesia Militans

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Offline Machabees

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The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2013, 10:07:16 PM »
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  • Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
    The Recusant - Issue 7 - May/June 2013


    Another excellent editorial.

    TheRecusant.com, your insights, views, style, and diction are quite a beacon of light in these times of darkness and confusion.  I have referenced your website all over the place; with great feed back.

    Keep up the good work for our Lady and our Lord; everyone benefits.

    God bless.


    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #2 on: May 14, 2013, 10:20:56 PM »
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  • Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
    The Recusant - Issue 7 - May/June 2013



    This is great news!!  

    I don't have to go past the first paragraph before I have questions!!  

    This is my kind of thing. I guess you could say I'm a hooked Recusant.

    Quote

    “I had believed that you were disposed to leave till a later date the resolution of outstanding disagreements over certain points of the Council ...




    Whoooooaaa, Nellie!!   :cowboy:

    Why would B16 E-V-E-R want to "leave to a later date the resolution of
    outstanding disagreements over certain points of the Council"????????

    Now, I'm not a recently-fallen-off-the-turnip-truck but even I in my lowly
    state know that's just stupid.  S-T-U-P-I-D!!!  Postpone it?  Why?  Why
    would any Modernist IN POWER want to postpone something that can only
    come back to haunt him and make him ABANDON the Modernism he
    clings to for dear life?  Furthermore, why would any Modernist in power
    NOT simply PRETEND that he's going to postpone it in order to egg on
    the victims (the Society) with the off-chance that they will capitulate?  I
    mean, after all, they're just a bunch of capitulants!  At least any
    Modernist worth his salt is going to PROVIDE THE OPTION for the victim
    to live up to his name and capitulate!!  

    He'd be A FOOL NOT TO, for cryin' out loud!



    Quote
    And I committed myself in this perspective despite the fairly strong opposition in the ranks of the Society and at the price of substantial disruption.




    Well, that was a big mistake, wasn't it?  How about this, the next time
    you have a hair-brained idea like this, come on over to CI and give
    the members a chance to steer you in the right direction, okay, or
    even better yet, follow +W's advice and turn in your resignation and
    let someone competent take your place.  If you can find anyone.  If
    not, then ask +W, because he's ready, willing and able.

    He's been sitting in sackcloth and ashes for 5 years, thanks to you.
    You and your Zionist purse-stringers.



    Quote
    And I fully intend to continue to do my best to pursue this path...”



    Okay, stop the press!  He said he fully intends to continue to pursue
    the path of leaving till later the resolution of certain points of the
    Council -- such as what?  Whether a canonical normalization requires
    that you first accept ALL of the Council?   That part?? LG 21-25, like
    you quoted in your AFD 2 months before this Letter??



    Quote


    - Bp. Fellay, Letter to Benedict XVI, 17th June 2012




    This is going to be a lot of work.  That's not even the first PAGE!!  



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    Offline SeanJohnson

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #3 on: May 14, 2013, 10:20:57 PM »
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  • Recusant-

    This was well worth the wait.

    Excellent from start to finish.

    Thank You.
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #4 on: May 14, 2013, 10:27:41 PM »
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  • Quote from: Machabees
    Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
    The Recusant - Issue 7 - May/June 2013


    Another excellent editorial.

    TheRecusant.com, your insights, views, style, and diction are quite a beacon of light in these times of darkness and confusion.  I have referenced your website all over the place; with great feed back.

    Keep up the good work for our Lady and our Lord; everyone benefits.

    God bless.



    Hurry up and make sure you "reference" the E-M website linked in the
    OP where everyone can see the Recusants 1-7 so far.  

    TheRecusant.com does not have the issues available for viewing only
    Ecclesia Militans does!!



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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #5 on: May 15, 2013, 12:57:57 AM »
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  • What is it that makes each new Recusant so appealing?  



    I think I have an answer, at least it's a start:  vocabulary.

