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Author Topic: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"  (Read 2176 times)

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Offline Plenus Venter

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Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2020, 01:07:49 AM »
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  • COMMENTARY BY NON-POSSUMUS:

    Father Gleize is a professor of theology at Ecône. He saw well the liberal drift of the SSPX and the betrayal of the Chapter of 2012, but for reasons that escape us, and probably out of admiration for Father de Jorna, he preferred not to leave this new fraternity that resulted after the Chapter of 2012. Therefore , has chosen the "correct" path in the pluralism of this new SSPX. He maintains a speech that seems to be anti-chorus, but turns out to be chorus-minded.

    He still believes in the "providential" mission of the Fraternity of Saint Pius X, although he clearly betrayed its founder in 2012. He firmly believes in it and therefore cannot imagine another practical solution to the crisis of the Church and especially drifting from Rome.

    Now it happens that a bishop (Monsignor Viganò) appears who has the merit of fulfilling what is the main function of a bishop: TEACHING THE TRUTH .

    And there you have our Father Gleize, all bewildered at the idea that his position might not be the correct one in practice.

    Then Bishop Viganò becomes, in the eyes of this "great" theologian, someone  INGENUOUS, THE YOUNGEST OF THE FAMILY, VERY ZEALOUS NEOPHITE, HARDER THAN US .... and finally STERILE .

    In addition, Father Gleize believes that he remains in the truth even though he himself justified the excesses of Bishop Fellay in 2013 in an important article published in all the official sites of the Fraternity. He also thinks that the most effective action continues while the neo-Fraternity is left with only smoking diplomacy and the abandonment of its founding principles.

    Offline Mr G

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #16 on: October 30, 2020, 01:09:45 PM »
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  • "These are voices that are welcome in the Church, but they are only words of people who are on the sidelines. That's very good, but I'm afraid it's sterile." so says Fr. Gleize.

    Yet who is the one that just wrote to President Trump, warning him about the NWO agenda to control the world, who is the one alerting all who would listen about the dangers of the "Great Reset"?  It ain't the SSPX!!  it should be clear by now that it is the SSXP that has become sterile. 


    Offline forlorn

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #17 on: October 30, 2020, 05:11:47 PM »
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  • "These are voices that are welcome in the Church, but they are only words of people who are on the sidelines. That's very good, but I'm afraid it's sterile." so says Fr. Gleize.

    Yet who is the one that just wrote to President Trump, warning him about the NWO agenda to control the world, who is the one alerting all who would listen about the dangers of the "Great Reset"?  It ain't the SSPX!!  it should be clear by now that it is the SSXP that has become sterile.
    It's good and all, but I still wish he'd put his words to action on Francis. Or at least clearly state what his position is(he seems to think V2 may be illegitimate, but hasn't explained how to determine if an EC is illegitimate; he encourages people to go to the Tridentine Mass, but hasn't condemned the NO Mass; he's said nothing about his own holy orders, etc.).

    Offline songbird

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #18 on: October 30, 2020, 09:04:01 PM »
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  • Well, here is my idea.  First it is true that all that Vigano says about the demonic destruction that has taken place and still does, is not new news.  

    Next,  the New Order of Catholic Charities made a DVD (?) about Alinsky and programs inside giving to abortion and perverts, the new order solution was, "we are working on it".  Oh, they might take one or 2 programs out, BUT it isn't even the tip of the iceberg.

    This is my thoughts, I think the talks and the DVD are ways of keeping the people in new order.  (you don't have to leave, stay and we will take care of things)

    This is an old scheme used on the Acadians catholics in the mid 1600's in Nova Scotia.  Brits came to tell the Acadians that King George was in control of the area, BUT, it's ok, we won't hurt you.  Just give us a roof over our heads and food on our table and you can practice your faith.  While that happened ships were being made in Britain for the catholics. It took 50 years.  The ships came and brits loaded the women and children while the men were in the fields.  The catholics were dumped along the Atlantic coast to protestants who hated catholics.  Blankets on the ships were given to the Acadians and the blankets had small pox on them.  Those that died on the ships were tossed out in the ocean.

    So, that is my idea.  Viagano can point the people to Indult, but they remain New Order.

    So, my question still remains, what Mass is Viagano pointing the people too?  I read Tridentine, but is that indult?  my thinking is it is not pointing people to SSPX.

    It also comes to mind that Pope Pius XII was asked to do the consecration of Russia.  Correct me if I am wrong, but did he not "try" twice?  And is it correct that Sr. Lucia was told, from Our Lady, that Pope Pius XII did in in "half measure".  In volume 4 of the Mystical Body of Christ, Our Lady says that God is not pleased with those who do things in half measure. 

