Why do you say that?

Because Dear, you mix truth with error.

Boru,
You have an over-simplistic way of understanding Church decisions.  There are various levels and various degrees of Church authority.  Examples:

1.  Pope Pius XII declares that the Assumption of Our Lady is a dogma.
a.  In your mind, you call this a "church decision" because the pope was involved.  But that's too general of a description and incorrect.
b.  This is an infallible statement, made by a pope.  The pope is speaking in place of the Holy Ghost, protected by God, from error.
c.  This is much, much more than a simple church decision.  It's a declared doctrine, using Apostolic authority.
d.  The declaration of a dogma is irrevocable.  Unchangeable.  Set in stone.  It's an infallible decree of Divine Truth.
e.  So this would be an example of a "church decision" which cannot change.


2.  Another example, are any solemn decrees from an ecuмenical council.  (V2 didn't issue any solemn decrees, so let's not get off track there).
a.  These solemn decrees are infallible.  Unchangeable.  Divine Truth.
b.  So this would be an example of a "church decision" which cannot change.


3.  JohnPaul2's declaration which upheld the historical/consistent teaching of the Church (from Apostolic times) that only men can be priests.
a.  This teaching is called an 'ordinary and universal' teaching because a) it's never been solemnly declared, but only ordinarily declared, and b) universally held by all catholic nations, ages, centuries, etc.
b.  This teaching is part of Tradition.  It cannot be changed.

4.  The fast on Good Friday and all fridays of the year.
a.  This is of Apostolic origin.  It cannot be changed.  It came from Christ (that's what Apostolic origin means).
b.  V2 allowed meat to be eaten on non-lent fridays, but...a similar penance still must be done.
c.  The penance itself, is the substance of the "friday fast" and cannot be changed or undone.


5.  Church decision on creating a feast day for "St (fill in the blank)".
a.  This is not scriptural, nor apostolic, nor Traditional.
b.  This can be created, changed, removed, etc.

6.  Church decision to make Christmas a holy day of obligation.
a.  This is part of Apostolic Tradition.  Christmas is a holy day in every liturgy and every church around the world.
b.  This cannot be changed.
c.  This is beyond the Church's authority.

Not every "church decision" is changeable.  Your over-simplistic view is your main problem.  Your secondary problem is your defense of V2.

Boru,

You have misunderstood how Pope Eugene is using the phrase "in place of." Here is the Latin:

Loco autem illius manus impositionis in Ecclesia datur confirmatio.

Pope Eugene is simply saying that "we in the Church" don't call that Sacrament "the imposition of hands." Rather, we call it the Sacrament of "Confirmation." So the word "Confirmation" is used/given [datur] "in place of" the phrase "the imposition of hands" to refer to the Sacramental action.

Pope Eugene is not saying that Confirmation is something different from "the imposition of hands." The Sacrament certainly requires the "imposition of hands," which he describes later in that section as anointing on the forehead.

Here is the full quote:

Angelus, I concede that while I studied Latin through home-schooling, I'm definitely no scholar. That said, I do not believe I have misunderstood Pope Eugene in this instance. "Given in place of" means exactly that. Please compare the three references below:

Council of Florence:

697 "Now, when the apostles, who were in Jerusalem, had heard that the Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John. Who, when they were come, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Ghost. For He was not as yet come upon any of them: but they were only baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid their hands upon them; and they received the Holy Ghost" [Acts 8:14 ff.]. But in the Church confirmation is given in place of this imposition of hands. Nevertheless we read that at one time, by dispensation of the Apostolic See for a reasonable and urgent cause, a simple priest administered this sacrament of confirmation after the chrism had been prepared by the bishop. The effect of this sacrament, because in it the Holy Spirit is given for strength, was thus given to the Apostles on the day of Pentecost, so that the Christian might boldly confess the name of Christ. The one to be confirmed, therefore, must be anointed on the forehead, which is the seat of reverence, so that he may not be ashamed to confess the name of Christ and especially His Cross, which is indeed a "stumbling block to the Jews and unto the Gentiles foolishness" [cf.1 Cor. 1:23] according to the Apostle; for which reason one is signed with the sign of the Cross.

Summa - St. Thomas Aquinas - Confirmation

In like manner, too, when the apostles imposed their hands, and when they preached, the fulness of the Holy Ghost came down under visible signs on the faithful, just as, at the beginning, He came down on the apostles: hence Peter said (Acts 11:15): "When I had begun to speak, the Holy Ghost fell upon them, as upon us also in the beginning." Consequently there was no need for sacramental sensible matter, where God sent sensible signs miraculously.

However, the apostles commonly made use of chrism in bestowing the sacrament, when such like visible signs were lacking. For Dionysius says (Eccl. Hier. iv): "There is a certain perfecting operation which our guides," i.e. the apostles, "call the sacrifice of Chrism."


Acts 8:14-20
8:14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:

8:15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:

8:16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)

8:17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

8:18 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,

8:19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.