    Let me show you the KEY WORDS that make FROM THE
    DESK OF THE EDITOR a thing electrified, as per usual.....


    somewhat taken aback
    quite right, good and proper
    situation is shocking
    to be a little shocked
    most awful consequences
    reality which we now face
    owning up to a situation
    begin to deal with it
    intelligently and honestly
    reality is harsh
    outlook seemingly bleak
    grateful to Our Lord
    placed us in this era
    is really an honour
    great an opportunity
    faithful and steadfast
    be in His service
    hardships difficulties
    sentimental about a mere organization
    disinherited once more
    become too attached to what is human
    whole, unadulterated Catholic Faith!
    implicitly admitting
    institutional pride
    GK Chesterton
    this annoying weight off my back!
    human organization
    human weaknesses
    uncompromising defence of Tradition
     ‘official declarations’ ‘clarifications’ ‘press communiqués’
    pass censorship
    tiniest piece of evidence
    such officious, self-centred behaviour or clerical pride
    cost at least $25 million
    (cost at least £15 million ~ HAHAHAHAHAHA)
    “professional fundraising campaigns”
    whether to laugh or cry
    made a real commitment
    feel justified in refusing communion
    those with whom they disagree
    a one-off rarity
    “crime” of attending Mass said by Fr. Pfeiffer
    justification for such wickedness?
    entire apostolate founded on (justifiable) disobedience
    institution has become an end in itself
    Catholic Faith is no longer paramount
    no longer deserving of our support
    New Mass “legitimately promulgated”
    deserves your continuing support
    just secretly against Vatican II and the New Mass
    conciliar structures   [<--- a favorite term of Dr. Droleskey!]
    are openly against it
    proud, sinful rebels
    no matter
    jeopardising or contradicting
    trouble makers, rebels,
    malcontents, ne'er-do-wells,
    ‘far right infiltrators’,
    closet sedevacantists, open sedevacantists,
    Continentals vs. Anglo-Saxons,
    personality clashes amongst laity
    “evil influence” of Bishop Williamson
    “danger of a split”
    straightforward in their dealings
    “a loss of trust in authority”
    that which caused the loss
    Bishop Fellay and his entourage
    ‘illegal’ Masses in sitting rooms, garages, rented halls,
    preaching clear, fiery sermons,
    travelling many miles with a missionary zeal
    threats from on high
    personally against the revolution
    join the ‘naughty’ priests
    ultimately a suspicion of less worthy motives persists
    apathy
    fear for the future
    attachment to material comfort
    new Bishop who is something of a modernist
    easy and straightforward these days
    careful what you say!
    naughty disreputable slightly crazy
    looked down upon
    their more ‘respectable’ peers
    ultimately the only ones to persevere
    somewhere in the middle
    will have vanished within one generation
    Marian priests
    so-called ‘Church Papists’ in Elizabethan England.
    clear, firm preaching
    disobedient, illegal Mass centres
    forced to succuмb
    paraphrase Abp. Lefebvre
    by the inevitable logic of the thing and destroyed
    Let that not be us!




    If that looks like a long list, it's only the first 4 pages out of 32.
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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #6 on: May 16, 2013, 03:00:45 AM »
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  • Here's an interesting find:  Once you have read the article, you can pick
    any phrase out of that list and recall what part of the article where it was
    used.

    There is a reason for that:  No two phrases are identical.

    This is not poetry.  This is not repetitive (not like this present paragraph,
    that is!).  This is not hypnotic.  This is not subterfuge.  This is not
    meddlesome rhetoric designed to put you to sleep.  This is not laughable
    idiocy.  This is not stupid.  This is not dumbed-down.  This is not pompous.  
    This is not erudite.  This is not pretentious.  This is not abysmal.  There
    are thousands of things this is not, and no two of the things are identical.  
    In short, this is not Menzingen propaganda.

    That's why it makes for good reading.


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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #7 on: May 16, 2013, 03:48:26 AM »
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  • From PAGE 7 of Issue #7:




    Here is a great quick exercise for you to show an Accordista
    who just can't seem to "get it."  Write these two paragraphs out
    on two sides of a 3 x 5 index card, with "Spot the Difference!" on
    the top of both sides.  Make it look the same, that is, so that it is
    not so easy to notice the extra single word in the second paragraph.


    ======================

         "Spot the Difference!"

