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Author Topic: Status of the resistance in 2019  (Read 7969 times)

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Offline Matthew

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Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
« Reply #60 on: February 09, 2019, 08:33:12 AM »
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  • Paranoid or secret.
    Can't find a mass locations, can't find contacts, seems to be by invitation only.

    Rubbish. You have hundreds of contacts right here on CathInfo. Everyone knows I work with Bp. Zendejas, as is evidenced by the fact I get plenty of e-mails and phone calls on his behalf.

    What are you a Pfeifferite (that's his worn-out propaganda line you're spewing), or perhaps you just like to make trouble?

    I can only conclude that you are a troublemaker of some sort. Because if you were innocently seeking a faithful priest and a valid Mass, you would have done what dozens of other "innocent Mass seekers" have done: politely PM me or some other CathInfo member asking where the nearest Bp. Zendejas-affiliated chapel is, while giving me your general location. Many have done this and have been taken care of.

    Instead, you go the drama queen route and complain to the whole Internet instead of asking a simple question. This does suggest what you're really after.

    One bishop (and a single priest helper) can only serve so many locations, however. The sellout by the SSPX has dealt Tradition a HUGE blow which can't be understated. Many souls will suffer now, one way or another.

    The world of Tradition has been thrown back to the early 1970's. The situation is similar. The main choices are "stay with the V2 church and hold your nose, start/attend a small Trad chapel, or stay home alone on Sunday"

    True, the SSPX isn't as bad as the Novus Ordo, but I said similar, not identical. But BOTH are apologetic of the Conciliar Church and Vatican II -- and in that respect, the situation is the same.

    We must reject Vatican II completely, with all its works, and all its display. Yes, I'm choosing those words on purpose. We should reject Vatican II EVERY BIT AS MUCH as we reject satan himself.

    The SSPX, as an organization, has (past tense) ceased to do this. That is a fact.

    True, there is some residual good to be found in the SSPX, but they're basically finished. Put a fork in it; it's done. The organization has been compromised from the top. They are marching constantly towards full union with the Conciliar Church, which is actually partway complete. The "deal" we've been waiting for these past 7 years is not "long-a-coming" -- it is actually happening, in stages, piecemeal, so as not to alarm the Faithful and prove the Resistance correct. Diabolically clever!

    The Resistance is nothing more -- or less -- than the non-Sedevacantist branch of the Traditional Movement extended in time into 2019 and beyond.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #61 on: February 09, 2019, 08:39:59 AM »
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  • What is the Traditional Movement?

    The short answer is, "A movement by which Catholics kept the Faith during the post-Vatican II great apostasy."

    It has always been defined by these 3 traits, from the VERY BEGINNING (1970):

    1. Knowledge of the danger of the new Conciliar Religion coming out of Vatican II, leading to complete aloofness from the Conciliar Church and its novelties, structures, masses, and personnel -- even if it means staying home alone on Sunday!
    2. Seeking out sure and certain Priests, Masses and Sacraments -- that is to say, everything done pre-Vatican II. Also holding to Traditional Catholic practices, morality, etc.
    3. Knowing that Traditional Catholics don't need permission from Rome or the Pope to keep the Faith.


    If you fail to meet any of these, you are not a Traditional Catholic. You might be a nice person, you might be conservative, you might be a fan of the Latin Mass, but you are an outsider to the Traditional Movement.



    For decades, the SSPX was the largest force in the Traditional Movement. But by 2012, they began to change into more of a "conservative" outlet like the FSSP or other Indult groups, since they began failing hard on #1 and #3.

    The Resistance is just the remnants of the SSPX who want to stay in the Traditional Catholic movement and hold fast to its principles, which were personified in the great Archbishop Lefebvre. The Resistance is not the same thing as the Catholic Church (there are Catholics outside of the Resistance) but it is certainly part of the 2,000 year old Catholic Church.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #62 on: February 09, 2019, 09:02:33 AM »
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  • I might be wrong.  In which case the resistance will have better fruits and thrive over the long term.  But over the last 5 years my predictions have been correct.  I predicted from the get-go that a bunch of people resisting something that did not actually happen would very soon start resisting (finding fault) in each other.  Which is exactly what happened.

    You were wrong.
    You claim that the sellout hasn't happened. I say it has. Oh, they haven't signed on any dotted line with huge fanfare, but they're doing something even more diabolically clever: making a deal with Rome piecemeal. Each piece isn't big enough to drop anyone's jaw, or get any SSPX Trads to jump ship. It's death by a thousand cuts, or "frog boiling".
    Just look at all the agreements with Rome over the past few years. Others have actually catalogued them. I'm sure someone could find the list for you. They are giving explicit or tacit approval to each of the Sacraments given by the SSPX, one by one.

