Catholic Info

Traditional Catholic Faith => SSPX Resistance News => Topic started by: Marlelar on December 08, 2015, 09:01:49 AM

Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Marlelar on December 08, 2015, 09:01:49 AM
It is currently 4 pm in Menzingen.  Where is the much anticipated announcement?
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: TKGS on December 08, 2015, 10:18:31 AM
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Matthew on December 08, 2015, 10:20:51 AM
Patricius?
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Maria Auxiliadora on December 08, 2015, 11:16:51 AM
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.


I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.

Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: covet truth on December 08, 2015, 11:17:16 AM
I expect when it happens any announcement will come from the Vatican.
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Marlelar on December 08, 2015, 11:26:48 AM
Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.


I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.



I too think they are looking for a deal with Rome, I just get extremely irritated by rumor mongers.  I will not be surprised if/when a deal is made, just very,very, disappointed.
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: TKGS on December 08, 2015, 11:55:11 AM
Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.


I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.


So, are you saying that you believe that there was every intention on the part of the SSPX to make the reconciliation announcement on December 8th, but the rumor appearing on CathInfo (which is the only place I saw it) made them reconsider making the announcement today?
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Pilar on December 08, 2015, 12:26:05 PM
Quote from: TKGS
Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.


I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.


So, are you saying that you believe that there was every intention on the part of the SSPX to make the reconciliation announcement on December 8th, but the rumor appearing on CathInfo (which is the only place I saw it) made them reconsider making the announcement today?


Good point. Does anyone here consider the real possibility that if reconciliation is not God's will it is Our Lady that is preventing this mistake? Are we all not praying for the Society...with confidence?
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: CWA on December 08, 2015, 01:04:42 PM
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.

Quote from: Pilar
Good point. Does anyone here consider the real possibility that if reconciliation is not God's will it is Our Lady that is preventing this mistake? Are we all not praying for the Society...with confidence?


Yes, good point Pilar.  

If people will notice, what Patricius vouched for in his "not a rumor" thread was that both priests (the N.O. priest who heard it from Bp. S, and the Resistance priest to whom he relayed it) are trustworthy and serious.  But he also allowed for the possibility (see bold below:)

Quote from: Patricius
But, as I said before, I know these two priests very well, and I can assure you that what I presented last Thursday are true facts. Bishop Schneider said these things as being true facts. But I cannot, of course, guarantee that what he said will happen. Maybe bishop Schneider has been misled, or has been trying to mislead us (he had to know a leak was bound to happen...). I cannot say. Or something happened between July and now which the bishop is not aware of. Once again, I cannot say.

I just thought I would reveal this to the cathInfo people, and ask for prayers for the Society. That is all there is to it.


And lastly, as with any "rumor" of this type, the fact that it doesn't materialize doesn't mean the facts relayed weren't true, but could mean that prayers were answered.  And if anyone took note, in his OP, Patricius asked for prayers, essentially asking that it not come to fruition:

Quote from: Patricius
Now, it is possible that a last minute glitch (our prayers?) will scrap the July agreement before it is publicized on Dec. 8th. But Bishop Schneider really said these things at a diocesan priests meeting, and he was not making a supposition or spreading a rumor. He was speaking from first hand knowledge....
Let us pray for a glitch to come, like in June 2012. We do not want the death of the Society.


I can just imagine if some people today were living in Nineve, and Jonas cried: "Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed."  And the Ninevites put on sackcloth and ashes, and the city is not destroyed, and some Ninevites get on the internet and say, "ah, this was just another rumor!"  

Not saying they are exact parallels, but just pointing out that no "agreement" today is in no way proof that anything Patricius said was untrue; it may just be that plans changed, or Bp. S was wrong, or many possibilities.  
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: HiddenServant on December 08, 2015, 01:05:09 PM
  We need to be steadfast and strong in our faith,
Pray that those in need and weakened convert ,
pray that we do not fall in to temptation and keep
the true faith daily with our Holy Roaary and Brown
Scapular.  The light is dimming we have to hold out,
or many will perish in a horrible way.
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: clarkaim on December 08, 2015, 01:54:31 PM


I can just imagine if some people today were living in Nineve, and Jonas cried: "Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed."  And the Ninevites put on sackcloth and ashes, and the city is not destroyed, and some Ninevites get on the internet and say, "ah, this was just another rumor!"  