    1988:
    “We declare that we recognise the
    validity of the sacrifice of the Mass
    and the Sacraments celebrated with
    the intention to do what the Church
    does according to the rites indicated
    in the typical editions of the Roman
    Missal and the Sacramentary Rituals
    promulgated by Popes Paul VI and
    John-Paul II.”

    =======================

         "Spot the Difference!"

    2012:
    “We declare that we recognise the
    validity of the sacrifice of the Mass
    and the Sacraments celebrated with
    the intention to do what the Church
    does according to the rites indicated
    in the typical editions of the Roman
    Missal and the Sacramentary Rituals
    legitimately promulgated by Popes
    Paul VI and John-Paul II.”

    ========================



    Give the card to your Accordista friend and say, "Can you tell me
    what the difference is?"  After you get that point made, probably
    including the 'experience' that the Accordista could not notice the
    difference right away, and maybe you had to point it out before
    they go "Oh, yeah."  -- but that's a good thing, because an "oh,
    yeah moment" can be an open door for comprehension.  

    But don't lose momentum.  Move immediately into the question:  

    "So, with that one word added, do you know what the difference is?"

    They'll say, "What do you mean, what the difference is?"  

    This is also good, because it's a second open door, where you can
    step in and say, "Without that one word, as in 1988, THIS CHAPEL,
    and all the SSPX mass centers all over the world have a reason to
    exist."  Wait for them to recognize what you mean.  Be sure that
    they know what you're saying.  Without that word, they are going
    to Mass every week or perhaps more often, and they can do that
    because that one word is missing.  

    Then go for the close.  

    "When you add that one word, "legitimately promulgated," none
    of the SSPX mass centers, chapels, or independent Mass chapels
    have a right to exist.  You should be going to your local
    NovusOrdo parish instead."  

    Let that sink in, and their response will be definitive.  

    If they are shocked, that's a good thing.  You have something to
    work with.  You can step up to the next level, like the rest of the
    AFD, for example, because now you have established a point of
    reference, to which you can repeatedly revert whenever the
    trainee becomes doubtful or starts slipping back into Accordism.

    If, however, they are ambivalent about the implications such as
    that this one word being present means they're wasting their time
    going to a TLM, or, if they want to change the subject because
    they're bored with this one, then pick up your sandals, knock the
    dust off, and leave town, because you have lost them.


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    Offline PatrickG

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #8 on: May 16, 2013, 05:49:54 AM »
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  • I'd never heard of this before - an excellent find.
    Old-fashioned is good, modern is suicidal.
    - Bishop Richard N. Williamson.

    Offline Wessex

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #9 on: May 16, 2013, 05:58:35 AM »
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  • Menzingen has been eroding the act of necessity to the point of making one feel guilty being estranged from Rome and the diocesan establishment. This means ABL's 'badge of honour' must now be a 'symbol of shame' and only a programme of reparation will enlighten the Society ready for its ultimate conversion.

    Professionals in the art of subtlety have been busy on behalf of the leadership; the question being how easliy are the rank and file to be fooled. The priest-members to their shame are overlooking fundamental issues, proving that they are followers and not leaders. Surely, they must know they are in for a steady stream of instructions in the remaking of the Society, reminiscent of the  conciliar changes half a century ago.    

    Offline PatrickG

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #10 on: May 16, 2013, 06:00:45 AM »
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  • Quote from: Wessex
    Menzingen has been eroding the act of necessity to the point of making one feel guilty being estranged from Rome and the diocesan establishment. This means ABL's 'badge of honour' must now be a 'symbol of shame' and only a programme of reparation will enlighten the Society ready for its ultimate conversion.

    Professionals in the art of subtlety have been busy at work on behalf of the leadership; the question being how easliy are the rank and file to be fooled. The priest-members to their shame are overlooking fundamental issues, proving that they are followers and not leaders. Surely, they must know they are in for a steady stream of instructions in the remaking of the Society.    


    Very incisive and completely true.
    Old-fashioned is good, modern is suicidal.
    - Bishop Richard N. Williamson.


