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Author Topic: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples  (Read 2218 times)

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Offline SeanJohnson

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SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
« on: August 24, 2019, 08:34:17 AM »
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  • A few days ago, it was reported that the SSPX had sold its church in Syracuse, NY in order to use the local conciliar church, and that the old SSPX church had subsequently become a mosque: https://www.cathinfo.com/sspx-resistance-news/beware-st-mary's-kansas/

    Now Non Possumus is reporting that the SSPX has sold St. Michael's Church in Erie, PA, and that it has fallen into the hands of a Protestant sect: http://nonpossumus-vcr.blogspot.com/2019/08/la-iglesia-st-michaels-de-la-fsspx-en.html

    I have some questions (which are not accusations):

    1) According to the old CIC, it is only a diocesan bishop who can reduce a consecrated church to profane use.  Were these churches ever consecrated?  

    2) If so, did the local diocesan bishops involved reduce these buildings to profane use?  The local bishops would obviously be aware, since the SSPX is now using diocesan churches for its Masses (What a great way to ease the people into the conciliar church...literally!).

    3) How many more SSPX churches will be shed in order to use conciliar facilities?

    4) What were the local reactions of SSPX faithful (or were the labotomized zombies numb to conciliarization)?

    5) What was the sales pitch to the people in Erie and Syracuse to justify the move to diocesan churches?

    When the SSPX was traditional (at least outwardly so), roughly until 2007-2009 (+/-), nobody would have objected to using conciliar churches for Mass, because it was viewed more as a conquest than compromise: We have true priests saying the true Mass in a church that was built for it.  It was a victory.

    But now, with the ralliement added into the historical context, and the aim of SSPX integration -no longer conversion of an occupying enemy!- in view, such is no longer the case: It is the SSPX which is being converted, and that is the reason for the changed perception of Masses in conciliar buildings:

    We know the SSPX is not trying to convert the modernists (did not Fr. Pagliarani announce it was no longer necessary for Rome to convert in order to strike a deal?!), while the modernists are being quite successful in converting the SSPX: "What matters most is that there no longer be rejection in their hearts..." (Fr. Cottier regarding Campos).  

    And in fact, if one reads the scalding rebuttal of the young SSPX man married in a diocesan church in Canada found in the Remnant comments section, he rebukes the old SSPXers, and declares the new generation of SSPXers do not suffer from the combat mentality of the previous generation; they are no longer "embittered."

    Recall that in the 6 conditions (later reduced to only 1, which has already been ceded), the SSPX was willing to surrender to the local bishops permission to build church properties.  Their consent was necessary.  If the justification for abandoning these churches and moving into conciliar abodes was that these SSPX churches were in disrepair, and would cost too much to fix (similar to the lies regarding the seminary in Winona being unfit), did the diocesan bishops block the building of new chapels, with the SSPX knuckling under them?  

    Or did the SSPX willingly move into the conciliar buildings simply because the diocesan bishops invited them to abandon their old churches (which were still perfectly fit for worship, as their new tenants evince!!), and the Society wants to show how "approved" and "united" they are with the local heretics?
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."


    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #1 on: August 24, 2019, 08:41:58 AM »
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  • Undeserved though it is, may God have mercy on us all.


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #2 on: August 24, 2019, 09:17:24 AM »
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  • 5) What was the sales pitch to the people in Erie and Syracuse to justify the move to diocesan churches?

    6) Is the SSPX "paying rent" to its conciliar landlords?  If so, what are the terms of the "lease?"

    7) Naturally, the SSPX pastors in these two locations will be vigorously condemning the modernism of the local bishop and clergy from the pulpits of the conciliar churches they are renting.   ;)
    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #3 on: August 24, 2019, 10:04:39 AM »
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  • They ought to sell off property eddy stone and move out of the land of Moslems and pagans for safety of families.  Catholics are moving out of the area to south jersey. Use common sense.  It was originally Protestant anyway and it’s history started over real estate dispute.  Plenty of real estate in Swedesboro, NJ.  Area
    May God bless you and keep you

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #4 on: August 24, 2019, 10:33:27 AM »
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  • Most traditional Catholics st st Jude’s are from New Jersey anyway. Swedesboro, NJ , Salem County, NJ.  , cherry hill and even north jersey.  Sell st Jude’s and now is good time to buy real estate.  
    St Joseph’s in Swedesboro, NJ., St Joseph’s in Woodstown, NJ , St Mary’s in Malaga, NJ are pre Vatican built

    No need for schools too much trouble besides everyone home schools. No need for organized sports either when work, pray, fast should be encouraged.  Sports and recreation should be with family and friends.  Girls should learn to cook too.  