I saw that thread onj another board, what is up in Nineveh I wonder?



I'm joking, in case any goofs think I'm serious.  
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Maria Auxiliadora on December 08, 2015, 02:48:02 PM
Quote from: TKGS
Quote from: Marie Auxiliadora
Quote from: TKGS
Apparently, it was merely a rumor after all.


I don't think so. +Fellay and company are not men of conscience. Their hearts are clearly and openly in Rome but every time the cat gets out of the bag, they back off. They have become reeds shaken with the wind.


So, are you saying that you believe that there was every intention on the part of the SSPX to make the reconciliation announcement on December 8th, but the rumor appearing on CathInfo (which is the only place I saw it) made them reconsider making the announcement today?


Maybe(?) Could also have been postponed by the plane interview and the latest insult to “fundamentalist” Catholics who believe in “absolute Truth” by Francis. That should have been a clear warning to the SSPX. Unfortunately, I don’t think that would stop the SSPX plans, only delay them. It’s unbelievable that with all the scandalous interviews and statements by Francis they are still eager to go to Rome and put themselves under their authority. We know they want that from their own mouth (Fr. Wegner, Pflugger, etc.) So, it's a matter of time.



Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Stubborn on December 08, 2015, 03:17:30 PM
So it didn't or it won't happen today for whatever reason - the SSPX is still on the same path it's been on so it's just a matter of when. There is still hope they will wake up - that's the way I look at it.
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: StonewallCatho on December 08, 2015, 05:54:50 PM
Quote from: CWA
   

And lastly, as with any "rumor" of this type, the fact that it doesn't materialize doesn't mean the facts relayed weren't true, but could mean that prayers were answered.  And if anyone took note, in his OP, Patricius asked for prayers, essentially asking that it not come to fruition:

Quote from: Patricius
Now, it is possible that a last minute glitch (our prayers?) will scrap the July agreement before it is publicized on Dec. 8th. But Bishop Schneider really said these things at a diocesan priests meeting, and he was not making a supposition or spreading a rumor. He was speaking from first hand knowledge....
Let us pray for a glitch to come, like in June 2012. We do not want the death of the Society.


I can just imagine if some people today were living in Nineve, and Jonas cried: "Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed."  And the Ninevites put on sackcloth and ashes, and the city is not destroyed, and some Ninevites get on the internet and say, "ah, this was just another rumor!"  

Not saying they are exact parallels, but just pointing out that no "agreement" today is in no way proof that anything Patricius said was untrue; it may just be that plans changed, or Bp. S was wrong, or many possibilities.  


I agree with you, CWA. Thank you for clarifying things.

I can see you have carefully read what I wrote. This becomes rarer and rarer by the day, because of the avalanche of news in all forms. People nowadays tend to read only the headlines.

So there was no announcement today. It doesn't mean that the July 2015 deal was not signed. It might just mean the powers that be decided to wait longer before to make it public, and they didn't tell Bishop Schneider. Maybe our prayers were successful and the deal was scrapped or is back to the drawing board. Maybe Bishop Schneider's revelation to the priests was meant to be a "feeler", to see what would be the reactions. Only God knows...

By the way, this bishop also told the priests that all the bishops and cardinals who visited the SSPX seminaries have been favorably impressed, and have given laudatory reports to the Pope. And remember that the bishop said that the Pope and Bishop Fellay accepted to sign in July, on the basis that both recognized that not all VII docuмents have the same doctrinal value, and that there was therefore room to discuss "problems" after an official recognition. Now, for those who follow what happens out there, you will recognize that this assertion corresponds perfectly to what Menzingen has said many times and also to Francis' "pragmatic" attitude, as opposed to BVI's more doctrinal bend.