    Offline TheRecusant

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #11 on: May 16, 2013, 11:15:35 AM »
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  • Quote from: Machabees
    Quote from: Ecclesia Militans
    The Recusant - Issue 7 - May/June 2013


    Another excellent editorial.

    TheRecusant.com, your insights, views, style, and diction are quite a beacon of light in these times of darkness and confusion.  I have referenced your website all over the place; with great feed back.

    Keep up the good work for our Lady and our Lord; everyone benefits.

    God bless.


    Many thanks for the encouragement. And please pray that our efforts with the upcoming conference in London are suitably rewarded.

    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #12 on: May 16, 2013, 12:25:14 PM »
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  • Quote from: Neil Obstat

    What is it that makes each new Recusant so appealing?  



    I think I have an answer, at least it's a start:  vocabulary.

    Let me show you the KEY WORDS that make FROM THE
    DESK OF THE EDITOR a thing electrified, as per usual.....

    ...
    ‘far right infiltrators’,
    closet sedevacantists, open sedevacantists,
    Continentals vs. Anglo-Saxons,
    personality clashes amongst laity
    “evil influence” of Bishop Williamson
    “danger of a split”
    straightforward in their dealings
    “a loss of trust in authority”
    that which caused the loss
    Bishop Fellay and his entourage
    ‘illegal’ Masses in sitting rooms, garages, rented halls,
    preaching clear, fiery sermons,
    travelling many miles with a missionary zeal
    threats from on high
    personally against the revolution
    join the ‘naughty’ priests
    ultimately a suspicion of less worthy motives persists
    ...



    Quiz question:  

    After the bolded phrase, what 5 words follow in the sentence?  

     (1)       (2)      (3)      (4)          (5)      


    (Hint: these bolded 5 words are the subject and the answer's
    5 words are the predicate of the sentence.)




    If you really READ the article, don't be too surprised if you know
    the quiz question's answer without having to look it up!!  



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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #13 on: May 16, 2013, 12:34:35 PM »
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  • Quote from: PatrickG
    Quote from: Wessex
    Menzingen has been eroding the act of necessity to the point of making one feel guilty being estranged from Rome and the diocesan establishment. This means ABL's 'badge of honour' must now be a 'symbol of shame' and only a programme of reparation will enlighten the Society ready for its ultimate conversion.

    Professionals in the art of subtlety have been busy at work on behalf of the leadership; the question being how easily are the rank and file to be fooled. The priest-members to their shame are overlooking fundamental issues, proving that they are followers and not leaders. Surely, they must know they are in for a steady stream of instructions in the remaking of the Society.    


    Very incisive and completely true.



    Typical of Wessex.  Methinks he's a +Williamson understudy.

    The "fooling of the rank and file" gets more challenging with each
    Wessex post, as it does with each +Williamson conference or
    sermon or "Open Letter" or EC.   As the "2 men in white garments"
    could have said at the Ascension, "Things are lookin' up."

    The Menzingen-denizens must hate Wessex with a passion.  
    And when they confess to each other, they could say, 'hatred of
    Wessex is not a sin because it is justified,' or whatever, that way
    they can support each other's error.  That's what Modernists do
    in the confessional, tell the penitent that he has not sinned.  That
    used to make my dear mother cry, God rest her soul.





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    Offline Neil Obstat

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    The Recusant - Issue 7 - MayJune 2013
    « Reply #14 on: May 19, 2013, 01:01:50 AM »
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  • At the risk of quoting myself I'm going to quote myself.

    But there is a purpose to this madness!  This is a report of
    my first foray into the land of Accordism with
    The Exercise Card.



    I took The Card (described below) to a meeting of a dozen
    people, all trads, all getting together for sharing the Faith of
    Catholics.

    Two of them are known to me to be Accordistas.  I didn't
    want to upset them so I left them for last, but one by one, I
    shared The Card with everyone in the group...............


    ..guess what happened?  


    Okay, you'd never guess.  And after I tell you, you're not
    going to believe it.

    This tells me that what we have here, with the indubitable help
    of The Recusant is,



    We   Have   Hit   Pay   Dirt!!