    How can you say "nothing has happened"? That's insane.
    A low-key, secret or piecemeal deal over 10 years is still a sellout.
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    Offline St Paul

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #63 on: February 09, 2019, 09:07:25 AM »
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  • Exactly.
    I have to PM you to find out where and when masses are.  Why aren't they listed on a website for the sajm somewhere?  I travel a lot and it sure would be nice to have a listing rather than having to ask you every time i travel.
    Which is why i said what i said.
     no attack intended.  Just would like to go to mass.

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #64 on: February 09, 2019, 09:11:59 AM »
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  • You were wrong.
    You claim that the sellout hasn't happened. I say it has. Oh, they haven't signed on any dotted line with huge fanfare, but they're doing something even more diabolically clever: making a deal with Rome piecemeal. Each piece isn't big enough to drop anyone's jaw, or get any SSPX Trads to jump ship. It's death by a thousand cuts, or "frog boiling".
    Just look at all the agreements with Rome over the past few years. Others have actually catalogued them. I'm sure someone could find the list for you. They are giving explicit or tacit approval to each of the Sacraments given by the SSPX, one by one.

    How can you say "nothing has happened"? That's insane.
    A low-key, secret or piecemeal deal over 10 years is still a sellout.
    I would be interested in seeing this list. I know one of those things is their change in position on the Validity of the New Rite of Episcopal Consecrations in 2005.
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)


    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #65 on: February 09, 2019, 09:12:31 AM »
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  • Exactly.
    I have to PM you to find out where and when masses are.  Why aren't they listed on a website for the sajm somewhere?  I travel a lot and it sure would be nice to have a listing rather than having to ask you every time i travel.
    Which is why i said what i said.
     no attack intended.  Just would like to go to mass.


    I'm glad to hear that.

    There just aren't that many. Attempts have been made to create a "directory" but a directory of 8 Mass centers is kind of a joke. I might as well just list Bp. Zendejas' Mass locations here:

    Main chapels/priories/regional HQs with weekly Mass:

    Houston (La Marque) 9:00 AM Sundays
    Connecticut

    Weekly or near-weekly Mass:
    St. Mary's, KS

    Mission chapels with monthly Mass:
    Philadelphia
    San Antonio (Seguin)  Mass 1st Sundays at 4:00 PM, Confession 30 min. before Mass
    Toronto
    Natural Bridge Station, VA.  Masses: 1st Sundays at noon, Confession 30 min. before Mass

    Fr. Girouard is in the Northwest
    Fr. Morel is in Louisiana
    Fr. Voigt is in Minnesota and perhaps Syracuse.

    Apologies if I've left any out. I don't exactly have a sheet with all the Mass locations on it.
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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #66 on: February 09, 2019, 09:13:58 AM »
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  • Exactly.
    I have to PM you to find out where and when masses are.  Why aren't they listed on a website for the sajm somewhere?  I travel a lot and it sure would be nice to have a listing rather than having to ask you every time i travel.
    Which is why i said what i said.
     no attack intended.  Just would like to go to mass.
    I thought Resistance masses are included in the Traditional Mass Directory on traditio.com....?
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #67 on: February 09, 2019, 09:18:17 AM »
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  • I thought Resistance masses are included in the Traditional Mass Directory on traditio.com....?

    The chapel I'm coordinator for is in that directory. I don't know about the others.

    Actually Traditio loves Resistance and independent chapels. We get a smiley face and everything. SSPX gets the frowny face. Unfortunately, they were a bit premature in their slamming of the SSPX. (no, they weren't far-seeing. They were just premature. They were talking about "hybrid Motu messes" in the SSPX well before 2012, which is ridiculous and had no basis in reality). But I guess that doesn't matter now; they now have something to complain about in the SSPX, so they are accidentally correct now.
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    Offline Marie Teresa

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #68 on: February 09, 2019, 10:14:36 AM »
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  • I might as well just list Bp. Zendejas' Mass locations here:


    Apologies if I've left any out. I don't exactly have a sheet with all the Mass locations on it.
    Plus once a month in Natural Bridge Station, VA.  
    Masses: 1st Sunday of each month at noon
    Confession 30 minutes before Mass

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #69 on: February 09, 2019, 12:28:56 PM »
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  • Exactly.
    I have to PM you to find out where and when masses are.  Why aren't they listed on a website for the sajm somewhere?  I travel a lot and it sure would be nice to have a listing rather than having to ask you every time i travel.
    Which is why i said what i said.
     no attack intended.  Just would like to go to mass.