    We need Mass and sacraments in our area.  
    May God bless you and keep you


    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #5 on: August 24, 2019, 12:05:12 PM »
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  • Shedding the humble chapels built by the toil and sweat of real traditional Catholics...



    is just another phase of the neo-SSPX's transformation.


    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline confederate catholic

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #6 on: August 24, 2019, 04:16:53 PM »
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  • 1- the sspx moved to the school site for mass long ago 10yrs. They didn't sell to Muslims at least not directly as far as I understand it was sold to a person.
    قامت مريم، ترتيل وفاء جحا و سلام جحا

    Offline confederate catholic

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #7 on: August 24, 2019, 04:36:57 PM »
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  • The decision to move all the masses to the school was an idiotic one with no thought to the property value (the Church was buying up property around the Church), the school and property was an investment in the future, but it was too much money,  so instead of dropping it, they made the decision@11 years ago to be based out of the school and sell off the Church and houses around it. Even though they owned the Church and houses but needed to sink massive amounts into the school that they didn't yet own. DUMB. Frankly no one have a &#$@ about the people who actually went to the Church for @30 years and they lost big numbers of the old timers. Now stuck in a school they're up to multiple masses that no one can fit in, no choice but to find a place for mass. So school first mass second, way to prioritize
    قامت مريم، ترتيل وفاء جحا و سلام جحا


    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #8 on: August 24, 2019, 04:52:56 PM »
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  • Hello CC-

    Thank you for posting this additional information.  If it is true that the SSPX sold the one church 10 years ago, then I agree the two recent stories on NP are not evidence of a trend, as it seemed.

    Rom 5: 20 - "But where sin increased, grace abounded all the more."

    Offline confederate catholic

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #9 on: August 24, 2019, 04:55:36 PM »
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  • Sorry, they bought the school then, then they moved mass to the school. They're not using the Church for some time. The sale is new. They sold the houses first over time
    قامت مريم، ترتيل وفاء جحا و سلام جحا

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #10 on: August 24, 2019, 06:01:35 PM »
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  • The SSPX is saying Mass in a local Conciliar Church building? Seriously?

    How can the SSPX faithful be OK with this? Have they lost their minds?

    Does the priest distribute communion from the tabernacle that was consecrated at a (doubtful) Novus Ordo Mass?

    Do the SSPX faithful sweep and purify the area first before they have Mass, since Communion in the Hand is known FOR A FACT to result in a large number of particles (or Particles) on the ground after Mass?

    Whether you think the Novus Ordo is invalid, doubtful, or certainly valid -- one of those 2 issues should be a problem for you.

    If the Novus Ordo is invalid, you might get mere bread during your Tridentine Mass. If it's valid, then congratulations! You're stepping on countless Sacred Particles which are the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

    That's why I'm completely against shared facilities for Novus Ordo/Tridentine Masses. Have your Mass in a converted garage or warehouse if you must, but DON'T share a "church" with the Novus Ordo.

    And there's another problem which is a close 3rd: the ubiquitous Novus Ordo wealth/popularity (Trads are less than 1% compared to the # that say the Novus Ordo is right), perception of the Novus as "normal", and Conciliar propaganda, art, and events advertised all over the place. Trads are going to absorb this.
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    Offline 007

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #11 on: August 24, 2019, 08:34:43 PM »
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  • I lived in Syracuse for 3 years and the chapel location was a real hell hole, I witnessed two murder crime scenes one block away and during a procession a guy went into a restaurant with a rifle  and the cops hit him with a stun  gun. During all night adoration this local hobo  came into the church at 3am
    And wouldn't leave until I gave him some cash,  I'm happy no one has to go back there
    But not to a novus ordo church.