    First, you have to read my earlier post to know what I'm
    talking about........





    Quote from: Neil Obstat



    From PAGE 7 of The Recusant, Issue #7:




    Here is a great quick exercise for you to show an Accordista
    who just can't seem to "get it."  Write these two paragraphs out
    on two sides of a 3 x 5 index card, with "Spot the Difference!" on
    the top of both sides.  Make it look the same, that is, so that it is
    not so easy to notice the extra single word in the second paragraph.


    ======================

         "Spot the Difference!"

    1988:
    “We declare that we recognise the
    validity of the sacrifice of the Mass
    and the Sacraments celebrated with
    the intention to do what the Church
    does according to the rites indicated
    in the typical editions of the Roman
    Missal and the Sacramentary Rituals
    promulgated by Popes Paul VI and
    John-Paul II.”

    =======================

         "Spot the Difference!"

    2012:
    “We declare that we recognise the
    validity of the sacrifice of the Mass
    and the Sacraments celebrated with
    the intention to do what the Church
    does according to the rites indicated
    in the typical editions of the Roman
    Missal and the Sacramentary Rituals
    legitimately promulgated by Popes
    Paul VI and John-Paul II.”

    ========================



    Give the card to your Accordista friend and say, "Can you tell me
    what the difference is?"  After you get that point made, probably
    including the 'experience' that the Accordista could not notice the
    difference right away, and maybe you had to point it out before
    they go "Oh, yeah."  -- but that's a good thing, because an "oh,
    yeah moment" can be an open door for comprehension.  

    But don't lose momentum.  Move immediately into the question:  

    "So, with that one word added, do you know what the difference is?"

    They'll say, "What do you mean, what the difference is?"  

    This is also good, because it's a second open door, where you can
    step in and say, "Without that one word, as in 1988, THIS CHAPEL,
    and all the SSPX mass centers all over the world have a reason to
    exist."  Wait for them to recognize what you mean.  Be sure that
    they know what you're saying.  Without that word, they are going
    to Mass every week or perhaps more often, and they can do that
    because that one word is missing.  

    Then go for the close.  

    "When you add that one word, "legitimately promulgated,"
    none of the SSPX mass centers, chapels, or independent Mass
    chapels have a right to exist.  You should be going to your local
    NovusOrdo parish instead."  

    Let that sink in, and their response will be definitive.  

    If they are shocked, that's a good thing.  You have something to
    work with.  You can step up to the next level, like the rest of the
    AFD, for example, because now you have established a point of
    reference, to which you can repeatedly revert whenever the
    trainee becomes doubtful or starts slipping back into Accordism.

    If, however, they are ambivalent about the implications such as
    that this one word being present means they're wasting their time
    going to a TLM, or, if they want to change the subject because
    they're bored with this one, then pick up your sandals, knock the
    dust off, and leave town, because you have lost them.









    Now, I took this card, as described above, to the meeting of me and
    the others.

    First, I showed it to our priest, who perhaps was a little tired, and it
    took him three times reading it, before he noticed the extra word,
    and it was only after I had given him the "hint" that there was an
    entire word extra in one of the versions.  But immediately, he said,
    that he recognizes the import of this one word, for it is precisely the
    issue of the sermon that +F gave on Feb. 2nd 2012, in which he
    admonished priests (not literally specifying only the priests of the
    SSPX) not to go off on their own after ordination because then they
    would not have supplied jurisdiction, and their sacraments would
    not be valid, and they would not be able to give absolution.  

    He agreed that because of that one word, no independent chapel in
    the world would have a right to exist, for there would be no state of
    necessity, and that everyone would be obliged to assist at Mass at an
    Indult chapel or an FSSP or even a NovusOrdoNewmass.  

    Bottom line: our own priest was very appreciative of this little
    exercise, and I suspect he is going to carry it on to additional work.

    You can take that as you will, but there are immediate implications,
    and those are the reasons that some independent priests were not
    happy with that sermon, and if they wrote to +Fellay they likely did
    not expect to receive any reply, and I have yet to hear of any priest
    in the world who has received any reply from him on this question.  