God bless.
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Matthew on December 08, 2015, 07:27:06 PM
Someone wrote in, with some good thoughts on this matter:

Quote
Imagine if Jonas were alive today, or the internet existed back then.  And he posted on CI, ""Yet forty days, and Ninive shall be destroyed." And then people did penance, and it wasn't destroyed.  Not only would some cry "another unfounded rumor!", but one could ask, was it a good idea to post the prediction online?  Well, yes, if it was the vehicle of communication to spur people on to pray.  Or, to show the powers that be in the Vatican & Menzingen that people are still paying attention and it matters to many.  


So why do we have this rumors-of-a-deal-but-then-no-deal cycle for many years now?

- Something changed in the plans after Bp. S told his priests this info
- There was poor communication between parties (Novus Ordo, SSPX etc) which led to Bp. S's info being inaccurate
- "Rumors" of this type are put out deliberately by the factions trying to make the deal happen, to float as a way to 'test the waters'  - they look at the reaction among the Faithful and priests, to gauge whether to go ahead with the deal
(not saying Patricius did this, but in this case Bp. S puts it out, knowing it will leak, etc.)
- This is all part of a psy-ops plan by the Vatican and Menzingen for many years now, to get people fixated on "deal" vs. "no deal", and while we all have our eyes on the "deal/no deal" ball, we don't notice the SSPX going liberal all the while, making the formal deal less important (because the SSPX has already been neutralized - the chief downside of such a "deal")


I would like to add -- by releasing a "rumor" like this and making sure it doesn't come true, it takes away from the credibility of various sources (patricius, Bishop Schneider, CathInfo, etc.) and it becomes "the boy who cried wolf".
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: Matthew on December 08, 2015, 07:32:02 PM
By the way, who here has actually read the entire BOOK of Jonas the prophet?

Chapter 4 is short but very interesting:

Jonas, repining to see that his prophecy is not fulfilled, is reproved by the type of the ivy.

[1] And Jonas was exceedingly troubled, and was angry: [2] And he prayed to the Lord, and said: I beseech thee, O Lord, is not this what I said, when I was yet in my own country? therefore I went before to flee into Tharsis: for I know that thou art a gracious and merciful God, patient, and of much compassion, and easy to forgive evil. [3] And now, O Lord, I beseech thee take my life from me: for it is better for me to die than to live. [4] And the Lord said: Dost thou think thou hast reason to be angry? [5] Then Jonas went out of the city, and sat toward the east side of the city: and he made himself a booth there, and he sat under it in the shadow, till he might see what would befall the city.

[1] Was exceedingly troubled: His concern was lest he should pass for a false prophet; or rather, lest God's word, by this occasion, might come to be slighted and disbelieved.

[6] And the Lord God prepared an ivy, and it came up over the head of Jonas, to be a shadow over his head, and to cover him (for he was fatigued), and Jonas was exceeding glad of the ivy. [7] But God prepared a worm, when the morning arose on the following day: and it struck the ivy and it withered. [8] And when the sun was risen, the Lord commanded a hot and burning wind: and the sun beat upon the head of Jonas, and he broiled with the heat: and he desired for his soul that he might die, and said: It is better for me to die than to live. [9] And the Lord said to Jonas: Dost thou think thou hast reason to be angry, for the ivy? And he said: I am angry with reason even unto death. [10] And the Lord said: Thou art grieved for the ivy, for which thou hast not laboured, nor made it to grow, which in one night came up, and in one night perished.
[11] And shall not I spare Ninive, that great city, in which there are more than a hundred and twenty thousand persons that know not how to distinguish between their right hand and their left, and many beasts?

So this is how God dealt with Ninive back then. The God Who doesn't change, I might point out.

Why wouldn't He equally have compassion on the tens of thousands of Catholics taking refuge in the SSPX lifeboat at the present moment?

I (and others of us) might be tempted to feel a bit like Jonah today, but I must say that if good is done for souls and the Church by sacrificing my credibility -- then I accept it. Scripture was written for our edification and instruction, and "Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ" -- St. Jerome.
Title: SSPX announcement?
Post by: PAT317 on December 08, 2015, 08:11:15 PM
Quote from: Matthew
By the way, who here has actually read the entire BOOK of Jonas the prophet?


You could have also highlighted this one:

[1] Was exceedingly troubled: His concern was lest he should pass for a false prophet; or rather, lest God's word, by this occasion, might come to be slighted and disbelieved.