8:20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

Note: there is no mention of chrism or oils. It was clear to Simon that this early sacrament of Confirmation was conferred by the laying of hands and a miraculous sign - most likely a tongue of fire -came down as a visible sign.

Having read through it myself again, it is clear to me that Pope Eugene is saying that this early form of Confirmation which was conferred by the laying of hands, was replaced by the Church with the sacramental formula that involved chrism (olive oil).

Boru, you're still not distinguishing between 1) Church acts which are unchanging (i.e. faith/morals/sacraments) and 2) Church acts which She can change anytime (i.e. human govt, disciplines).

As Pius XII says in 'Mediator Dei', point 50, there are certain parts of the liturgy which are Divine, and which cannot be changed by anyone.

You cannot compare how the Church acted during the Apostolic times vs now.  The Holy Ghost was more active then, in order to work miracles to convert the world, and start the Church.  The Apostles/disciples worked signs/wonders to confirm converts that the Church was true.  Christ talked about speaking in tongues and raising people from the dead.  This was necessary in the beginning.

But really, the point is, when the Church decides something on faith/morals (not disciplinary, nor governmental, nor jurisidictional), then the decision stands.  Because in matters of faith/morals, it's not the pope deciding, it's the Holy Ghost.

You make a valid point. Yes, St. James was around the time of St. Peter. However, as I have outlined to Angelus, the earliest form of confirmation - before oils were introduced - was the laying of hands. It was the Church - the Apostles - who decided that chrism would be used as the "matter" instead.

Yes, and since the Apostles decided this, then it means it came from Christ.  Apostolic decisions are unchangeable.

Angelus, I concede that while I studied Latin through home-schooling, I'm definitely no scholar. That said, I do not believe I have misunderstood Pope Eugene in this instance. "Given in place of" means exactly that. Please compare the three references below:

Council of Florence:

697 "Now, when the apostles, who were in Jerusalem, had heard that the Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John. Who, when they were come, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Ghost. For He was not as yet come upon any of them: but they were only baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid their hands upon them; and they received the Holy Ghost" [Acts 8:14 ff.]. But in the Church confirmation is given in place of this imposition of hands. Nevertheless we read that at one time, by dispensation of the Apostolic See for a reasonable and urgent cause, a simple priest administered this sacrament of confirmation after the chrism had been prepared by the bishop. The effect of this sacrament, because in it the Holy Spirit is given for strength, was thus given to the Apostles on the day of Pentecost, so that the Christian might boldly confess the name of Christ. The one to be confirmed, therefore, must be anointed on the forehead, which is the seat of reverence, so that he may not be ashamed to confess the name of Christ and especially His Cross, which is indeed a "stumbling block to the Jews and unto the Gentiles foolishness" [cf.1 Cor. 1:23] according to the Apostle; for which reason one is signed with the sign of the Cross.

Summa - St. Thomas Aquinas - Confirmation

In like manner, too, when the apostles imposed their hands, and when they preached, the fulness of the Holy Ghost came down under visible signs on the faithful, just as, at the beginning, He came down on the apostles: hence Peter said (Acts 11:15): "When I had begun to speak, the Holy Ghost fell upon them, as upon us also in the beginning." Consequently there was no need for sacramental sensible matter, where God sent sensible signs miraculously.

However, the apostles commonly made use of chrism in bestowing the sacrament, when such like visible signs were lacking. For Dionysius says (Eccl. Hier. iv): "There is a certain perfecting operation which our guides," i.e. the apostles, "call the sacrifice of Chrism."


Acts 8:14-20
8:14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:

8:15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:

8:16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)

8:17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

8:18 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,

8:19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.

8:20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

Note: there is no mention of chrism or oils. It was clear to Simon that this early sacrament of Confirmation was conferred by the laying of hands and a miraculous sign - most likely a tongue of fire -came down as a visible sign.

Having read through it myself again, it is clear to me that Pope Eugene is saying that this early form of Confirmation which was conferred by the laying of hands, was replaced by the Church with the sacramental formula that involved chrism (olive oil).

Boru,

In the last part of the Aquinas quote (that you provided), he says the following:

However, the apostles commonly made use of chrism in bestowing the sacrament, when such like visible signs were lacking. For Dionysius says (Eccl. Hier. iv): "There is a certain perfecting operation which our guides," i.e. the apostles, "call the sacrifice of Chrism."

Aquinas, using the testimony of Dionysius, says that the use of Chrism (i.e., olive oil mixed with balsam) for the "matter" came from the Apostles themselves. That agrees with what we have been telling you. The "matter" of the Sacrament was instituted by the Apostles. Anything the Apostles did, in that regard, is considered to be infallible because it is part of Sacred Tradition. The Church cannot change that because "the Church" did not institute it. The Apostles instituted that.

I have already told you what Pope Eugene meant, so I will not go back into that in detail. Pope Eugene was speaking of a change in nomenclature, not a change in the "matter."