    My only conclusion from this fact is that apparently +F thinks himself
    invincible or unapproachable on this topic, and that he is not obliged
    to answer such questions.  He is above that, and he presumes
    himself to be master of all he says, such that anything he is asked is
    "as if he were the authority and thou art the subject," and "Yours
    is not to question why -- yours is but to do or die."




    Cannon Fodder Is Thy Name -- And Obedience Thy Game.



    I passed the card around, and got some interesting responses.  
    Everyone had to read it twice, some three times, a couple several
    times, and one took about 10 minutes, over and over and over,
    perhaps 20 times, but finally got it.  Everyone else in the group got
    the answer without any hints, except for Father, who was a bit tired,
    so he had an excuse.  

    One person said that one word could be here or there, but you know
    lawyers, and how they go into detail -- it would come down to how
    much you want to pay for the argument, but you never want to go
    into court, because that's always more expensive;  you want to
    settle out of court but you don't really know if you're going to win or
    lose.  This was a bit disappointing to me, because I don't think
    you're going to find any decent lawyer who would recommend that
    any trad group would propose this 2012 text to Rome, in lieu of the
    1988 version.  

    The key point is, that ABL rescinded his signature on the 1988
    version the next day, because it (and other things on the docuмent)
    was unacceptable. What would any thinking person say the
    chance is that ABL would have approved the 2012 text instead?  
    About the same chance as 'evolution' being true?  (--Which is
    something like 1 : 10^250, i.e., statistically zero?)




    Now for our prime suspects.  I gave The Card of Controversy
    to the Accordistas last, after everyone had gone and they were
    delaying their own departure.  They had no distraction.  But they
    could not get it.  They read it over and over and over and could not
    see anything different.  



    Riiiiight..  




    Who are they or rather, what would be their qualifications?  They
    are both professionals, one of whom is a university professor of
    linguistics.  Now, you tell me:  What's the chance that such a 'pro'
    would be unable to "Spot the Difference!" when all the other
    people in the room had spotted it okay, one with a little 'hint'?  
    Any statisticians out there?  Something like 1 : 1,000,000?

    (That says "one in a million" to the uninitiated.)

    Well, they couldn't get it.  I gave them a hint, same as Father.  Still
    no dice.




    Key principle at work here:  

    This Is Not A Matter Of Intelligence.


    We are talking about the WILL.  It's a matter of cold, hard will.  



    I said, "It's a word near the end."  Still no go.  Remember, this is a
    pro, whose job it is to teach college level students in language the
    meaning of words, and how important words are in context.  They
    could not find this word.  FINALLY, I pointed at the word.  What did
    they say?  

    "Oh, well, that.  Well, you have to remember that there was no deal,
    and that is very fortunate."  I asked them if they know where this
    came from. They said they knew.  Just to be sure, because they had
    no interest in pronouncing the source or the situation, I said the 1988
    text is what ABL signed on May 5th and then on May 6th, 1988 he
    took back his signature.

    They agreed they knew that.  But note: they would not say it them-
    selves, but only agreed that's what it was after I pronounced the fact
    of its identity for them, very respectfully, and very slowly, in a soft,
    smooth voice, not loud, not with an "attitude." And then the 2012
    version is +Fellay's, the proposal that he sent to Rome, and he is the
    one who added the word, "legitimate" to the text.

    They replied, "Well, he has since rejected this." I corrected them,
    "It was Rome who rejected it, not +Fellay."

    The thing that really gets me is, we had just been talking as a
    group together how Protestants jump topic when you get them into
    a corner and they know they have no reasonable answer, so they
    run off to another subject that they're more "comfortable" with.
    We just talked about that.. More later (at the end* of this post).

    They said, "No, +Fellay has since taken this back."  I asked them to
    please tell me when he did so, and on what occasion and how do I
    find a copy of that anywhere that I can read?  They replied that it
    was some other priest who was commenting on the letter of
    +Williamson who said that this AFD "SHOULD" be taken back by
    +Fellay.  I replied, "Well some other priest saying he 'should' take it
    back is not the same thing as +Fellay taking it back, is it?"  