    Offline Seraphina

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #12 on: August 24, 2019, 11:29:23 PM »
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  • I lived in Syracuse for 3 years and the chapel location was a real hell hole, I witnessed two murder crime scenes one block away and during a procession a guy went into a restaurant with a rifle  and the cops hit him with a stun  gun. During all night adoration this local hobo  came into the church at 3am
    And wouldn't leave until I gave him some cash,  I'm happy no one has to go back there
    But not to a novus ordo church.
    Is the school and n.o. church in a safer area?  All night adoration at an SSPX chapel I attended years ago was eventually changed to First Friday - midnight adoration.  They wanted at least two adult men who were physically fit to be present every hour, but in the end, couldn’t find even one.  Often, people would sign up and never show.  Once, I signed up for 11:00-12:00 along with a family of four and one single man.  The family left early because one of the children got sick.  The man didn’t show.  They asked if I’d was okay with it, and suggested the woman stay and the husband come back at midnight when the two men arrived.  I said, no, I’ll be okay for 20 minutes.  To make a long story short, I was there with Our Lord, my guardian angel, and a noisy cricket until 6:00am when the priest showed up to say his prayers before 8:30 First Saturday Mass.  When I called the priory later in the week to tell him what had happened, he chewed out the men from the pulpit next Sunday.  It was embarrassing because he mentioned me by name.  One other time, I came around 4:30am and had a homeless guy flash me in the parking lot. That, by the way, was the last time I signed up for All Night Adoration.
    Now, I can’t do it if I wanted to and it was safe.  My health doesn’t allow and there’s nowhere to go.

    Offline donkath

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #13 on: August 25, 2019, 12:09:10 AM »
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  • Posted on another website under the heading: FSSPX Church now Islamic Centre:

    I have inside knowledge of how this all transpired and the way it has been presented is not accurate. I was the former sacristan. The church itself was originally a Polish National (schismatic) Church - the stained glass windows were from that era. The building itself is old and the chapel was faced with having to invest in restoring the brick facing and replacing the roof. One could see the outdoor light through the framing of the glass windows. When Fr. Voigt was in residence, he spent countless hours on temporary fixes of the ceiling over the choir loft where water poured in during heavy rain. The bottom-most floor was always flooded during rain as the foundational walls are badly deteriorated. The church itself had been up for sale for 2 years with a couple of interested parties but due to the poor condition of the building, it was not easy to get any bank to loan money on it for a mortgage. Finally an investment company made an offer that was acceptable and after 6 months of process, the sale was complete. There was no mention of how the building would be re-purposed by the investor or who would occupy it. When BVM moved out, they took all of the sacred objects, altars, etc with them. They even tried to take the bell but it, along with the windows, were part of the structure and hence part of the contract. BVM's plan was to build a new church on their 46 acre property in nearby Warners, the location of the Academy. In the meantime, Mass is being offered in the school chapel and occasionally on an altar (recovered by Fr. Hewko from the Auriesville Shrine) in the auditorium. To be frank, the neighborhood that the old church was in was also deteriorating. Two parishioners were threatened at knifepoint on their way into Sunday morning Mass in broad daylight. To attend all-night adoration on a First Friday evening in the summer with the windows open, one would hear the sounds that could only come from Dante's Inferno. The church had been burglarized twice, most recently last year.

    It came to BVM's attention the the Diocese of Syracuse was consolidating two nearby parishes into one. One of the two churches was St. Cecilia's Church in Solvay, NY - a magnificent old church which had not been reckovated and remained pristine with a high altar and a mobile novus ordo table that could be dragged out of site for a proper Mass. BVM considered buying this church from the Diocese and received permission from the Diocese to have some Masses said there, one on Good Shepard Sunday, one on an Anniversary, and one for a funeral. Subsequently, it was decided that St. Cecilia's would not be a viable option and that purchase plan was abandoned. There are no regularly scheduled SSPX Masses offered there.

    So, to be clear and honestly report this, the SSPX chapel did not sell their church to the Muslims (this would certainly have been rejected by the Catholic men of the parish and the clergy alike) and they are not holding Mass in a Novis Ordo temple.
    "In His wisdom," says St. Gregory, "almighty God preferred rather to bring good out of evil than never allow evil to occur."

    Offline Seraphina

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    Re: SSPX Shedding its Churches for Diocesan Temples
    « Reply #14 on: August 25, 2019, 12:18:01 AM »
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  • Donkath, thank you for clearing that up.  This is the sort of story that turns easily into gossip and then slander, even if unintended.  Such talk gives the Resistance a bad name and dishonors Our Lord.