    They probably don't have the manpower to create/maintain the directory. Volunteers are scarce, or already allocated elsewhere.
    Samuel Loeman, who had started a directory, recently had another meltdown and shut down his site (for the umpteenth time) so now that's gone.
    Bp. Zendejas' main chapel in Texas (La Marque) which was actually purchased (it wasn't given by a parishioner, nor is it owned by a parishioner) doesn't have a website or online presence. When people want to know about Mass times there, they end up on the website of the satellite mission chapel 3.5 hours away (St. Dominic's), and end up e-mailing or phoning me.
    Volunteers are scarce. Everything is scarce. Tradition has been thrown back to the starting line, really. But for our part we just need to keep plodding forward, knowing that we really have no other choice. We do our best, working and sweating to advance God's kingdom in whatever ways we can, using our talents, and depending on God to give the increase. But even if we fail, God will be pleased with us for our efforts. 
    Always remember: God doesn't demand results. That's worldly bosses you're thinking of. What God demands is our heart, and our efforts.

    The Catholic Faith must continue until the end. We can't give up.
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    Offline Meg

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #70 on: February 09, 2019, 12:49:55 PM »
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  • Samuel Loeman, who had started a directory, recently had another meltdown and shut down his site (for the umpteenth time) so now that's gone.


    According to the Tradidi website, Samuel has decided not to shut down the website after all. So it's going as usual. That is, until the next time he gets upset with Bp. Williamson.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29


    Offline hollingsworth

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #71 on: February 09, 2019, 12:56:39 PM »
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  • Quote
    According to the Tradidi website, Samuel has decided not to shut down the website after all. So it's going as usual. That is, until the next time he gets upset with Bp. Williamson.

    Thanks for this, Meg.  Is Samuel Loeman, perhaps, an Eskimo?

    Offline St Paul

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #72 on: February 09, 2019, 11:06:05 PM »
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  • I'm glad to hear that.

    There just aren't that many. Attempts have been made to create a "directory" but a directory of 8 Mass centers is kind of a joke. I might as well just list Bp. Zendejas' Mass locations here:

    Main chapels/priories/regional HQs with weekly Mass:

    Houston (La Marque) 9:00 AM Sundays
    Connecticut

    Weekly or near-weekly Mass:
    St. Mary's, KS

    Mission chapels with monthly Mass:
    Philadelphia
    San Antonio (Seguin)  Mass 1st Sundays at 4:00 PM, Confession 30 min. before Mass
    Toronto
    Natural Bridge Station, VA.  Masses: 1st Sundays at noon, Confession 30 min. before Mass

    Fr. Girouard is in the Northwest
    Fr. Morel is in Louisiana
    Fr. Voigt is in Minnesota and perhaps Syracuse.

    Apologies if I've left any out. I don't exactly have a sheet with all the Mass locations on it.
    A good start, but much is left out.
    Where and when are all these 8 masses?  Contact information?
    What about a "post it" on the top of cathinfo, that has a perpetual listing of these 8 locations?  The coordinators or the priests would write in and provide you with up to date data.  Can it be that hard to add this?
    This way no one has to PM anyone, anyone interested can find a mass if they travel to the area or are leaving another location (fssp, sspx, pfeiffer, etc), and it makes the masses not seem secretive or by invitation only.

    Offline poche

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #73 on: February 11, 2019, 12:24:27 AM »
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  • Paranoid or secret.
    Can't find a mass locations, can't find contacts, seems to be by invitation only.
    I think that if you are going to be a mass coordinator for this type of group then you should make yourself known so that other people can know about you and that they can take advantage of the opportunity to assist at the Holy Mass. Also it should be remembered;
    From the Code of Canon Law;
    Can.  1221 Entry to a church is to be free and gratuitous during the time of sacred celebrations.
    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P4H.HTM

    Offline Maria Regina

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    Re: Status of the resistance in 2019
    « Reply #74 on: February 11, 2019, 03:54:28 AM »
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  • I think that if you are going to be a mass coordinator for this type of group then you should make yourself known so that other people can know about you and that they can take advantage of the opportunity to assist at the Holy Mass. Also it should be remembered;
    From the Code of Canon Law;
    Can.  1221 Entry to a church is to be free and gratuitous during the time of sacred celebrations.
    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P4H.HTM
    Could the open publication of Traditional Latin Mass times and locations pose a problem with a possible fαℓѕє fℓαg shooting?

    Do potential Sunday Mass visitors, guests, and potential catechumen need to be vetted?

    What did the Early Church during the Apostolic times do?
    Didn't they excuse all catechumen from the Divine Liturgy at a certain time?

    Were not the doors guarded and locked so that if you came late, you would not be admitted?

    In a sense, with Francis hobnobbing with Muslims, Jєωs, Buddhists, Protestants, atheists, and other anti-Catholic religions, we are in hostile times right now. We must be vigilant and take care.
    Lord have mercy.