    "The priest said that the wording was deficient, and it should be re-
    worked, but for now, there is no agreement, so we should be over
    this." [I guess it was Fr. Laisney saying "especially paragraph 7" and
    all that, which is his comment on the +W letter - correct me if I'm
    wrong.]

    I asked, "Do you know what the importance of that one word is?"  

    Their response:  "You have to remember that Bishop Fellay retracted
    this whole thing."  I told them we just talked about that, and it is not
    something that +Fellay has done but someone else has said that
    he should do it, correct?

    Their reply?  "You are just so hostile."  This is what liberals always
    do, when they find themselves in a disproven point, and cannot give
    a satisfactory answer, they resort to ad hominem.

    Most of the others in the group were very happy to find the different
    word, and they reported their find with a smile.  I told them,
    "Congratulations!  100%!"  And they were pleased.  

    Now I am sure that whatever other exercises I come up with, I'll
    have to be sure to avoid the Accordistas, because they are not going
    to want to play this game.  Anyone who enjoys learning the truth is
    "against +Fellay" or "difficult" or "hateful of the Society" or
    "disobedient," etc., etc.

    At the risk of quoting myself again I'm going to quote myself again:

    Quote

    If, however, they are ambivalent about the implications such as
    that this one word being present means they're wasting their time
    going to a TLM, or, if they want to change the subject because
    they're bored with this one, then pick up your sandals, knock the
    dust off, and leave town, because you have lost them.



    What happened to me today was, the Accordistas got more chance
    than anyone else in the room and are FAR MORE QUALIFIED to be
    able to SPOT THE DIFFERENCE!  --but were unable to do so.  Once
    I spilled the beans and told them what the word was, they were
    ambivalent 'ALL GET OUT.'  They were not so much as interested in
    what the implications of this one word are.  They did not want to
    "debate."  I said, "Debate?  Who's asking to debate?  I would like
    to know if you are aware of the implications of this one word, and
    you are unwilling to talk about it, and you were unwilling to even
    acknowledge its existence."  

    We did not even get to the point of going to any TLM, which is what
    they do.  Actually, I don't really know, perhaps they also go to their
    friendly neighborhood NovusOrdoNewmass AS WELL AS the TLM.  I
    doubt they would be willing to admit it if they do.  They did not want
    to change the subject. They simply did not want to have any further
    conversation. They would not respond when I waved goodbye.  They
    have in the past shared with me the fact that they are Divine Mercy
    fans and they really appreciate St. Faustina Kowalska.

    They made sure not to be present on Divine Mercy Sunday, when
    our pastor took a few minutes to give a scathing fact sheet of why
    the DMS is not part of our routine, so I guess they don't want to
    know about that, either, FWIW.





    Now to review the excellent post of Wessex, for if you did not see
    the deeper meaning of what his words offer, perhaps after reading
    the above description, you will know what he meant.  When Wessex
    makes a post, it's not the sandbox version.  You need to be in the
    advanced class to see the light................




    Post
    Quote from: Wessex

    Menzingen has been eroding the act of necessity to the point of making one feel guilty being estranged from Rome and the diocesan establishment. This means ABL's 'badge of honour' must now be a 'symbol of shame' and only a programme of reparation will enlighten the Society ready for its ultimate conversion.

    Professionals in the art of subtlety have been busy on behalf of the leadership; the question being how [easily] are the rank and file to be fooled. The priest-members to their shame are overlooking fundamental issues, proving that they are followers and not leaders. Surely, they must know they are in for a steady stream of instructions in the remaking of the Society, reminiscent of the  conciliar changes half a century ago.    





    Let's take this in parts.  



    "Menzingen has been eroding the act of necessity to the point of
    making one feel guilty being estranged from Rome and the
    diocesan establishment."


    It seems to me that they would have said to ABL, "Don't you
    feel a little guilty being estranged from Rome and the
    diocesan establishment?"
     If you were a devil sitting on ABL's
    shoulder, wouldn't you give that one-liner a shot?  

    Wouldn't you ??????





    "This means ABL's 'badge of honour' must now be a
    'symbol of shame' and only a programme of reparation will
    enlighten the Society ready for its ultimate conversion."