    Offline donkath

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #19 on: October 31, 2020, 03:16:45 AM »
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  • It's good and all, but I still wish he'd put his words to action on Francis. Or at least clearly state what his position is(he seems to think V2 may be illegitimate, but hasn't explained how to determine if an EC is illegitimate; he encourages people to go to the Tridentine Mass, but hasn't condemned the NO Mass; he's said nothing about his own holy orders, etc.).
    I used to think the same thing.   Bishop Williamson was crucified (with a lot of help from me I am sad to say) for advising if it was the only way a Catholic can keep her faith then he could not advise her to leave. The NO is a doubtfully valid rite, but apparently licit.    I can see that perhaps Cardinal Vigano is trying to bring such as the above woman out gradually - and not put out the flickering flame.  Priests have experienced new-generation Catholics of goodwill abanding the faith altogether.  They have to be gradually and gently led out.
    "In His wisdom," says St. Gregory, "almighty God preferred rather to bring good out of evil than never allow evil to occur."


    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #20 on: October 31, 2020, 04:40:31 AM »
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  • It's good and all, but I still wish he'd put his words to action on Francis. Or at least clearly state what his position is(he seems to think V2 may be illegitimate, but hasn't explained how to determine if an EC is illegitimate; he encourages people to go to the Tridentine Mass, but hasn't condemned the NO Mass; he's said nothing about his own holy orders, etc.).

    Now, consider the good Bishop is a "Catholic pundit" in hiding.

    In this context why can he not mention the word "Jews"?  

    Its it not in his vocabulary.  Is it politically incorrect?  

    Would it offend president Trump's son-in-law, the Israeli rabbi who works in the Oval Office?  

    Let's get real Bishop Vigano.    You're talking about the life & death of nations, billions of souls at stake and yet the word "jew" will not cross your keyboard?
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #21 on: October 31, 2020, 07:28:22 AM »
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  • Now, consider the good Bishop is a "Catholic pundit" in hiding.

    In this context why can he not mention the word "Jews"?  

    Its it not in his vocabulary.  Is it politically incorrect?  

    Would it offend president Trump's son-in-law, the Israeli rabbi who works in the Oval Office?  

    Let's get real Bishop Vigano.    You're talking about the life & death of nations, billions of souls at stake and yet the word "jew" will not cross your keyboard?
    Actually, as we have discussed months ago, he has written a rabbi where he chooses to omit faith in Jesus Christ:
    https://www.marcotosatti.com/2020/05/27/vigano-a-rabbi-ahrens-pericoli-reali-non-complottismo/

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #22 on: October 31, 2020, 07:56:32 AM »
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  • Picture a few men helping drowning people out of the sea.
    One is right by the rescuing boat, helping survivors the last few feet into the boat
    one is halfway between the boat and the sea
    one is actually swimming in the sea, getting each survivor's rescue process started.

    For the person drowning in the sea, the guy right before the boat -- and the 4th guy INSIDE the boat, handing out towels and other first aid -- basically doesn't exist. Completely not on their radar. 

    It's not that Trads should lower themselves to "meet people where they are", but in reality there are in fact plenty of people who are legitimately "further down the ladder of truth" who won't/can't come all the way up yet, and so they are left (by Providence) to get things rolling for those who are increasing levels of lost.
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    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #23 on: October 31, 2020, 11:01:38 AM »
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  • Actually, as we have discussed months ago, he has written a rabbi where he chooses to omit faith in Jesus Christ:
    https://www.marcotosatti.com/2020/05/27/vigano-a-rabbi-ahrens-pericoli-reali-non-complottismo/

    Thanks for reiterating this point.

    The unabashed defense of Jesus Christ is our key reference for discerning a true Catholic leader.

    If the Bishop is afraid to say “Jesus Christ” to the rabbi 

    OR 

    To publicly acknowledge that the jews are heavily involved in the
    impending economic & social disasters...

     how can we trust him?

    He strikes me as being just another Opus judei media actor.
    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline Incredulous

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #24 on: October 31, 2020, 02:34:48 PM »
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  • Here's Bp. Vigano's rabbi letter translated:


    Dear Rabbi,


    Since I have been called into question for my Appeal For the Church and For the World, I have asked Katolisch for its hospitality so that I may respond to you.


    I must tell you, Doctor Ahrens, that your words amaze me greatly when you say: “We have known for some time that there are people within the churches who adhere to such theories. But now they have the courage to express these opinions even more openly.” I think that each of us have the duty to express our concern about a situation that, profiting from the Covid crisis, goes far beyond reasonable security measures, imposing on entire nations the deprivation of constitutional liberties: perhaps this has not happened in Germany, but it has certainly been verified in other nations.


    I ask you, Rabbi: in your opinion, is it still permitted to express oneself freely, or are there certain topics that may not be discussed civilly? If you can express your dissent against the content of the Appeal, why should “people within the churches”not have the right to express themselves freely? Why do you think that in order to do this one needs to “have courage” as if we were talking about rantings that are not offering real feedback?


    To dismiss these concerns – which moreover have been expressed by authoritative personalities – as “conspiracy theories”does not seem to me to be a constructive attitude: above all if one does not address the merit of the argument, refuting what one believes is not true. I ask you therefore: what specific thing in the text of the appeal are you not in agreement with? What in the Appeal represents a “shock” for you?