    A SYMBOL OF SHAME.  I've got to write this down.  I hope that
    Wessex can pitch in and give Ed a hand.  I'm sure he could use
    the friendship.  Birds of a feather, you know.............

    Only a programme of reparation will SHINE THE LIGHT OF TRUTH
    on the Society, such that it would be all dressed up and somewhere
    to go!
     You know, like getting the Paschal Lamb ready for the
    ceremony, "Leading the Lamb to Slaughter."  

    BTW, we should be aware that "conversion" is now re-defined to
    mean "a burnt offering" or "libation" or "h0Ɩ0cαųst"  ---  wait --- I
    think that one is already copyrighted.  Sorry.  And we can't say
    "sacrifice" because that has been VERBOTEN since the unclean
    spirit of Vat.II flapped it's wings into the Sanctuary, you know,
    at Econe or whatever.  How "hateful" of me.  Shame, shame.




    "Professionals in the art of subtlety have been busy on
    behalf of the leadership;"


    That one speaks for itself.  Just give it a moment to sink in.




    "..the question being:  How easily are the rank and file
    to be fooled?"


    With the help of The Recusant, it's going to be pretty dern'd tough.   :cowboy:

    An' Wessex don't hurt none, neither.   :cowboy:



    "The priest-members to their shame are overlooking
    fundamental issues, proving that they are followers
    and not leaders."


    You know folks, this really looks to me like we're seeing the stuff
    of legend happen before our eyes.  If Jeremiah Himself were here
    today, he would have to stay up pretty late, and get up pretty early
    to get a leg up on some of these words.  Just sayin'..........



    The punch line should be heard round the world:  



    Quote

    "Surely, they must know

    they are in for a steady

    stream of instructions in

    the remaking of the Society,

    reminiscent of the conciliar

    changes half a century ago."







    Of course, to any Accordista worth his salt, anyone who dares to
    make this observation "is so hateful of the Society."  Never mind
    that true LOVE of the Society would lead one who knows these
    things to at least try to warn someone.  Never mind.  Love has
    been re-defined, apparently.  Now, it's "hate."



    Many thanks to Wessex.  I might be slow, but I'll get there.................



    At least I don't have to wonder where I'm going!!  HAHAHAHAHAHA




    *At the end:
    Tele, Incred, and the gang will be pleased to know, that a certain topic
    had come up during our group meeting, when the fact that the modern
    Jєωs celebrate Chanukah, but they do not recognize the Scriptural
    value of the Macchabees.  They say those two books are "apocryphal."
    At that point, our two resident Accordistas chimed in with a defense of
    our "elder brothers in the faith" (not using that term, though) and said
    that Jєωs consider the roots of Hanukkah an historical fact, but they do
    not treat it as a "religious" event.  I pointed out to them that the "fact"
    they MUST recognize is none other than a MIRACULOUS event, since
    it was the oil not running out for 8 days (nine altogether which is why
    they have 9 branches on ALL the MODERN menorahs), and this
    undeniable miracle could be nothing other than a RELIGIOUS event.  
    Our Accordistas had to back off, for they were stuck.  And they could
    not "jump topic" because we were on a scheduled discussion so the
    next item was not to be of their choosing.  So they went mute.  It was
    most edifying to see.  They had tried to say that "We Catholics have
    lots of miracles that are not part of Scripture." I said, okay, like the
    miracle of Lepanto or the miracle of the sun at Fatima or all those of
    Padre Pio or St. Anthony of Padua, the list can go on and on, but those
    are all things that happened after Scripture was written.  The miracle
    at the root of Chanukah happened hundreds of years before the time
    of Jesus, and there are two books written about it that the Church has
    declared are of Scripture, but the modern Jєωs who rejected Our Lord
    also rejected these books, as do the Protestants because the contain
    the basis for the doctrine of Purgatory, but the most CONSPICUOUS
    fact is that Protestants take sides with those who committed deicide
    and do so in defiance of the authority of the Church that God gives us.  
    IOW:  how 'hateful' of me.  Imagine that, insisting on the truth?  God
    forbid!



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