    Believe me: I would have never thought that the Appeal could offend you; on the other hand, why should a Rabbi feel called into question when there is talk of the nєω ωσrℓ∂ σr∂єr? The Messiah whom Israel waits for is Rex pacificus, Princeps pacis, Pater futuri saeculi: not a tyrant without morals who dominates the world by subjecting men as slaves. This is rather the Antichrist.


    We come now to the spiritual value of Covid. In the Old Testament there are many examples of punishment sent by God on the Chosen People, and the Prophets admonish the Hebrews many times to abandon their idolatry, to not be contaminated by the pagans, to remain faithful to the One True God. I recall the words of the Prophet Jeremiah, after the Babylonian troops set fire to Jerusalem in 585 B.C.: “Her adversaries have come out on top, her enemies prosper; because the Lord has afflicted her for her innumerable sins” (Lam 1:5).


    This vision, which the Church of Christ shares, shows a God who is both just and merciful, who rewards the good and punishes evildoers; who as a loving Father also punishes his disobedient children, to bring them back to follow his holy Law. For this reason “transforming the negative into the positive, transforming a curse into a blessing” is obtained by the recognition of having committed a sin, of having violated the covenant with God, of having merited his punishments. Thus even the epidemic becomes a time to turn to the Lord, to adore Him in His holy temple, to follow His precepts.


    There was a time when, with the obedience of the masses, an infernal dictatorship stained itself with a most serious crime, making itself responsible for the deportation and death of millions of innocent people, only because of their faith and their ancestry. Even then the mainstream media praised those in power and were silent about their crimes; even then doctors and scientists lent their work to a delusional plan of domination; even then whoever dared to raise his voice was accused of “conspiracy theories.” It was not until the end of the Second World War that the truth was discovered with horror that many had been silent about until then.


    I am sure that those who today are delegitimizing the Appeal as an expression of “conspiracy” do not recognize the real dangers that the entire human family is exposed to. But I am sure that both Catholics and all men of good will – and among then I am confident that I can also count the children of Abraham – have at heart the greater glory of God, respect for the dignity of individuals, and the freedoms of peoples. Blessed are the people who God is the Lord (Ps 143:15).


    + Carlo Maria Vigano

    Archbishop, Apostolic Nuncio

    May 22, 2020


    The Ascension of Our Lord Jesus Christ


    "Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it underfoot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Our Lord Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor but a destroyer."  St. Francis of Assisi

    Offline LeDeg

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #25 on: October 31, 2020, 05:18:31 PM »
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  • From Vigano's letter to Trump.

    Look at this statement of his:

    "As is now clear, the one who occupies the Chair of Peter has betrayed his role from the very beginning in order to defend and promote the globalist ideology, supporting the agenda of the deep church, who chose him from its ranks."


    What would Fr Gleize say to that? Draw the conclusion from +Vigano's language. 
    "You must train harder than the enemy who is trying to kill you. You will get all the rest you need in the grave."- Leon Degrelle


    Offline Prayerful

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #26 on: October 31, 2020, 07:54:08 PM »
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  • The SSPX in Ireland, the District of Ireland, outdo the diocesan Conciliar Church in the strictness of the lockdown with chapels open for limited hours and people encouraged to stay for no more than fifteen minutes. It has to be mentioned the closure is health advice that the District has elected to follow. The only priests I know who try offer public Masses, well discreetly, are SSPX Resistance. Abp Vigano has shown extraordinary and generous courage, instead of SSPX cunning and calculation. The impact will remain limited unless the McCarrick report is somehow leaked. This would bring the entire corrupt edifice of the Barron hell is empty Conciliar catamite church crashing down.

    Offline klasG4e

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    Re: Fr. Gleize Calls ++Vigano "Overzealous Neophyte"
    « Reply #27 on: October 31, 2020, 08:05:05 PM »
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  • What followed as an absolutely direct consequence of the infamous SS planned, executed, and covered up 9-11 fαℓѕє fℓαg was the seemingly incalculable death and destruction of countless innocent lives in the Middle East.  And yet as far as I know Bp. Williamson, aside from any of his faults, was the only Catholic bishop on the face of the Earth who spoke up loudly and clearly in pointing to the SS as the extremely wicked perpetrator of 9-11.  if the Catholic Church from the top down pointed out the wicked scam of 9-11 for what it was countless innocent lives could have been saved, but alas it was not to be.  Even to this day their silence is deafening.  It just goes to show you who they are beholden to.

    By contrast we have the Vatican's Cardinal Sarah immediately issuing a statement after 3 people were killed by an alleged Muslim in Nice:“Islamism is a monstrous fanaticism which must be fought with force and determination.”  And yet even after millions have been killed in the Middle East as a direct result of the U.S. government's being joined at the hip to Zionism we never hear a prelate openly condemning Zionism, let alone тαℓмυdic Judaism from whence this Zionism spawned.